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Original poster

Thimerosil-Free Vaccines .. Help .. Anyone know where to get .. Jimjams? Tamum? Anyone?

92 replies

twiglett · 16/06/2004 13:17

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Jimjams · 16/06/2004 13:26

Yes they can just order it. Tell your GP to grow up and order Infanrix at the same time- she probably has some sitting in her fridge anyway.

Original poster
twiglett · 16/06/2004 13:31

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tamum · 16/06/2004 13:31

Grrr, what an ignorant git. (GP, not you, obviously). I'm sooo glad Jimjams was able to answer, as I haven't a scooby, other than to give moral support. The only other possibility if you don't have any luck is to ask jmb1964 since she has now outed herself as a GP (but not an ignorant one, it goes without saying )

Jimjams · 16/06/2004 13:36

No they're not exactly lying, but they are being a bit jobsworth. The Dept of H has decided that the hib isn;t working as well as they thought. One possibility they have listed (in a list of many) is that giving DtaP at the same time as hib somehow interferes with the action of hib (although giving MMR together is of course completely safe and there's no way they could interact- oh I just love vaccination logic!) so they have recently written to GP's saying that DTwP -0 along with a nice dose of thimerosil should be given to babies- whilst DTaP can still be used for pre-schoolers.

However this is not an "order" as such (AFAIK anyway)- more a recommendation. Davros got DTaP by refusing anything else. And I think susanmt's dh ONLY uses DTaP - including for babies (an enlightened GP!!).

If you refuse anything else I'm sire they'll guve you DTaP - and ask to check the ingredients first of all.....

Original poster
twiglett · 16/06/2004 13:41

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Jimjams · 16/06/2004 13:53

I would write to them- quote the recent mouse study (link to it in SN earlier in the week) and say that you are not prepared to risk thimerosil so please could you have DTaP. That you understand that DTaP is not routinely given to infants in the UK but that as it is routinely given in the US, AUs, NZ and the rest of europe you think it is unlikely to cause any problems. If they are unable to provide Infanrix on the NHS could they please explain why.

WideWebWitch · 16/06/2004 15:32

God Twiglet, I sympathise. My gp sighed VERY heavily but then gave me Infanrix (non thimerosil one) when I asked and agreed it was better than not vaccinating at all. The USA and Australia have banned Thimerosil so this isn't a hippy dippy view! Will try to word an email for you if I get time later.

bundle · 16/06/2004 15:33

gp gave me stuff to read & then agreed to give us thim-free ones for dd2. made it seem odd, then once we'd agreed they just did it as normal. funny that.

GeorginaA · 16/06/2004 17:47

I've been told today I can't have infanrix either. Currently investigating their reasons why.

Jimjams · 16/06/2004 18:41

Errr www not sure my reasons for choosing not to vaccinate are particularly hippy dippy (rather like to think there's quite a lot of Science behind them actually) The mouse study concluding a link between thimerosil and autism was published in Molecular Psychiatry on June 9th (can anyone get me a copy- tamum????? ). But I do take your point- the GP doesn't have to label you as hippy dippy (actually I don't think my GP thinks I am, he doesn't agree with me but I think he understands why I have made my decision).

tamum · 16/06/2004 19:02

Your wish is my command, 'tis on its way

WideWebWitch · 16/06/2004 19:07

Oh no, Jimjams, I wasn't for one minute suggesting that your views were in any way hippy dippy, not at all! I meant that you/Twiglett/I/any of us with concerns about this are not being hippy dippy; the whole concern about thimerosil isn't hippy dippy; there IS a lot of science behind these concerns and other countries think so too. Sorry, 'hippy dippy' probably wasn't the best expression to use (minority view might have been better) but I was pushed for time. Tell me you're not offended and you know what I meant...

Original poster
twiglett · 16/06/2004 19:11

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WideWebWitch · 16/06/2004 19:19

Twiglett, no I don't think it is the same, I think it's weaker, Jimjams explained this to me somewhere, I'll see if I can find it in a mo - this may be part of their objection but my gp said she'd rather my dd had it than nothing at all.

WideWebWitch · 16/06/2004 19:20

I don't see why you should have to pay either.

WideWebWitch · 16/06/2004 19:25

Twiglett, here's one thread explaining the difference and here's another here, when I asked

WideWebWitch · 16/06/2004 19:26

don't know if this will come up but here's the search I did

Gem13 · 16/06/2004 19:46

Had this problem for DD the other day. I think they're all bemused by the general fuss about vaccinations and no one knows what 'the line' is.

I was told the surgery wasn't licensed to give Infanrix yet but when I told them DS had it 18 months ago they wanted to know where. Same surgery I told them - suprise, suprise! So DD was suddenly able to have it after all.

Bit confused how one minute they're not allowed to use it and the next they are. Should they not have given it to DS then 18 months ago?

Thanks to everyone here I know where I am with them and have formed my views after reading the various threads and links but it makes me concerned that it seems such a luck of the draw with the surgeries.

Jimjams · 16/06/2004 19:50

ROFL WWW- I wasn't offended at all

Er twiglett the only real difference is in the pertussis bit. Some research suggested that it wasn't quite as effective in the aP form as in the wP form. But more recent research has apparently suggested that there isn't much difference between them. TBH it's not a great vaccine in either form (in terms of efficiacy). The best guesstimates (and it's always a bit of a guess) suggest that it works in about 70% of cases.

There is a new strain of pertussis about as well- which neither vaccination protects against- but not sure how common it is. And it seems to be a bit milder than the original......

Jimjams · 16/06/2004 19:51

Tamum- thanks - you are a star

Jimjams · 16/06/2004 19:52

No twiglett don't pay- they can easily give it to you on the NHS.

Original poster
twiglett · 16/06/2004 20:13

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susanmt · 16/06/2004 20:24

Your doc can just order the DTaP from whoever supplies their vaccines.

My dh is a dispensing GP so has a drug wholesaler who he gets it through - as he's only ever worked in a dispensing practice I doubt he'd know about how a 'normal' practice gets it.

He offers DTaP to all parents, some accept it, some want the DTwP because of the link with Hib being less effective. What he does, which most other GPs don't do, is offers a CHOICE to parents on this one. Our 2 older children had DTwP, as we didn't know anything about it, but as my family (on both sides) has a very strong history of Rheumatoid Arthritis (which is an auto-immune condition) and I've already had a +ve Rheumatoid factor blood test though it doesn't affect me at present we decided that as we now knew more about it dd2 would have DTaP. After we did the research (having found out about it on MN to start with!!) dh decided this is what should be offered to parents in his practice as well.

Original poster
twiglett · 16/06/2004 20:37

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Jimjams · 16/06/2004 20:58

oh I see- no same vaccination twiglett....