Reactions to MMR - how long do they last?

[MrsMoppetMama]

My DD (13 months) had her MMR 11 days ago, she had a bad reaction after about 3 days (high temp and trouble breathing) and we took her to urgent care center. Although this has now passed, she seems to be really out of sorts and has stopped sleeping through. Her normal routine was brilliant as she went down from about 7 - 7. Now she is waking every two hours and is very unhappy. Is this normal? is this because of her MMR or is it just a phase? She has also stopped taking her bottle before bed, is it likely that she has weaned herself? Help! It's been pretty easy going with her up to now so a bit stressed by all this.

Who says vaccinated children are healthier?

On average, vaccinated children will require LESS medication that unvaccinated because they are healthier and have less infections.

Could you provide a reference for that please. I can't find anything I'd take as a reliable source for a comment quite that bold. Plenty of anti-vaccine sites giving data that unvaccinated kids have lower instances of allergies etc, one pro-vax study on 95 children - with quite a few flaws- not least sample size- showing no differences.

I did find this from Reuters saying that vaccinated children had more instances of whooping cough than unvaccinated. And of course there's this study I linked to last week which shows that aP vaccination facilitates parapertussis infection (another cause of whooping cough).

All interesting stuff, but I think this is the sort of thing it's very hard to get a handle on surely?

'Vaccinated children are healthier' sorry but thats 'bull shit', has anyone noticed that there are so many more bugs around sinse they introduced all these vaccines?

I was not vaccinated as a child due to the so called link to epilepsy (we had epilepsy in the family so my mum was adviced not to vaccinate), i had survived measles, mumps, whooping cough but other than that i was rarely ill, never got tummy bugs, rarely needed anti-biotics and never had to go to hospital. Now days kids seem to pick up so many bugs (my kids get tummy bugs at least once a year, throat and ear infections, uti's, strep throat etc...etc...) as do most kids in their class. Illnesses such as chicken pox and whooping cough build up the imune system and makes it stronger to cope with other illnesses surely??

I may be wrong and i'm sure a few of you will disagree.

Measles can be nasty (but most children will cope with it fine), why not vaccinate against measles at a early age but not in a 3 in 1 injection?

And actually iirc that study with the 95 unvaccinated kids (and thousands and thousands of vaccinated ones - just short of twenty thousand iirc) found that the infection rate was higher in unvaccinated children for measles mumps and rubella - and pertussis - (although pertussis seems to be doing strange things this year). Anyway I mean really? No shit sherlock. We needed a study to tell us that? Of course there will be higher rates of infection in an unvaccinated group versus vaccinated. It would be extremely worrying if that wasn't true.

IIRC though the rates of infection for other diseases was the same across the two groups (how much that tells us with a sample size of 95 in one group and thousands and thousands in the other I'm not sure).

Sorry that should have said "Of course there will be higher rates of infection for diseases vaccinated against in an unvaccinated group versus vaccinated. It would be extremely worrying if that wasn't true."

Aaah, but you see I'm not talking about unvaccinated children who are piggybacking on herd immunity.

I'm talking about unvaccinated children who have had measles, mumps, diptheria, whooping cough, rotavirus, HiB etc. After all, if you're willing to let yoru children go unvaccinated and you shout to everyone how terrible these vaccines are, if everyone did as you did, we'd be up shit creek without a paddle would we not?

If you take a population with a million unvaccinated children with all the lovely preventable diseases swirling and circulating freely around and take a million vaccinated children, which population do you think will be healthier? Which population will have more dead, deaf and brain damaged children? This is why vaccinate.

If you're worried about allergies, get a pet rather than leave your kids unvaccinated - all the benefits, none of the risk. Lots of evidence that having a pet works.

My DD had completely impressively clear speech sounds, hundreds of words, until a virus, then lost them overnight and can barely make any clear sounds ..mysteriously :(

Late in her third year too

Fanjo

Wow, how awful :(

How old is she now? Do you have a diagnosis?

Seriously Fanjo? That's exactly what happened to ds1.

Well he didn't have many words as he was too young. But he could say ssss (for snake) and qua qua qua (for duck) and ka for cat or caterpillar and ga for garden and other sounds as well. We have video of him saying them.

All those sounds have gone now. I thought he could say sssss again but I tried the other day and he couldn't.

DS1 can still say most vowel sounds along with n- m- y- d- (sometimes but not on demand) ditto b-. He has one clear word 'mummy', which is nice.

There is a clinic with SALT and ABA trained person who work on teaching those who are non-verbal to talk - although it tends to be single words and a very long process. We tried some of her methods for about a year or so (for so long as ds1 enjoyed them) but found that ds1 could pick up some sounds, but they would slip and he would lose them again. So we've gone down the electronic talker route instead, which is working really well.

She is 5.9. We have autism DX, and HAD a chromosome microdeletion DX but were then told that was an error

here Risca Solomon is the person you need. I don't think you need a dx, but if you were interested on working on speech she would be the person to talk to. We've decided not to in ds1's case.

Elaine: yes I understand the official reasoning but it's unethical to produce untrustworthy trials that don't demonstrate the true risk of a vaccine and then pretend that they do and roll out mass programmes based on those trials.

For example: cervarix was tested against havrix, which contains the same adjuvant as cervarix. The adjuvant is one of the most powerful immune stimulants manufactured. Havrix has the same adverse events (many auto immune related) reports as Cervarix -- therefore the adverse events reported with Cervarix looked little different to background incidence. So the boosts the apparent safety indicator of Cervarix.

You do see why that's misleading don't you?

"Big pharma does bad things"

no shit sherlock

DD could sing whole nursery rhymes completely clearly then suddenly started mispronouncing words overnight then lost all her speech over about a week, now just babbles

Thanks saintly, that is really interesting, I hope she can help DD, who is getting very frustrated

which population do you think will be healthier?

we have a very unhealthy childhood population with vast lakes of auto-immune dysfunction, including diabetes, asthma, etc etc etc

"No shit sherlock"

hey we cross posted

great minds

no brainer

[a proper peer reviewed paper, not something bizarre from the crankosphere btw]

ooooohhhhh now I see your agenda

DS1 was ill at 11 months. Quite badly ill, so was treated fairly aggressively - and his very early words started to go after that. The striking thing for us though was the loss of sounds.

I had actually forgotten how many sounds and consonants he had until I checked out some video (PFB so we had video of every waking moment). In the video he is laughing at various animals and saying all these back of the throat sounds like qua and kuh effortlessly which we have spent years trying to teach him.

They're definitely the people to contact.

Although for ds1 his talker has been pretty life changing. He has a voice tha everyone understands now, and it's helping his language development as well. He probably made more progress in the last 6 months in language (since getting the talker) than he has in the previous post-regression 12 years.

Yes accuracy. My agenda is indeed evidence based on the scientific method. I have been uncovered!

I don't know if I could bear to watch video of DD.

She started by saying. 'heppy' and 'gerden' for 'happy' and. 'garden' then it all went.

I used to be smug and proud about her language and think she was gifted ..pride came before a big fall!

I hope DD could use a talker later, she doesn't have the motor planning skills yet