Pt 8 (Oct13) Any old prolapse! Uterus/womb prolapse, rectocele, cystocele, enterocele, urethrocele, incontinence, pelvic floor, anterior and posterior repair, TVT etc (994 Posts)

[gottagetthroughthis]

Welcome to thread 8 (again - see below) of a long-running series of posts from ladies suffering from pelvic prolapses to support each other through the process of diagnosis, repair and recovery.

With apologies for confusion in thread numbers - an earlier thread was called part 7 but it was actually the 6th thread.

Here are the previous threads:

Thread 1
Thread 2
Thread 3
Thread 4
Thread 5
Thread 6
Thread 7
Thread 8

Info from BBC Health

What is a pelvic prolapse?

As the muscles, ligaments and supporting tissues in the pelvis become weaker, they are less able to hold in the organs of the pelvis such as the womb (uterus) or bladder.

Gravity pulls these organs down and, in the more severe cases, may appear through the entrance to the vagina.

A variety of problems can occur, depending on where the weakness lies and which organs are able to descend, but in every case there is some degree of prolapse of the vaginal wall, which begins to invert (rather like a sock turning inside out).
Prolapse of the womb or uterus is the most common prolapse, affecting as many as one in eight older women to some degree
Prolapse of the bladder, known as a cystocele, is less common.
Prolapse of the urethra (the tube that carries urine out of the bladder) is known as a urethrocele.
Prolapse of the intestines is quite rare, and known as an enterocele or rectocele.

Symptoms

Symptoms depend on which tissues descend, and how severe the prolapse is.

They may include:
A sense of heaviness or pressure in the pelvis.
The appearance of a bulge of tissue in the genital area, which can be quite alarming, and is often red and sore.
Urinary problems, such as having to urinate more frequently, feeling the need urgently, being incontinent (losing control of the bladder) or, conversely, being unable to pass urine when you need to.
Pain in the pelvis or lower back.
Sexual problems, including pain and decreased libido.
Constipation.
Vaginal discharge or bleeding.

Treatment and recovery

Once a prolapse has developed, surgery to fix the affected organs is usually the only way to cure it effectively.

However, another option is to use a device known as a vaginal ring pessary. This is rather like a contraceptive diaphragm or cervical cap. It's made of silicone or latex, and placed in the vagina to push back the prolapsed organs and hold them in place. Many women happily manage their prolapse this way.

Hi all, just looking for advice, experience, thoughts here..... I would be so grateful for any response as worried.....

Brief history, 3 DDs, one natural birth 2 c/sections first emergency one, second a horrendous birth with placenta previa and placenta acretia (placenta grew thru womb and attached to various organs) which caused hysterectomy at 39 but I do have ovaries..... Small prolapse before 2nd C section but very tiny (small change in vaginal entrance)

FF to yesterday... I visited the doctor as had on and off lower back pain, but last weekend all along my C section scars (yes, 2! They do merge at one point) I felt such a dragging feeling, on top of that the need to wee, but not the usual needing to wee feeling but more uncomfortable squeeze ache which goes after I have been. Explained to Dr who is sending me for tests of adhesions and cyst check on my ovaries (OC Freak out all day). However, a niggle in my head went back to the minor prolapse 13 years ago and I checked my vaginal entrance and the 'little bit' is now far more pronounced and the pulling sensation is far worse towards the end of the day... But fine in the morning. I don't have leakage, my hips ache a bit, my lower back aches, my lower stomach has a real dragging sensation especially over my scars and my bladder does not seem 'right'. I am also having weird vaginal twinges ?? ! I only mentioned backache and stomach ache and bladder to Dr as hadn't discovered the larger prolapsed bit at that point.

Do these symptoms sound familiar and all together would they point to prolapse being the most likely cause? I am just so scared could be something more ominous..... Just trying to keep things together and look practically rather than jumping to conclusions!

Thank you for reading....

Hi Izzy

Sorry, I can't offer any insight/advice for you, just bumping so that someone wise will see and answer both our queries (mine is a little bit underneath yours!)

Good luck

Shameless 3rd bump

Last bump I promisr, in the hope someone sees it before my appointment this afternoon. x

Hi, I'm an old regular in this thread, just seen it pop up in most active, can't post for long now, got to get DCs up etc but will pop back in a bit to see if I can answer some questions.

Right, I'm back. I'll have to be fairly brief as I've got to go to work shortly. My background is that I am 47, developed a cystocele and rectocele after forceps delivery 10 years ago, no real symptoms apart from a very small amount of stress incontincence for several years then the rectocele got much worse in 2012 and I had it repaired 2 years ago last week. The cystocele was not repaired, doesn't cause problems and I manage it by lifestyle and exercise, but I may need surgery on it one day.

Perkins - I didn't have any of those tests, just the urodynamics whichI will come to in a minute. Those tests are usually what they use when they suspect a rectal prolapse (ie the bowel folding over on itself), maybe they are just looking to rule that out. Are you seeing a colo-rectal consultant or a uro-gynae one? Colo-rectal would normally deal with rectal prolapse, and uro-gynae with a recotcele, they can both work together if you've got both. My rectocele repair went very smoothly, very little pain in recovery and I was back at work after 7 weeks, taking it easy, I wasn't fully fit for about 3 months and then had to work very carefully to get my PF/core back to strength. I didn't have mesh, they shouldn't use that unless it is absolutely essential.

Shakey - firstly write a list of everything you have posted here and take it with you, plus any other concerns / problems. Re the weeing, you probably need to be seen for urodynamics testing, which is a set of tests using catheters and a toilet wired up to a computer which makes a very thorough assessment of what is causing your urinary problems. The bleeding after sex could be any number of things I think. Physio can help many people but you have got to make an effort with the things they recommend, if you have surgery you will still need to do the same things afterwards to give it maximum chance of longterm success but as you say, it is more of a clean sweep. It is major surgery though, not to be undertaken lightly.

I'll come back again later.

Thanks so much for replying. Great idea to write everything down. Annoyingly (very) the appointment was cancelled. So pissed off.

Oh Shakey - how annoying. Hope you get anther date quickly.

Izzy - your symptoms sound very similar to mine when my rectocele really developed. I have heard that it is quite common for prolapses to develop post-hysterectomy because the top of the vagina no longer has anything to hold it up (some surgeons tack it up, some don't). You probably need to be seen by the urogynaecology dept, do you know who it is you have been referred to? The lower back, hips etc can ache because they are all connected by ligaments in the pelvic floor area.

Sweetas - I would suggest that you need to be referred to a specialist women's health physio who can set you a programme of exercises that you can do, advise on lifestyle etc and guide you to any machines which would be beneficial. You could probably also do with being seen by the urodynamics clinic as I described in my post earlier. The urodynamics was not as grim as it sounds, the two nurses that did mine were lovely and very gentle, they are aware how upsetting / embarrassing it can be for women and are very experienced. It was actually quite interesting.

Hi

Thank you Shakey for bumping and whoknows for answering... I am fairly sure that it's a prolapse causing my problems (not been too bad since I visited the Dr last week). However, off to have ultrasound tomorrow to look for adhesions/cysts and see what that throws up.... Then back to my GP.... I hate this to be honest with you - after my last C Section, which ended up with me in HDU for 3 days, I have a hatred and fear of Ops/hospitals/Drs.

Sorry your appt was cancelled Shakey - that must have been so annoying - I hope you get another one soon.

WhoKnows, I have only visited GP who is sending me for this ultrasound - not sure if it will show a prolapse but we will see, then back to GP. Think I am at the very start of this journey! Oh Joy! And constipation has now been thrown in to the symptom list! Will see my GP tomorrow after ultrasound.

Ultrasound showed no cysts or ovarian problems, phew, and bladder normal, so next stop GP later on today. I so love the fact my Dr's Surgery doesn't do appointments and has a drop in service......

Apologies to highjack this thread, but I need some advice.

Following a third degree tear I am now experiencing faecal urgency. I saw a consultant at the hospital where I gave birth, who ordered more tests (although there is a long waiting list to see the colorectal team). I don't see this consultant again until January. Hence, I want to look into getting a second opinion and the tests done privately (dependent on costs).

Please can you let me know if you can recommend anyone (in London). Also, should I be looking for a gynaecologist who specialises in perennial trauma, or a colorectal surgeon?

Hi Applesauce, that sounds very painful :( I am not in London so can't give you advice on where to go there, our local private hospital is Clare Park in Surrey - it's supposed to be good there. If you are having any pain in the perennial area, I would definately get a Gynaecologist involved also (you don't say how long ago it was that you gave birth). Sadly these days you have to fight each step of the way until someone takes notice. No one should be in pain or uncomfortable and have to 'live with it' for months on end.

My day has ended ... No cysts or growths but have a 'degree of cystocoele' prolapse... GP was against surgery for the time being and am going to have physio at the hospital mentioned above..... What exactly does the physio for a prolapse entail.....?? Having had two 'down there' inspections today I certainly don't want anyone else prodding about for the time being!

Oh bloody hell Any insights/advice welcome.

Saw the urogynae today and apparently my case is complicated. I have to have urodynamics next week and a bowel CT scan at some point (is "bowel CT scan" the right phrase? My head's all over the place) He said, until I have that done, he can't do anything or say for sure, what will happen. That I need surgery is a given (for the bladder prolapse) but he's wary of what else is going on down there (hence bowel scan). He was more interested than I thought in my perenium. Actually I laughed when he said "It's not just that you have a deficient perenium, it's more like...well...actually it's an absent perenium) And it's true, after my 4th degree tear there's really only a thin bad of scar tissue there

I'm really nervous of what's to be. I know (from reading here) what each procedure is but has anyone any tips for them? As in what folk "would have done if they'd done xyz about the urodynamics/bowel scan"

thanks

God, its a while since i posted here!

Finally asked gp for a second opinion referral yesterday. She apologised - she thought she had done it when i went in to complain about the first referral. She did say it was a registrar who saw me last time, so for a second opinion i will hopefully get a consultant. And i will go prepped for war this time

(History - i have a rectocele due to botched first labour and hms. There is no denying it is there, unless you are the blind twat-registrar who saw me last time. Who told me it is normal to have to manually evacuate my bowels, as all the shit gets stuck in the little pouch on my vag wall. Normal. So that must mean she has to do it to? Does she fuck. Last time i was upset. It is a year later, my other health stuff is all a year worse, and now i am ANGRY)

Shakey they might be checking to see if you have a prolapse and that it this that has caused your bladder prolapse x
At least your consultant showed a bit of decorum, mine asked was your vagina always that big" bloody cheek. Obviously not hence me coming to see him.

Sorry to just leap in but can I ask some advice please?
3 weeks pp and think I've got a prolapse. Feeling very upset and no idea what to do/who to see next.
Any advice (or reassurance) gratefully appreciated.

Hi everyone. It's been a while! I have a formal diagnosis of a large rectocele prolapse now, and have been referred for 'biofeedback' to treat it. Has anyone had this? Do you know what it is, and does it work? I'm a bit worried about being fobbed off...
Showme, sorry to hear about your prolapse. I've not got enough knowledge to offer much help, but I found myself that the initial horror wore off and I adjusted to living with it - it's fine as long as I feel like there's treatment coming! So do see your GP if you haven't already, and if she says she can't see anything ask her to examine you standing up.
Thanks all!

Update- I've had the Urodynamics (not too bad, bit undignified but ok) which showed a stress incontinence score of 9? She said they don't really consider it as stress incontinence unless the score is over 14. But because one of my symptoms is the frequent (almost constant sometimes) urge to pee, the consultant wants to do a biopsy of the bladder (eek right?) Its definitely prolapsed though.

Bowel wise, I ended up having an MRI scan in the end as they didn't think a CT would show up what they were investigating as well as an MRI would Bowels continue to be bad, so bad I had to take a laxative last fri night and must have gone 15+ times during the Sat. Now I'm back to being bunged up again

So, anyway, I await the results.

Hi all

Been following this thread on and off since the birth of my son 21 months ago but now getting to the stage where my symptoms are so debilitating I could do with some advice.

My son was born via mid cavity forceps last February after 3 hours pushing and 2 failed ventouse attempts. They cut an episiotomy which then tore to a 3rd degree into my anal sphincter and I also suffered quite severe posterior vaginal tearing.

Since then I have suffered the following symptoms on and off and am now at the point where I am in pain everyday: bladder frequency, aching heavy pain when stood on feet or after walking for longer than half an hour, perineal pain - severe on period, some leaking after a bowel movement, painful contractions that seem to stem from my uterus and go down into my vagina, pain after a bowel movement.

The worst part of all this is that I have tried seeing a number of urogynae specialists/physios over the last year and I am still no further on with a diagnosis or relief from my symptoms. I have had numerous internal exams and no prolapse has been found. What is going on???

I am finding this all so depressing as I was a very active person prior to the birth, gym etc., and now my life is so miserable and empty and no health professionals that I've seen so far can give me any hope that this will ever get better.

Hi Neef

Your symptoms sound very similar to mine, especially the aching heavy pain when stood or after walking a while. I also feel like I have had an object shoved up my bum (I can assure you I haven't!! )and a lot of lower back pain - like I've sat down hard but missed the chair iykwim.

This all happened following the birth of my dc2 who was 10lb (I'm fairly small, size 10/12, 9stone pre pregnancy) so had a 4th degree tear that needed an epidural and surgery to repair.

I have PTSD and PND/anxiety resulting from this too so have been working with a therapist on the 'head' stuff first as the idea of a doctor checking me gives me panic attacks.

We're getting there though and I'll be getting checked by a gynae that specialises in tears soon hopefully.

Anyway my point was I've been doing some googling about pelvic pain and found 'pudendal neuralgia'. It's a nerve that goes though the pelvic floor and reading about the symptoms really stuck a chord with me so could possibly be worth having a read. On phone so can't link sorry.

Sorry for long rambly post

Dc2 birth was 15 months ago by the way.

Thanks for replying zilla. I have looked up pudendal neuralgia myself and also thought the symptoms fitted. There doesn't seem to be much of a cure though does there? It's depressing. Can totally relate to object up bum feeling! Feels sooo weird and horrible. There are no talking therapies available in my area for trauma so I have been left with anti-depressants really. My lovely partner of 11 years also left me whilst I was expecting our son so have had to deal with all the scary birth and aftermath on my own.

Hi
I have been off for a while but IT Sounds familiar . I had my baby 12 months ago which left me with a rectocle and symptoms similar as yours . I was desperate for months was in pain when sitting too long and this horrible feeling of something stuck on my Buttom . I was diagnosed with a levani syndroma wich causéd pudental nerve pain and these symptoms
But there are some answers i had physio and took a neuroleptic called laroxyl hot baths and pads on the butt can help ( no kidding:-)
And Time can help also
My physio helped me a lot and Now i am almost pain and symptoms free
Take care

Hi, I'm hoping someone can offer me some advice. I've been directed here after posting about a possible prolapse on another thread.

I've had 2 vaginal births which were nasty and both involved forceps. My last baby is now 18 months. I'm pretty sure I've developed some kind of prolapse. I can see a bulge that definitely gets worse when I strain . I'm also experiencing a dragging pain in my abdomen and pain in my lower back. As well as this, when going to the toilet, it doesn't feel as though I'm emptying either my bladder or my bowel completely.

Does this all sound 'normal' for a prolapse? I'm most concerned about the back pain and also about what might need to happen in order to put it right. I have 2 young children so surgery scares me! I can't get an appointment at my docs for 2 weeks so I'm sitting here concerned about the whole thing.

Any advice? Thanks.

Hi all. Just an update: I finally had an appointment after all the tests, to tell me what's going on. I have a large rectocele prolapse apparently (I could have told them that!). The good news is that I have been doing pelvic floor exercises correctly for the last 15 years, so it wasn't all wasted; the bad news is that the only way to treat it, ultimately, is surgery. So I have one more test then I'll finally meet a consultant to talk about surgery. Feeling a little shakey about it all if I'm honest. I can't imagine 6 weeks in which I can't lift my babies up.
Bonnie, it sounds like a prolapse to me (not that I'm an expert!). Poor you! While you're waiting for the doctor keep doing your pelvic floor exercises and put your feet up on a step stool/lean forwards when you're going to the loo, to help you not to strain and straighten things out inside. It helps empty you out, if you see what I mean... I hope your doctor is sympathetic. Don't be fobbed off - there's lots that can be done to help you, if you get referred. Good luck!