What were your reasons for not vaccinating your child?

[Londonmamma]

I don't think we've done this for a while and I like to keep up to date on the vaccination issue so - fire away!

Both my children have had their MMR jabs.
DS2 reacted very badly to it, and developed severe autistic traits triggered by allergies within days.
I vaccinated because I thought it was best for my children and best for society.
I was wrong.

hills I don't know what to say to that

I think its really irresponsbile to suggest that a kid is likely to get the autism as a result of the MMR

Becuase of scaremongering like this, the rates of measles are rising and more kids are dying and being permenantly disabled

yes its disproportionately poor kids, and those who eat bad food and have generally poorer health. So what? don't we owe a responsiblity to them?

And I'll tell you what-you don't want one of your kids to spend a lifetime with partial sight. its a real nightmare. Eg I can't wear contacts, because if i lost the sight in my good eye through infection i'd be registered blind. I have some problems judging distance. Its not harmless.

ok hc x post

I do hate these threads, really. I'm off.

Fillyjonk - with respect, you would not vaccinate your child if you believed it would damage them would you? I don't believe anyone here would put other people above the welfare of their own child. Talk about "social responsibility" all you want -it's just how it is for any parent.

As I said earlier, people who vaccinate assume their child won't be damaged. They are assuming that some children are damaged but it won't happen to them. Some of us don't assume this.

Until there is evidence of a safer vaccination schedule, and that vaccines are safe in the long and short term, then imo people do have a right to act upon that view.

It's called "evolution in action".
There is a widespread right wing myth that because human societies protect people from folly that we are breeding for stupidity, not intelligence.
It's not as simple as that.
If you define "intelligence" as the ability to make decisions that pass on your genes well, then MMR is a filter that causes stupid people to have fewer children who will breed.
Almost all decisions involving risk are between more and less, not more and zero risk.
The parents who failed to understand the very low risk of MMR are more likely to lose children, or have them in a state where their genes are unlikely to make it to the next generation.
Most cot deaths occur in homes where there is a smoker, homoeopathy doesn't and can't cure anything, and since small children have no influence upon their medication parents who've been fooled by the manufacturers of homoeopathic medicine are more likely to die.Christian scientists, Jehovah's witnesses and other religions have similar effects by denying kids medical treatment.

Killing or seriously damaging your kids through stupidity is of course a powerful way of improving the gene pool.

Humans have evolved strong protective instincts for their children, hence those who've been dumb enough to apply homoeopathy and other quackery get very emotional when it's pointed out to them.

Fillyjonk - also appreciate your pov about your loss of sight. We all form views based on our experiences. Autism (especially severe) makes life very difficult for a whole family to live anything like a normal life though.

"Killing or seriously damaging your kids through stupidity is of course a powerful way of improving the gene pool.

Humans have evolved strong protective instincts for their children, hence those who've been dumb enough to apply homoeopathy and other quackery get very emotional when it's pointed out to them".

But the damage to my child occurred because I had made the so-called 'intelligent' decision to allow my child to be vaccinated.

Smugness is so comfortable to wallow in when your child hasn't been harmed.

Is that supposed to pass for intelligent debate dominiconnor?

DominiConner you have it summed up dont you

Obviously I have not outweighed the situation, or researched it in any way just put my children and my life on the line because I'm so stupid.

Let us all stop and think for a minute, and imagine that the anti-immunisation lobby is sucessful, and over the coming years immunisation levels fall dramaticly in the UK. Be honest with yourselves - would you really want this to happen?

Some people are happy ot to have their kids jabbed, because most of us do. I agree with Filly - we all have a social responsibility to each other, and especially to those who cannot be immunised.

If mothers in India could read this thread - well

DC you have added nothing to this discussion.

I think it would be more helpful to lobby the government to develop vaccines that are less likely to cause problems in susceptible children.

DC..that was a disgusting post

I agree HC. Obviously vaccines can and should be improved.

DC is obviously the stupid one who just believes everything he/she has been told, doesnt have a mind for ones self, If you open your eyes you will see the bigger picture.

oh dc has come in - please lets not get into the subgroup MMR thing again

Vaccine damage isn't just about autism. It's often about thing slike epilepsy and severe learning difficulties. Sometimes profound and multiple learning difficulties. The payouts that have been made have generally been made to children left with profound and multiple difficulties.

One thing doesn't cause autism, whether it's vaccination, gluten or a high heritability. Autism may have been triggered by MMR in some children, but that doesn't mean that all autism is caused by MMR. Autism isn't even one condition. It's a group of conditions, with different causes and triggers. So talking about "x causing autism" as if autism is one big whole entitiy is nonsensical.

Most of the people that I know who had decided not to vaccinate have come to that decision because they feel they have no other choice, because of things that have happened to their other children or family members. They (like everyone else presumably) just want their children to grow up and live a life of their choosing.

oh ffs DC

that sort of post just gets the pro-vaccination lobby a bad name

you are right about risks, its all a risk

but coming out with crap about stupid people killing their kids. its not helpful

Astrophe - you wouldn't be happy to if you knew it would cause damage would you?

It's unacceptable that we have to assume our children won't be damaged and have them vaccinated to protect other people. Especially when we have to make the decision on their behalf.

Don't worry about DC I've repeatedly explained to him in exceedingly simple terms that he's misunderstanding Wakefield's argument and he has yet to understand that. He doesn;t even understand what he's arguing against.

i guess that the incidents of children and people not dying from simple diseases must be down to vaccinations, couple with better hygiene, as we have learnt more about the spread of disease.

Yet I dont thik it would take long for there to be epidemics if we all decided that we wouldnt have vaccinations.

What am awful gamble, it is so sad to hear from you that have experience of perfectly normal children, who then develop these autistic symptoms.

It oculd happen to any one of us who decides to immunise, yet it doesnt happen enough, to put the majority off vaccinating our kids.

I personally thought it was worth the risk, i thought hard about it, and especially in my area, where there is a very hippy town, and there are alot of people not immunising there children, and guess what--measles and mumps has increased dramitically in our county, it was ina report a few months ago.

I am glad , for me, that dd has had the jabs.

I think DC's post merely fits his usual posting style - as someone who can spout rhetoric to order, who can copy and paste quite well, but who has little in the way of emotive intelligence.

DC -people have endured personal tragedy through no fault of their own. To claim that those who have suffered the terror of a cot death is because they are stupid is horrible and fucking down right irresponsible.

electra

there is no way round this

to vaccinate is to take a risk

to not vaccinate is to take a risk

IMO vaccination is less risky than non-vaccination

but ALSO, there IS society to consider

yes I will put my kids at a small risk for the benefit of society overall. Because the benefits to them in living in society outweigh the risk

heres another thing. if I didn't vaccinate my ds against rubella (think this is not uncommon) and he later passed it onto his vaccinated, but unprotected pregnant dw-god, HOW would I feel then?