Smear tests

[miriam25]

Hi all,
I seem to have developed a phobia of smear tests - today 10mg of Valium wouldn't even help! I've read about HPV blood tests - has anyone had one or does anyone have any idea where you can get them done?
I've also thought of having a course of hypnotherapy - has this worked for anyone one??
Many thanks

The problem is being hounded about a Screening Programme you do not agree with and NEVER EVER agreed to be a part of.

The incidence of cervical cancer without screening is 1-2%. CIN 1 has 2% chance of cancer. CIN 3 30% chance of cancer.

My decision is not be screened and over treated.

Yet I am hounded (to such an extent I had to deregister from my GP) for a Screening Programme I had NEVER EVER consented to be a part of.

I have no issue with screening. However it should be opt in. I am sorry but I will NOT tolerate being hounded for something I have NEVER EVER agreed/consented to be a part of. I have had years of hounding.

This was until I decided enough was enough and dereistered from the NHS so I can no long get NHS Care.

People who want screening have their wishes respected those of us who do not wish to part of these screening programmes/health promotion activities get treated like naughty school children and our wishes walked all over by the NHS.

Well, I just chuck the reminders in the recycling basket if it doesn't suit me. Can't get that worked up about it.

I am sorry about the OP's fear though. Have you talked to your GP about it?

It is not just the letters GP/Nurse hounds too. Enough is enough I would rather not have a GP. I totally resent being included in a screening programme I have never agreed to be a part of.

GP says oh okay we will not bother you again. 18 months later GP starts hounding.

Lost my temper told him to deregister me. Hehehehe if I get stuck he still legal has to see as an Emergency Patient but under the GP contract does not get paid for it. Serves him right!

I refuse to fill out GMS1 to register as a permanent patient so he loses income.

Fucking hell it's like reading a vaccination thread.

People get ranty about the most oddest of things... hopefully most people won't pay any attention.

Cervical screening saves lives ~ fact! Play with your own health as much as you want but keep your shovel in your own garden and be thankful you actually have the choice.

That would be fine if I was not included in a scheme I had never agreed/consented to be part of. All well and good your views are respected but those who have never consented and object can get lost and we have no option but to go out NHS Care. Lovely.

If it was opt in so patients could opt in if they wanted too there would not be this debate and patients would not be left with no choice but to avoid NHS care.

I don't see a debate.. I see a rant with no substance. You get a letter so chuck it out. Don't meep on all outraged about bugger all.

Its not just the letter its being hounded by the GP/Nurse too. What is wrong with informed choice and why is it that those of who decline face loads of hounding?

People are hounded because most people are basically lazy. Many would fall by the wayside if it was opt in. That is not an informed choice. That is lazyness and lives would be lost.

You are cutting your nose off to spite your face by deregistering. I'm sure that the gp is really not that bothered.

Something is very wrong with NHS as those who have made an informed choice fail to have it respected repeatedly.

Opt In would solve the problem and people could make their informed decisions about their health.

Oh GP will not be happy GP income is falling year on year. I worked in the NHS for years dealing with GP finances/ reimbursements.

I do agree that if you actively state that you wish to opt out and state that you have considered the consequences, that you shouldn't then be hounded, but opt in is definitely not the answer. I'm glad the nHS scoop up the lazy and apathetic ones by hounding them. Your case is different and your wishes should be respected, but that is the exception rather than the norm.

The worry is Shew as Dr Margaret McCartney the Glassgow degree also says how many women are avoiding the NHS with significant symptoms (unrelated to gynae issues) due to not having their right to opt out respected.

I will not be the only patient who's opt out is not being respected. I suspect I am the tip of iceberg.

However I will not tolerate nonsense told my GP unless he dergistered he would face a GMC complaint. It may be still worth complaining to the GMC re the amount of pressure I was put under as he ignoring patient consent.

I had a problem with opting out of breast screening. Every three years I get the letter and every three years I leave a message I will not be going and asking to be removed from the list. I then get a form to sign that (incorrectly) sets out the benefits of screening, doesn't mention the downsides and asks me to sign to the effect that I accept all responsibility for my action. I don't sign, because I object to the refusal of my simple request, three years later it all starts again. Next time I just won't turn up and won't bother to tell them.

Higgle you should not sign their opt out form. There is no legal requirement to do so under the DPA if you say you do not wish to be contacted then they should not contact you.

It is worth you make a complaint about this to the Information Commissioner as it may help other woman facing this issue.

Its the same principle as junk/promotional mail under the DPA if you say no contact the NHS cannot legally contact you. The NHS regularly flouts the DPA and often acts unlawfully with regard these issues and confidentiality. The Information Commissioner is well aware of this. I have spoken to them.

I too have the same issue with Breast Screening. However cervical smear tests are even worse as GP's get paid for them so plus letters you have GP's/Nurses physically hounding you on the phone and in consultations too, without as you say telling you the downsides.

I still don't understand this thread!! If you don't want a smear chuck the letter and forget about it. But it's a phobia and irresponsible to promote it as an educated or responsible choice. I'm scared of the dentist but I don't want my teeth to fall out do I go if I've got a problem- even if I need to be valiumed up- surely this is the same thing (only, I'm pretty sure, way more serious as you could more easily die from a lack of smear as the symptoms are often silent).

This thread is actually mad. I feel like I've missed something HUGE here. If you've got a phobia of internal examinations then get that sorted- don't dismiss smears which save lives. Lots of lives.

Honey, I have come on to this thread to offer support, though I have felt the need to name change because of the attitude other women have about the subject.

I stopped going to my previous GP due to the pressure I faced from them to have a smear. I had went previously for something else and had felt under pressure, so when I next went - again for something else - I went with my mother as I was so anxious about being harassed about having a smear.

I left in tears after being treated with utter content by the GP, who not only sneeringly said she didn't know why I had been referred to her in the first and then she preceded to harass me about a smear. My Mum had previously already made the point that I was anxious and did not want to go to the doctor due to my previous treatment. The doctor went on and on and was very aggressive about making me have one then and there.

I refused to go to the doctors for a number of years after that. There were times during that period I needed a doctor but completely refused to go. The actions of the doctor had completely destroyed my trust in doctors to listen and respect how I felt and to respect the principle that consent is only valid if it is not done so under undue pressure.

It took me some time to find another GP surgery that would accept me. In the end I did and made them put on my notes not to even ask about a smear. They actually said they have had several similar requests and understood that it was causing quite a bit of distress to other women. I asked them to stop sending letters, but they said they had no control over it and were unable to help me remove myself from any mailing list. Every time I receive one of these letters it causes me to end up in floods of tears. I find it appalling that I am unable to remove myself from these mailing lists - lists which are farmed out to non-NHS organisations. I personally consider this an invasion of my privacy.

To make it worse, it is impossible to discuss the subject rationally and to discuss the pros and cons of smear testing in an intellectual way, due to the way in which the whole scheme has been marketed to the public in such a bias and unethical way. One of the last NHS campaigns on it was to use pictures of children to guilt women into having a smear. This is just WRONG on so many levels. If the merits of smears is that great then that is the message that should be used, not one that emotionally blackmails women. The whole campaign is not only not properly informing women it also treating them with utter contempt by using a method which immediately plays on emotion and applies undue pressure.

You only have to read threads on MN to see the extent that the campaigns have had. Anyone who questions the effectiveness of smears is shot down and anyone who is anxious has it presented to them as a choice between risking their life and being somehow selfish and pathetic in not wanting a smear. Time and time again, I have seen NO debate on the actual reality which I do see on many other threads about healthcare. This just highlights the extent of the problem and how little women are questioning and feel able to question what they are being told.

I personally think that smears are probably a good thing - for those who make an informed decision.

But the truth is most women do not receive enough information to make an informed decision and many are effectively scared into or bullied into having one. Those who do make an informed decision are frequently disrespected, and have no option to properly remove themselves from the scheme and are lambasted by their peers. Its that bad that I feel the need to name-change to post this message.

Consent is only consent if you have a choice and are given unbiased informed and are not put under undue pressure to conform to what someone thinks you should do.

That is what is wrong with the smear screening and it needs to change. Sadly I do not see it changing anytime soon. If anything, the NHS is going further down this route and very few people are challenging it as the over riding belief is that more testing and screening in healthcare MUST be a good thing and that those who resist it, are in the wrong.

Unfortunately, its a lot more complicated than that and the needs and the differences of the individual need to be not only respected but actually recognised in the first place, rather than treating health as a series of anonymous and cold statistics.

somedizzywhore1804, thank you for illustrating the point so beautifully.

Thank you so much for this Higgle and Underpressure my thoughts exactly.

You are spurring me on to make a complaint with the Information Commissioner as with Banks ( for example) if you say no marketing/promotional literature it should be respected as this this a legal requirement.

The NHS are no different and they acting UNLAWFULLY and breaching the Data Protection Act in sending invitations to patients who have said they want no contact.

Higgle/UnderPressure it would be brilliant if you complained to the Information Commissioner too.

I was a practice nurse and I have performed hundreds of smear tests. I would always explain to my patients what the smear test could and couldn't do. Some women changed their minds and were relieved that I wasn't going to force them to have the test.

I wasn't popular with my colleagues as I refused to convince women to screen just to make the targets we were set. I respected my patient's choice.

When a woman makes an appointment to see a nurse or doctor, her screening history is searched and if she is "overdue" her record is flagged so that the first question she is asked at the consultation is about her smear test. Patients are hounded like outlaws - to be rounded up and talked (bullied) into having a smear test.

You have at most a 10 minute consultation with a HCP. It is really necessary to waste time trying to persuade a reluctant woman into having a test? It a woman wishes to screen,then let her make an appointment. One of my former colleagues took great delight in browbeating her patients onto the couch. I found her attitude most upsetting.

I find the letters and reminders sent to women patronising and paternalistic. I'm not surprised that some women do not engage with the NHS.

Honey, I think you might be pushing your own agenda a bit too much here. OP is afraid, not unwilling to undergo a smear test. You basically say: don't bother, it dont do nuffink anyway. But that is a direct contradiction of some women on this thread whose medical condition has been picked up by the screening.
So OP, please go and talk to your GP about your fear. There was a woman a few pages back who was scared and was helped, I was scared after they found something.. I can tell you that! The great thing was that there was a nurse at the thing I had, a man no less ;-) who did not do anything but sit with me and guide my breathing. He was great. Coached me through the whole thing. Nobody could have done better. I brought a friend as well and I know not everybody wants a friend around when you are spread out like that but I did and she was great too.
There are nice people out there. Good luck.

Hi first time poster, its very much an individual choice but my mother had regular smear tests done and sadly died 6 mnths after her last 1, which was apparantly fine and dandy. Must admit it put me off having it done again. My doctor has said I now should have them done twice yearly, as their is now a history of cervical cancer in my family, go figure how that works.

But I really do think that the PHOBIA is the problem here and that is what should be being addressed. I do understand that the screening process isn't perfect but I'd rather be in it and have a chance it might pick something up than not in it. And to not have access to a GP or NHS care because of a phobia of internal examinations just seems nothing short of ludicrous to me. What if you had a life threatening infection or signs of another form of cancer?! You need access to medical care!!!

Sugarcane were you aware even if you opt with your local NHS England Screening Office the issue the GP contract stipulates even if women that women should be asked to review their decision at least 5 yearly as per RCGP guidelines? This can be part of the QOF review/assessment.

Hence why GP's hound women even if they have formally opt out.

I been part of QOF team going into Practices.

Oneholycow this discussion has become wider than OP orginally question but its all relevant information that is needed to make an informed decision

Somedizzy- Nothing about a phobia lol. I have a long gynae history its about consent and making an informed choice. I have made my choice as SugarCane the Practice Nurses says women's informed choices are not being respected. That is the issue here.

If the NHS cannot respect my decision then sorry I have no trust or faith in them whatsoever and have no wish to consult them about anything.

blaineyboy, one of the problems of screening programmes is that people then rely on them and fall into the false sense of security that because they have been screened and it has come back negative that they are 'safe'.

What we should be doing is emphasising the limitations of screening as part of the process of informing, and making sure that people are aware of any symptoms that should be taken seriously even if they have tested negatively.

OneHolyCow, As for honey pushing an agenda; you may have a point, but it is an agenda that desperately needs to be raised all the same. I do not think it is acceptable to scare women into having a screening any more than it is to scare them out of having a smear.

The debate needs to be completely neutralised in terms of emotion. We need to feel confident that the information we are supplied is unbiased and the doctors who are treating us are doing so because it really is in our best interest and not because it gives them money and makes their targets look better which is currently the case with some (not all) doctors.

If there are people within the NHS raising concerns about this type of coercion within the NHS damaging it, undermining patient confidence and and questioning its ethics I think there is very much a case for supporting debate as much as possible instead of doing what you are doing - trying to silence it.

Let honey, or anyone else who wants to, put the case forward so that others can make their own decision based on different points of view. The absence of another POV and trying to close it down and bully others from raising it is part of the issue imho.

If screening is really that good then there should be enough people able to argue the point in a rational way so the OP can make an INFORMED choice.

It has been mentioned on this thread a few times, but I will repeat it again, if you haven't read Margaret McCartney's book, please do so. Not just for her views on smears, which may persuade some (or may not) but because many of the other issues that it raises about medical ethics. These are issues that are of massive importance and whether you agree or disagree with her, the debate she raises is crucial about the direction in which the NHS is headed and is worth EVERYONE reading. The book is eye opening and does make you question things which is always a good thing, even if you still come to the same conclusions you had previously.

Okay, fair enough it needs a debate but then maybe not in this thread? It seems a bit like riding the wave of fear here and I don't feel easy with that.
I do not plan to take any breast cancer screening things so I'm not all in favour of blindly following screening guidelines either.