Pt 8 (Oct13) Any old prolapse! Uterus/womb prolapse, rectocele, cystocele, enterocele, urethrocele, incontinence, pelvic floor, anterior and posterior repair, TVT etc (994 Posts)

[gottagetthroughthis]

Welcome to thread 8 (again - see below) of a long-running series of posts from ladies suffering from pelvic prolapses to support each other through the process of diagnosis, repair and recovery.

With apologies for confusion in thread numbers - an earlier thread was called part 7 but it was actually the 6th thread.

Here are the previous threads:

Thread 1
Thread 2
Thread 3
Thread 4
Thread 5
Thread 6
Thread 7
Thread 8

Info from BBC Health

What is a pelvic prolapse?

As the muscles, ligaments and supporting tissues in the pelvis become weaker, they are less able to hold in the organs of the pelvis such as the womb (uterus) or bladder.

Gravity pulls these organs down and, in the more severe cases, may appear through the entrance to the vagina.

A variety of problems can occur, depending on where the weakness lies and which organs are able to descend, but in every case there is some degree of prolapse of the vaginal wall, which begins to invert (rather like a sock turning inside out).
Prolapse of the womb or uterus is the most common prolapse, affecting as many as one in eight older women to some degree
Prolapse of the bladder, known as a cystocele, is less common.
Prolapse of the urethra (the tube that carries urine out of the bladder) is known as a urethrocele.
Prolapse of the intestines is quite rare, and known as an enterocele or rectocele.

Symptoms

Symptoms depend on which tissues descend, and how severe the prolapse is.

They may include:
A sense of heaviness or pressure in the pelvis.
The appearance of a bulge of tissue in the genital area, which can be quite alarming, and is often red and sore.
Urinary problems, such as having to urinate more frequently, feeling the need urgently, being incontinent (losing control of the bladder) or, conversely, being unable to pass urine when you need to.
Pain in the pelvis or lower back.
Sexual problems, including pain and decreased libido.
Constipation.
Vaginal discharge or bleeding.

Treatment and recovery

Once a prolapse has developed, surgery to fix the affected organs is usually the only way to cure it effectively.

However, another option is to use a device known as a vaginal ring pessary. This is rather like a contraceptive diaphragm or cervical cap. It's made of silicone or latex, and placed in the vagina to push back the prolapsed organs and hold them in place. Many women happily manage their prolapse this way.

Hi

Never heard of that type of surgery - worth investigating and have you heard where it is offered and how it helps?

gottagetthroughthis How are you going? Did you end up trying the pessary ring? I haven't been on for a while, I don't know if you remember me but I had my surgery in November 2015 and had a lot of setbacks but I am now so glad I had the surgery. I hope you have found some relief xx

I have not had surgery - tried the pessary had to have it removed because too tight so counldn't poo however, would like to try that again before any surgery if I have to.. can't believe this but have had no symptoms (nearly afraid to say it) since so just "waiting" to see what happens. I am 56 so am getting on. sooo glad to hear all's well with you and long may it last!

always still keep looking on here it has helped me a lot at times when I do have my symptoms at least I know I not the only one so hope it never disappears it's my support - does that sound selfish?

No it is definitely not selfish, I often get concerned when everything seems to be going great and then I feel a twinge ache or pain. I still have a hernia in the stomach that is going to be corrected via surgery and I think that sometimes pulls me up from doing to much. I am taking magnesia Pellegrino every second night or I don't poo and I am on bladder medication everyday so it isn't angry that's how I explain how it feels... It has almost been a year since surgery it was a really rough process and i am still terrified it will return. This site was my way of coping, understanding and of course great support from ladies like you who understand. May you remain symptom free and know that we completely understand.

Joining in. I've been 12 months so far having investigations and tests and please God I will meet all my consultants next month to finally agree what surgery to perform and when it might be.

It's been really long, really horrible, very painful, too invasive. I'm totally fed up.

Fauxgina, I know 😞 how frustrating it can be waiting for all the decisions to be made regarding what type of surgery you will be having but hang in there. I know the agony of the prolapse let alone them poking and testing and also the waiting which seems to only make things worse. There is light at the end of the tunnel. Please let us know how you next appointment goes and what there decision is. I had a posterior and anterior prolapse surgically repaired almost a year ago and I have not forgotten all the pain and anxiety that went along with it. Any assistance, questions or just a ear of understanding I am happy to help as I'm sure all the other ladies are also. Take care of yourself thinking of you.

Bocca I have not heard of the laser treatment either, but my surgery was done without mesh, I live in Australia and they don't like to use mesh thank God as there has been so many issues regarding using it. If you do investigate the laser treatment please let us know as it would be valued info for anyone else being offered the treatment, I hope the road ahead is a smooth one.

Hi all,
I know there is probably plenty of info on this thread but I can't manage to read all 30 pages tonight!

I just wondered if someone could describe their prolapse symptoms to me as I'm wondering if this is what's happening to me....

I have had 3 kids - 1st forceps with 3rd degree tear, second natural with 3rd degree tear, 3rd elective c-sect as consultant said too risky for natural birth again given previous tears.

My youngest has just turned 5, but for some years now I feel I've had 'poo' issues - if I have a bowel movement during the day, I wipe thoroughly but many hours later I can wipe again after urinating & quite a lot more poo can be wiped away. It's like my sphincter isn't keeping 'closed' & is letting more out during the day.

I don't think this is helped by not having great regularity in bowel movements anymore - 3 kids means mornings are mental so I rarely sit on toilet long enough in mornings. I then try and catch up later but that's tricky too.

I think I need to see gp about it but I'm not sure it's enough to be going for? I just feel dirty after a bm and it actually stops me wanting to get intimate with DH unless I'm thoroughly showered.

I've had a prolapse (since repaired). I had a cystocele and a rectocele. So my bowel movement symptoms were 'incomplete emptying'. The Doc described it as the rectum (where the poo is stored) should be a kind of tube which ends at the anus. When the rectum gets pulled out of position by childbirth it can drop down a bit, and so a pocket is created slightly lower than the anus. So we do a poo as normal, but a little bit remains in the pouch below the anus. When you stand up then, that little bit is there still there and then presents itself at the anus, and so you might get incomplete emptying - as in you feel you had a bit more to do. And I'm thinking maybe the symptom you describe. But I'm not sure if my explanation is what you have.
I also had some stools getting 'stuck' so it felt like I hadn't the muscles to push it out. Also my stools weren't cigar shaped (TMI) they were like eel-shaped flattened 'ribbons', now they are normal shaped again.
I would suggest you go to a specialist women's physio to look at doing a pelvic floor program. Your GP should be able to help too hopefully. It is a big enough issue as it is quality of life thing, it is on your mind every day and does impact you...

majorclanger, I had a 4th degree tear after my dd and was sent to a very special physio to help strengthen my repaired anal sphincter.

What you're describing does sound like maybe it doesn't close as tightly as it used to do. I'd definitely recommend going to GP and asking for a referral to a specialist. Having had two third degree tears you should have no difficulty getting this referral. In my experience this can definitely be improved on with exercise. Sympathies, I found it very stressful.

As you're going to your GP it may be worth requesting a pelvic exam too, to see if GP can identify any prolapse too, but my money is on anal sphincter weakness. All the best.

I think difficulty cleaning and having to re clean regularly is actually a classified as being fecal incontinent. Sorry, that's not a nice term but I don't want you to be upset thinking you're rushing in the morning and not wiping properly! It's a fairly common complication of issues after childbirth.

Also sadie I've been reading about anal intussusception lately as that's what I have and your symptoms sound remarkably similar although you say you've improved since which is good. Right down to the 'flat shape' of poo.

You really need to see urogynaecologists but I'm not sure if the GP can refer you straight or if you have to see a gynaecologist and get referred to a specialist department from there.

But look and find the nearest hospital that has a urogynaecology team and ask your GP to refer you there, all your tests and consultants will be under the same roof.

Thanks so much for all your speedy replies - yes sadie9 another symptom I definitely have is feeling like I've had an incomplete emptying and I need to go back to the toilet. I saw a specialist consultant whilst pregnant with baby no3 (because midwives didn't want to give the go ahead for a c-section unless someone had thoroughly investigated my bottom end). She did various tests using water up my bottom to see how much I could hold. When she understood I was only there on the basis of did I need a c-section or could I have another natural birth she immediately said she'd request a section for me as she didn't want me back in her clinic 2 years down the line with fecael incontinence. Seems like perhaps I will be back there even though I had the section! I'm only 37 so I didn't consider prolapse as I thought this was more likely after menopause, but having discovered this thread I'm thinking I really need to see a doctor as it's only going to get worse if left untreated,
Thanks again

Yes you really need to see someone, as I wrote above ask GP for a referral to a gynaecologist or urogynaecologist but pick the best hospital before you see the GP that way you can ask to be referred straight there. Whereabouts in the country are you?

Hi all. Ive basically hijacked some other poor sods thread regarding my own prolapse so have sought you lot out as I just can't stop thinking about my vagina.

My history... first birth was large baby induced with episiotomy and forceps. Had blood transfusion for pph and was shipped out end of story. Was concerned about my vagina afterwards (after 6 week check) and was checked out and told I was just constipated. I was so frightened I had a prolapse I wanted to believe it and didn't seek a second opinion. I kind of thought people would think I was odd I kept wanting them to examine me! I bought an e stim machine and dealt with it myself whenever my 'paranoia' reared its head. Im 6 months pregnant now (almost 4 years on ) and have an awful cough which has resulted in a really heavy feeling in my vagina and a soft bulge at the entrance that I can move out the way, but everything feels weird inside.

I saw my GP about it today and was told to go to hospital as she could feel the baby's head as though I was about to give birth. I was hysterical in the car. Got there and the baby is fine thankfully but have been told I have a prolapsed womb.

So devastated. Feel like a freak and an old lady. Consultant helpfully appointed out that only old ladies get these usually. She was so blase about it all and said I should have a natural birth (there was fuck all natural about the first one) and can look at surgery afterwards. She wouldn't say what grade the prolapse is and I had to request referral to physio (4 years too late).

Im just hoping that the reason my bulge is soft and not hard like a cervix is because it's so high up and its just drooping of the vaginal wall I feel, ie, it's a mild prolapse? But I have no idea as its like getting blood out of a stone.

I haven't slept for days and have cried a ridiculous number of times. And I still have this awful cough which cannot be helping. I realise people have been over their own circumstances to death but how have people recovered from a uterine prolapse with physio? I have read up so much on cystocele / rectocele which I thought I had and appear to have a fighting chance of helping with physio. Uterine prolapses look hopeless however.

I could literally keep talking about this but I need to stop now.

Imstickingwiththisone, please don't feel like a freak. I had a problem similar to yours and it showed up after baby 3 by my 6th baby (number 5 bub 12pounds) I had bulges at the entrance of my vagina, had trouble moving my bowels had to manually assist which only started during preg number 6, I cried almost every time it was horrible.I was worried about bub and what condition I would be in after birth. Long story short gave birth to 13pound bub who was stuck so midwife had to reach in and pull her out (shoulder dystosia) vagina was obviously going to be worse after that. My bub is 2 now and I had my op a year ago, if after your birth your cervix (beginning of your womb is at the entrance of your vagina they can operate to repair, if it is protruding out then sometimes they have to perform a hysterectomy to correct it. I hope your pregnancy continues without any more worries and that you can get everything sorted out once you have bub. Any questions don't hesitate. Sorry its such a long post I hope it helps

Thank you so much for replying waiting. You are amazing having so many babies despite your problems. I hate the fact that I feel so resentful of my poor baby who is just sat in there waiting to wreak havoc. Is there any reason why you did not have a section waiting? Im certain that is what I want as dont even feel I could mentally push if I had an epidural which meant I didn't have the physical urge.

Its a relief that you've had an op for a uterine prolapse that wasn't a hysterectomy as I thought that was all there is.

I really want to take all this news in my stride but its affected me so much. This has been a deep seated fear of mine for 4 years and I just can't believe it's happening.

Did you use a pessary? How did you manage sex if your cervix was right down your vagina?

Can't get over the fact that this is the consequence of childbirth. When pregnant with dc1 I worried about stretch marks ffs.

Hi Imsticking I'm exactly the same with the crying, feeling awful, so upset. My kids are older now (8,11). I think and get depressed about this every day. It was also a long-standing fear of mine as my mums in a terrible state prolapse wise. I'm doing physio and being fitted for a pessary soon to see if that helps me feel more comfortable. There's a v gd Facebook support group for prolapse - search apps - which I've found v helpful. Hugs.

Thanks colouring. What kind of prolapse do you have? I feel this has taken over my life and don't even want to leave the house anymore. I feel a bit ridiculous as this isn't a life threatening condition and im not in any pain. I'm not sure if my DP really gets the impact it's had on me. Thought I was doing ok this morning as was deluding myself that its all fine, had a poke around and cried so hard. Ive not been into work this week due to feeling so low but my dc has been too poorly for nursery anyway. If I wasn't looking after dc I would be in bed - don't know if that would've been good (ease up on the pressure while im coughing) or bad.

Will try to search on fb but im crap at things like that tbh.

I'msticking and colouring in I completely understand the anguish and despair it is so overwhelming and can completely wreck your self esteem. I'msticking in answer to your question I was told I had to wait to finish my family before they would operate and I went ahead with a natural birth because I was scared of having a c section. After baby 4 I was fitted for a pessary 3 times it never stayed in place for me and made me more uncomfortable, it was commented once that it was shocking a women in her 30s had a 80 year olds condition that made me feel even worse(some people don't think before they talk). Sex was ok untill after bub 6 then it hurt I felt like my insides where being beaten especially my bladder. My advice even when your not pregnant don't lift anything heavy and if it is possible rest when it flares up I was in alot of pain even walking towards the end. Take heart we understand and I'm thinking of you all

imsticking the weight of pregnancy and the coughing sounds like it's stretched your ligaments out causing as you say the womb to drop a little and the walls to bulge. Glad you've been checked out and the baby is ok. Not sure really about childbirth, I had a severe rectocele after my first and gave birth the next time vaginally as well. I'm grateful that I was able to spend some of the first days with both babies fairly physically capable. I'd hate to think how bad it would be with a newborn after major surgery. But having said that my friend was pleased with her section.

I tend to flip flop between being very stoic and carrying on regardless and being very upset and ashamed about it. It feels terrible at times, it's ugly and effects me a lot in my life. Until I get used to it and think "What's the big deal? So what?"

You definitely don't have to have a hysterectomy - especially if it's only a mild prolapse. Getting to see a women's health physio might help and also a pessary could work too if you needed it, up to 35 weeks pregnant. In the meantime go back to the GP with your cough and explain it's putting a big strain on your pelvic floor see what they can advise regarding a cough suppressant.

My surgeon didn't want me to have a hysterectomy as I was so young, she wanted to leave me with the option of having more children so recommended a sling to hold the uterus up. They can also just repair the front wall or back wall. It is better to leave surgery until you've totally finished having children though.

This is a really good video that talks through it all in general terms.

Thank you both for replying Im finding this outlet very helpful as its all going on in my head anyway. DP has seen me crying too much these past few days and he's having a hard time with work and also our poorly DC.

I find the surgery options confusing. Ive read about a mesh sling holding the uterus which appears (or at least I haven't seen any) to have a good success rate without complications. On the other hand mesh is supposed to be so very bad, but is that only if its inserted into the vaginal walls? And then they say hysterectomy can still result in a vaginal wall prolapse. Seems unfair that there is such a high risk of poor results with surgery for this condition.

Thank you for posting that vid fauxgina I'll watch it a little later once DC is in bed xx

Hi there, I completely get what you say about staying in bed. If my kids weren't off I would have on Tuesday after a horrendous night Monday night (tmi) constipated and in pain. Yes I think about it a lot too. The APOPS - Assn pelvic organ prolapse support on Facebook is excellent. Lots of support and info.

I have a cystocele and rectocele and maybe slight uterine prolapse - can't get a firm diagnosis. Grade 1/2 ie still internal, but feel bulgy down below and uncomfortable when I walk, heavy achy lower abdomen after being upright for a long time.

This thing is sooooo hard to come to terms with. For me at the moment I find it disabling and hard not to be able to run, play football with my ds, badminton with my dd etc

Physio should be your starting point imo.

My gp said wait ten years before surgery (I'm 45). If your prolapse is mild, physio can make a big difference with symptoms but it takes a good while... I'm having a pessary fitted next month so I can go for a good walk without feeling like things are going to fall out...