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Original poster

I am pretty sure my firend has Munhausens syndrome

87 replies

Poussin · 13/02/2007 17:43

She displays so many of the symptoms - incredulous stories constant sickness amoungst her dc's. I had thought it was the 'by proxy' version but am thinking that she displays tendancies towards the syndrome herself.She is constantly at the doctors and i cannot but think that they have her down as a time - waster at the very least.I dont know if anyone has ever experienced anyone with the same sort of problem, Thing is i find it hard to be a good friend to her as i simply cannot beleive the things she comes out with. Other people seem to believe all these ( sometimes ridiculous) goings on but i find myslef feeling guilty because i just cant. When i first met her an acquaintance said to be 'she is lovely but - she lies' i just thought that was a bit harsh at the time but now feel differently.Its kind of not funny any more - just wearing.I cannot bear to see our friends taken in by her and trying to help out wherever possible - in what i see as self imposed difficulites.My husband is her firnd as well and we have laughed about her having this illness for some time but i am a bit passed laughing now.Now i feel it is going from bad to worse.Her daughter had to go to hospital last month - i just dont think there was anything up with her but J persisted in taking her back and forth to gp till they admitted her
I know there is nothing i can do but just wondered if anyone had any advice on how to deal with it before it spoils our friendship
Please dont say i am being a bitch because i am really not. I looked it up on the internet last night and was horrified ( i actually put my hand over my mouth) to read how one symptom in particular was so true to her.
TIA

OP posts:
wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 13/02/2007 18:38

it does sound as if she's perhaps overanxious, but that's totally different from harming her children. Did she have difficult pregnancies perhaps? is it possible that she thought she might lose a child at some point and that this has caused her over anxiety?

Chandra · 13/02/2007 18:39

My advise would be to go to medical school, specialise in psychology and paediatrics, then spend 1 year being the paediatrician to her children. Spend also a month at her house 24/7 and then, just then be ready to write letters diagnose this.

Do you realise this is as serious as contacting social services and saying she rapes her own children? There will be a lot of heartache before things are cleared up.

morocco · 13/02/2007 18:39

it's all very well people saying that they would report it and no harm done, but is that how most of us would feel if we had social services turning up on our doorstep cos someone made an anoymous report based on pretty slim evidence? I know I'd be very stressed out and even more neurotic about me and my kids if that happened. and I know lots of us on here post about being worried about things like meningitis based on just a few common symptoms - but that's what being a mum is like, isn't it, you worry about your kids and don't want to ignore things that might turn out to be serious
if she's going to the same gp, the same hospital etc then it's up to them to diagnose/report/investigate/refer - they are the best qualified not a 'friend' without access to all the information.
some people's lives are more tragic/complicated/filled with illnesses than others eg I don't post about half of my life on mn cos I know loads of people would think it was too unbelievable but actually 'shit happens'
sorry - i think you should stop throwing serious words like munchaussens around and talk to your friend more or else talk to her less and gossip about her less as well

Original poster
Poussin · 13/02/2007 18:40

i dont want to say but like i said they are invariably 'silent' and she will move from one illness to aother if something is proved ie blood tes shows not to have it.

OP posts:
lulumama · 13/02/2007 18:42

i think that there is clearly some issue at the root of her overbearing concern and lying, that needs dealing with

it is another issue entirely whether you wish to stay friends with her and get to the bottom of it, or leave her to it , but if you are really worried about munchausen's , an anonymous call or letter would be a reasonable thing to send to her Doc or HV.

Chandra · 13/02/2007 18:42

Have you seen the blod tests? do you know how accurate blood tests can be for the particular condition? Because according to blod tests my child is not allergic to wheat but his skin prick test and ELISA test show clearly he is. Just a thought.

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 13/02/2007 18:44

which would point more to her self diagnosing than anything, or perhaps gp saying "we'll test to rule out xxx" and then when xxx has been ruled out saying "we'll test for yyyy now".

and what exactly would you say if you rang up hv/gp/social services?

"I know you see this woman once a week/day/on the hour every hour, but I've been looking on the internet and I know she's making it up and I think she has munchausens"?

noonar · 13/02/2007 18:45

chandra and morocco, you've made a really valid point about needing to be aware of the poss repercussions, here.

poussin, i think it sounds like you could approach the friend's parents and say you are concerned about X . maybe mention the non health related 'lies' first. then broach the subject of health. dont mention the 'M word', though. may make them just a tad defensive.

Original poster
Poussin · 13/02/2007 18:45

chandra if that were the case no one would ever get diagnosed and at risk people would slip through the net
i dont need to be jumped on- i am medically qualified myslef and these are my concerns

OP posts:
lurkylou · 13/02/2007 18:45

Keep smiling Poussin

you are showing you care for your friend by asking for advice.

Not many people know what pathological liars are like as they are a rare breed!!

Having worked with one for many years I understand where you are coming from.

As I said before it will ultimately be up to your friend to help herself and I still think you should make her hv or doc aware of your concerns. You are a close friend so know her better then any of us on here.

lulumama · 13/02/2007 18:46

i think Poussin has some valid reasons to be concerned, whether her friend has munchausens or not, often truth is stranger than fiction, and if she has been good friends with her and is concerned, whatever is going on is clearly having a negative effect.

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 13/02/2007 18:46

it's one thing reporting someone whose children you think might be at risk and who is not known to ss/the medical profession, but someone who is in regular contact with doctors/hospitals, the same doctors/hospitals at that is quite another matter.

and remember, the internet is a dangerous tool.

Original poster
Poussin · 13/02/2007 18:49

what would you classify her as then - i DONT think she woud harm them but she makes up symptoms and exhaggrates things??

OP posts:
ScummyMummy · 13/02/2007 18:50

I really don't think there is much you can do, Poussin. It sounds like your friendship has already been hugely compromised by her lying and your concerns. If what you suspect is true she will become furious if you confront her in any way with your suspicions. Equally, if you are mistaken she will be furious and upset, I expect. Is she in touch with any services like health visitors, sure start, playgroups, social services? Are her kids in school? Good support for her and her children sounds like the best bet, whether she is ill in this way or not. Also, if you have well evidenced concerns for her children you could ring social services or the NSPCC.

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 13/02/2007 18:51

a lier?

do her children deny the simptoms?

Chandra · 13/02/2007 18:52

If you are so qualified why are you asking for advice to us? obviously there should be more reliable medical avenues to help your "friend" than this. Having worked for a department that investigates possible cases of medical negligence/malpractice. I could only advise to keep to the appropiate channels.

If you are a GP I guess you should have access to her medical notes, with those on hand you can contact her GP in confidence and explain your concerns so she can be seen by a person who may diagnose. Unless you are trained to diagnose these sort of syndrome, I don't think you should venture into that.

kinki · 13/02/2007 18:55

Be careful poussin. A friend of mine used to sound very much like your friend. I used to wonder why she took her dc to the docs when they so much as sneezed. I just put it down to being a hyperchondriac. It really wasn't much my business so I ignored it. Gradually I got to know her better, and she started to ask my advice on all sorts of health matters (still does in fact). As I was now getting involved I finally plucked up the courage to broach the subject that I think she sometimes might be overreacting with regards minor ailments and accidents. At which point she opened up that her first child had in fact died of leukaemia at age 9 (before I knew her). That was why she was so concerned about her other dc's health. She explained that (quite rightly) the drs have all the time she needs to offer reassurance.

Things aren't always as straight forward as they seem. Maybe freindship and reassurance is what she really needs. Just thought I'd share.

Original poster
Poussin · 13/02/2007 18:56

i have seen them deny things yes
I am not making up things. the experiences she recounts are INCREDIBLE i assure you. Epsiodes of casualty dont come near some of what she has told me
It may all be harmless - but it's passed 'bugging' me it 'cpncerns' me - a lot

OP posts:
Original poster
Poussin · 13/02/2007 18:57

thankyou for that kinki

OP posts:
BandofMothers · 13/02/2007 18:57

Chandra, all she was originally asking for was advice on how to handle it, so instead of being so defensive, why don't you tell her what the "appropriate channels" are???

Original poster
Poussin · 13/02/2007 19:01

Thankyou all for the advise. I think what you have clarified is that i not for me to do anything
i wont and pretty much knew i would not to start with.
i do like her but feel i might have to leave alone more.sadly that is whats happened a lot to her but she does not seem t mind

OP posts:
noonar · 13/02/2007 19:05

poussin, i think you have grounds to be concerned, as i've said before. how old are the children? what sort of things do they deny? what sort of 'lies' have been told?

i had a firend who was such a compulsive liar, i would never have believed she was was pregnant if i hadnt seen it for myself- i mean OMG, she said she was gonna have a baby, and it actually happened! everything else she said smacked of b*llshit the friendship just wasnt worth it in the end.

3LoveHeartsAndNoMore · 13/02/2007 19:08

wow, this one blew up a bit.
What sort of test do the Kids go through then? Are they the harmless type, like ecg, etc....or more invasive like that?
Obviously if you would go official channels then you have got to be reasonably sure about it...., but you are obvioulsy aware of that, hence you wanting ohter peoples opinions.

Chandra · 13/02/2007 19:09

Band, that's my advice.

I'm not having a go at Poussin, who I respect as a regular here, only mentioning the damage such accussations could cause especially if she is wrong. Just that.

3LoveHeartsAndNoMore · 13/02/2007 19:11

Chandra, please read your messages and be honest..."you didn't have a go at Poussin"....hm....wouldn't want to be in the line of your fire when you do have a go then!