Anyone's DC passed out while crying before?

[circlesquare]

DS (19 months) hates getting into the car in the morning and cries with great gusto when we put him in. This morning, he passed out - he was limp and his eyes closed, and it lasted for a minute or so before he came round again. I didn't have the composure to check whether he was breathing or not. It happened about six weeks ago at his nursery, too - the poor assistant who was with him said he did stop breathing and was a nervous wreck afterwards and now I can see why.

Has anyone else had any experience of this? DH's sister used to do it, apparently. But I don't like it at all.

My DD does it occasionally, all you can do is wait it out. Sometimes I find blowing on her face helps to restart the breathing process.

DH was a breath holder according to MIL so I blame him entirely for this

Sounds like it might be reflex anoxic seizures? They're scary to witness but harmless, if so

You need to take him to the GP and get him checked out. It sounds similar to something my dd1 does - it's called reflex anoxic seizures - and are harmless. There is a website here.

My dd1 has stopped breathing a couple of times whencrying a lot; another five times she has stopped breathing and had a seizure after banging her head or falling off a chair or something. It's not harmful in itself, but it's a good idea to know some basic first aid.

Obviously you need to speak to a GP about this, my dd1 had some tests at the hospital which confirmed that there is nothing wrong with her.

Thanks all. The reflexive anoxic seizures explanation sounds likely. It's happened so far once when crying and once after falling over, which makes sense.

Will get him along to the GP and checked out.

Hi, ds did this and its scary as hell, especially when he fitted with it. Sometimes he was passing out twice a day if he was tired. I did a lot of research on the internet, as the gp seemed unconcerned. There is a lot of research pointing to low iron levels. I had to really push for a serum ferritin test, the doctor thought i was a mad woman. Low and behold ds's levels were half what they should have been and after 6 months on iron supplement, he hasn't had another one. Ask for am iron test when you see the gp.

Thank you - that's a good tip. I'll ask about iron.

Talking about unconcerned, DH is mildly surprised that I want to take DS to GP at all - he's so used to his sister having done it as a baby.

it might not be the answer, but i got really fed up with it, we were having to pussy foot round ds, so that we didnt upset him. which is no easy task, as you know.

ds started with just one or 2 a week or so apart, but then they started to get more frequent. he seemed to be tired a lot too, and a great sleeper.

one day he was playing in the front of my car and i took him out. he went into one. i was blowing on his face and trying to get him to breathe. it went on for aged, he started to convulse,went red, then white, salivating and juddering and very very scary,i lay him down and called for an ambulance, then he stopped moving altogether and i thought he'd died. i was beside myself, screaming at him to wake up, then the woman on the phone calmed me down,and i was trying to explain to her what was happening, then he started crying. i was so releived. he was subdued after, but by the time i'd got him to the hospital he was mr normal!

That sounds frankly terrifying. I can't imagine how you're supposed to know at that point that it's just a harmless seizure. DS is so sure of his own mind at the moment that trying not to upset him just wouldn't be possible!

What age did your DS start with this?

about 14 months i think, we didn't get a paed appt til after his hospital visit, he was about 18months when we started the iron.

OMG ClareVoiant! That sounds horrendous, what you went through.

My ds started doing this when he was about 18 months. First time was after a small bump to the head and he started crying and then passed out. I was so scared I dialled 999 because I thought he'd suffered a major head injury. He was also fine by the time the ambulance came but they took us to the hospital to have him checked out.

Luckily he hasn't done it more than a handful of times a year and seems to be growing out of it - he's now 6. I found blowing in his face helps.

i know now that he wouldnt come to any harm, the paed said that i should only be concerned if he convulsed for more than 5 mins . i really had to push hard for the iron test, as they kept dismissing it as a normal thing that 'happens sometimes'. as soon as you mention you've looked it up on the internet to them they glaze over. i think he was suprised at the results of the test.

My dd1 would convulse for three -four minutes, but sometimes remain with a lowered level of conciousness for the best part of an hour. It was always very scarey, and we rushed her to hopsital a couple of times

It's not dangerous in itself, but certain situations could mean that it is dangerous - for example if it happens in the bath or swimming pool (risk of drowning) or if there is food in the child's mouth (risk of choking).

DH's response when I told him this morning was "Oh, did you blow in his face?", so that must be the wisdom...

It sounds like our experience this morning was very mild compared to what some of you have gone through. I was still very slightly apprehensive this evening when DS started to wail on getting out of the bath, though!

Belgo, has your dd stopped now? Circlesquare, will look for a link for the study i read about. After ds had started on his iron, i was watching the baby channel. They had a q&a with a doctor and someone had emailed about the breath holding. The doctor on the telly also said about being tested for iron levels and also epilepsy, so i guess some of them are aware. In any event i would go with your gut instinct and get him checked out.

DS used to do this, from about 18 months to about 2 yrs old. I hadn't heard of it happening before so it was very scary the first time. Of course, then I mentioned it to some other mums I knew and apparently it isn't that uncommon. Phew.
When I could see he was heading that way I'd try and distract him with something shocking - like "wow, look there's noddy looking in the window" or "look quick there's a horse behind you" etc - just to interrupt the escalation. It usually helped, although I couldn't use the same shocker more than once as he started sussing me out!

Thanks, ClareVoiant, that would be great. Distraction always a good idea - a new one every time is certainly going to stretch the imagination!

Clare - my dd1 was clear for two years, then two months ago she had a seizure when she fell off the bed. She's four and a half now, and didn't remember anything about what happened. The other six RAS attacks she had all happened between the ages of 10 months and two years.

hi circlesquare

links are here and here and here and here

hope it helps.

That's interesting Clare. When my dd1 had her first 'big' seizure, (following a couple of smaller ones), we rushed her to hospital where she was admitted for two days. They took blood from her , and all tests came back normal, so I assume she had normal levels of iron. She was 12 months old at the time. She also had an ECG and an EEG, all normal as well -they did a lot of tests because we live in Belgium and they are very thorough here.

Also, when she was born, they said she had a low heart rate, and she had an echo cardiogram at just one day of age - and that came back normal - but I wonder if it was related in any way to the RAS attacks.

For all the tests she's had, she's an incredibly healthy little girl.

Yesterday she had a very nasty knock which gave her a nose bleed, she panicked, but she didn't pass out, when previously she would have done. So I think she's grown out of the worst of them.

Thanks, Clare. They're really useful. It does seem as though an iron check would be appropriate.

hi belgo, there was another study about heart rates and stuff, but you had to pay to access it. So it could be related. I know iron deficiency anaemia (sp?) does play a part in it, but as shown in these studies its not always the case. there was another study too, that suggested if parents were anaemic that children may be affected. I googled 'iron deficiency and breath holding spells'

I've found the whole subject really rather interesting. There was also a tenuous connection between iron defiecincy and adhd (my nephew has adhd).

I'm glad your dd has grown out of them now. The belgian doctors sound very thorough.

I think the worst thing (apart form the fear of whats happening to your child) is the fact that they are so completely normal afterwards that you feel almost fraudulent when you try to air your concerns with the dr or paed.

ds had one other seizure just before his 2nd birthday, but i put that down to a fever fit as he had had a very high temperature for a few days. after a night in hospital (on the first night of our holidays) and loads of tests, they couldn't find anything wrong with him, and in fact he was completely better, with not even a temperature, when he left the next day. we've not had one since, thankfully