Any old prolapse! Uterus/womb prolapse, rectocele, cystocele, enterocele, urethrocele, incontinence, pelvic floor, anterior and posterior repair, TVT etc part 5

[Piplysmelie]

This is thread 3 of a long-running series of posts from ladies suffering from pelvic prolapses to support each other through the process of diagnosis, repair and recovery.

Here are the previous threads:
Thread 1
Thread 2
Thread 3
Thread 5

Info from BBC Health

What is a pelvic prolapse?

As the muscles, ligaments and supporting tissues in the pelvis become weaker, they are less able to hold in the organs of the pelvis such as the womb (uterus) or bladder.

Gravity pulls these organs down and, in the more severe cases, may appear through the entrance to the vagina.

A variety of problems can occur, depending on where the weakness lies and which organs are able to descend, but in every case there is some degree of prolapse of the vaginal wall, which begins to invert (rather like a sock turning inside out).
Prolapse of the womb or uterus is the most common prolapse, affecting as many as one in eight older women to some degree
Prolapse of the bladder, known as a cystocele, is less common.
Prolapse of the urethra (the tube that carries urine out of the bladder) is known as a urethrocele.
Prolapse of the intestines is quite rare, and known as an enterocele or rectocele.

Symptoms

Symptoms depend on which tissues descend, and how severe the prolapse is.

They may include:
A sense of heaviness or pressure in the pelvis.
The appearance of a bulge of tissue in the genital area, which can be quite alarming, and is often red and sore.
Urinary problems, such as having to urinate more frequently, feeling the need urgently, being incontinent (losing control of the bladder) or, conversely, being unable to pass urine when you need to.
Pain in the pelvis or lower back.
Sexual problems, including pain and decreased libido.
Constipation.
Vaginal discharge or bleeding.

Treatment and recovery

Once a prolapse has developed, surgery to fix the affected organs is usually the only way to cure it effectively.

However, another option is to use a device known as a vaginal ring pessary. This is rather like a contraceptive diaphragm or cervical cap. It's made of silicone or latex, and placed in the vagina to push back the prolapsed organs and hold them in place. Many women happily manage their prolapse this way.

I have bottom issues too Monica and am also being sent for a scan to check for tears. I've got coeliac disease and suffer from collagenous colitis and have the occasional poo accident too. It's really grim :(

ShrodingersMew, sounds like a cystocele. Have you seen your GP? One of the practice nurses at my surgery advised me which GP was the best one to talk to about these sorts of issues.

Hi all and welcome to all the newbies. Haven't been around for a couple of weeks but have had a quick read to see how people are getting on. I am now nearly 6 wks post op tot and anterior repair. Have recovered really well and have been very good. Even managed to get back on the bike for a gentle 6 miles the other day. Felt great to be back out there! I am due to see the consultant on Tues for my post op check and am dreading it as I don't think everything is as it should be. I think the tot and anterior repair have done the job to stop the stress incontinence but I now think I have another problem. At my initial appointment with the GP, before my referral to the consultant, she identified a cystocele and what she thought was a small rectocele. After seeing the consultant he diagnosed the cystocele but mentioned nothing of the rectocele. Now post op, although the cystocele has been repaired, when I go to the loo I can feel another bulge at the back. It is just at the entrance of my fanjo!! Sorry for the tmi here but trying to give a clear picture so someone may have some advice before I see my consultant on Tuesday. When I
Having a bm before my op I had little problems but did have to push on the perineum a little. Now post op I am struggling to go all at once (sorry!!) I am normally a once a day girl!! I have to now push the bowl back in to clear it completely. I also feel like I have a tampon half sticking out all the time!! I am so fed up at the prospect of having another op which is my suspicion. I can only think that the bulge of the cystocele must have been pushing against the rectocele and holding it back. Now the cystocele has been sorted the rectocele has become more apparent. What do you all think and any advice before I see the consultant next week???

Hi Slinikki! Sounds like your suspicions might be right but it is still early days yet. I can only say I hope your symptoms are temporary but when you go for your checkup press them on whether you have a rectocele or not. Don't let them get away with expressions like 'quite lax' - ask them what that means in terms of do you or don't you have one. Fingers crossed for you.

Skinikki, glad to hear you are recovering well, but sorry to hear about the poo problems. What you are describing sounds like a rectocele and if it is, then you are probably right, the cystocele may well have been pushing it back and now that it isn't there any more, the rectocele symptoms have become more apparant.
The consultant should be able to tell when you see him/her next week. In my case it was a finger in my fanjo & a finger up my bum & the consultant could feel where the muscle wall had torn.
Like fengirl, I very much hope your symptoms are temporary too.

I'm sure I'm not alone (in fact I know I'm not) in thinking is it too much to ask for that we can all be fixed in one op? Thinking of all those with worries that things haven't gone right. X

Daisy I have seen the GP, she thinks it's a cystocele and I have an appointment for Gynae on Sept 11th which actually is quite impressive as I only got referred on Wed... Still though, I don't think I can handle it that long, it gets more painful and harder to go to the toilet everyday by the time it hits 7pm I am in tears in the bathroom, I am starting to feel seriously depressed.

I also think I have a rectocele but not sure, the bottom of my fanjo feels all erm, bubbly as well and I can feel poo through the wall and have to push it through with my thumb as pushing doesn't work, I can actually push my thumb through my bum to the outside from inside my vagina.

I can't live like this anymore, it's horrible and I just want to cry constantly. :(

How to put this without sounding Indelicate Shrodinger....is there an actual hole you can push your finger through, so your finger is in fresh air, or is it the vaginal wall you can push out of your anus? Latter sounds like a rectocele, former a fistula (if that's the right term for it)

Skinniki, cycling 6 weeks post op sounds ambitious from all other reports on here. I would wait till aftet you have had a follow up before that level of activity...especially one that Involves pressure on the repaired area. Go carefully.

Vaginal wall. It's disgusting. :(

SchrodingersMew, with regard to the poo thing, I was able to do the same. Pushing your poo through like that is called splinting. I did it for 8 years, because I was too scared to have the op. I finally had the op 2 weeks ago (rectocele & enterocele repair) and haven't been anywhere near my fanjo since! I'm also back to one poo a day, rather than multiple small poos.

Sorry to hear about your bladder problems too, that much pain sounds horrible. I'm glad you have a quick referral.

Post That's exactly the same with me! It's like a million rabbit poos a day. I am sick of the sight of the bathroom. :(

Was the op painful? Did you have trouble convincing them to do it?

Bladder problems are more tiring than anything. I go to bathroom, the flow stops (after I move my urethra about in the first place to do it) I get up and walk to the next room and need to go back to the bathroom. Goes on like this all day, then hits around 7pm and I can't leave the bathroom for ages and it's agony.

I have actually just phoned A&E, I don't think I can wait a month just to be seen, I can't look after my Son properly because I am basically living in the bathroom and always in pain, the size of it seems to be getting worse by the day too.

I'm only 21.

Schrodinger, the bladder thing sounds like it needs more urgent treatment.

The poo think is a bit ick, but it is manageable. The recotocele / enterocele repair has not been painful for me. The worst bit was when they "unpacked" my vagina post-op and even though that was grimly - it was all over in 5 mins. I'm only 2 weeks post-op though & that is all I had done. There are others on here, who have had bladder repairs & posterior repairs (rectocele) at the same time and they'd be better able to tell you more about how that went.

I know nothing about bladders - but I really hope you get some help soon. Big hugs to you.

Unfortunately it's something lots of us are all too familiar with :(
But I am 43 and have had 3 childten and my family is complete. 21 sounds horribly young to be having to deal with this sort of thing.

I know that advice seems to be wait till you are done having children, but it definately sounds like you need something done sooner, especially if you are in a lot of pain :( Could you have an Infection? I understand that infections are common with cystoceles and urethroceles.
Not sure how the op itself impacts on future pregnancies though. I would imagine sections would be necessary.

I discovered splinting after reading this thread, and though unpleasant, not nearly as unpleasant as a still full bowel.

Post Thanks for the hugs. :) Needing them right now.

I know that is poo thing is manageable and I definitely need to get the bladder thing seen to quicker. I don't know if I can wait a month, living in the bathroom hell and am worried what the Dr will say. I mentioned the probems to my GP at around 6 month PP and was told that it can be fixed with surgery but I would have to wait until I am finished having children.

I do want another but I can't live like this so I think I am just going to have to agree and stop at 1. It's not as if I would be able to concieve in this state anyway (not having sex).

I was checked for infection the other day, no infection. :(

I know what you mean about the splinting, tbh it's the only thing that has kept me sane.

Shrodinger, c-section would be an option.

IKWYM re lack of sex. Someone upthread mentioned "outercourse" Don't even get that here as I am so worried about leaks that I can't get enthusiastic at all, and helping DH get rid of sexual tension just makes me feel like a wankrag. DH isn't complaining, yet, but I sense his growing resentment :(

:( I kind of have the opposite, DP doesn't want to go near me and avoids the "why" question. :( I have asked him today if he's just happy for us to be a completely sexless couple and he kind of shrugged and said he doesn't know. :(
I don't want to lose my sex life at this age and I don't want anyone else but him. I don't know why he doesn't want it and it's making me really paranoid. I'm happy to attempt it and see what happens, how painful etc.

This is including "outercourse".

I guess I do get how you feel though and it must be awful on the other side of the not wanting to have sex thing, which is why I have stopped pushing DP.

sdmew what an awful situation to be in and also at such a young age - I really feel for you

Skinniki I am so shocked that you are cycling at six weeks!

I am feeling much better now that I know what I am doing and the week has flown by trying to sort out work and family things ready for next week. I am struggling to sleep at night but am putting this down to anxiety.

For those of you who wish to partake in my TMI q's here goes (and apologies to those of you who don't)

Vaginal packs - erm what are they? Are they uncomfortable and can you sit up etc? Is it really painful when they take them out?
Compression stockings - are they always used?
Bleeding - how much should I expect? Is it really heavy, does it last long?
Does the Fanjo really feel tighter better when it is healed
Is there alot of swelling and bruising etc?

Thank you to anyone that can answer any of these! ... I dont know who else to ask!

vaginal packs - after the op they stuff your fanjo with bandage type stuff. They don't always do it, but my consultant said he packs most pre-menopausal women. I felt like I had 100 yards of the stuff being pulled out - but I'm sure that was my over-wrought imagination.

Compression stockings - these are horrid. I have to wear mine for 6 freaking weeks. Apparently, pelvic surgery has a higher risk of DVTs.

Don't know about fanjo tightness yet!

I didn't have alot of swelling & bruising - way, way, way less than a forceps delivery with an episotomy & tearing!!!!

Lol @ Bladder! I was waiting for some questions that were real shockers!

A big collective hug I think.

Bladderama - I remember the packing reminding me of a magician pulling flags from his sleeve. I also want to say that as women who have had children we've already had to cope with trauma to our bodies and I can only speak for myself but my repair for a rectocele was nowhere near as bad as I envisaged. There was a lot of focus on pain relief and I continued to take ibrufen and paracetamol as recommended for roughly a week. The packing was taken out in the evening on the day after my op. Because I was cathetarised and packed I didn't get up but could use the controls on the bed to sit myself up. The time went very quickly. With reiterate the importance of keeping 'things' moving - I bought dried prunes and liquorice and had some magnesium (something) from the hospital. It is the recovery time that needs care and I've mentioned this before - you need plenty of rest and tlc. Bleeding - period-like for me. The slightly larger ultra towels are good - not particularly the night ones but the thinner ones didn't feel too comfortable for me. Fanjo - still dealing with a cystocele but the back wall feels great.

Bladder, to add to what Post has written already, you can put the bed up with the pack in. It's not comfortable but not painful, like a tampon that's too dry IME. I stocked up on maternity pads as they are more cushiony on the area (!) but bled far less than I expected. I also had anti-clotting injections as well as the stockings and did them myself (amazingly) and they weren't too bad. It all varies from hospital to hospital. I can't comment on tightness as you can still drive a double-decker bus up there (slight exaggeration) and having a perineal repair as well as rectocele repair and will argue with them about the urethrocele nearer the time.

Not TMI for me, all useful info, My hospital phoned and offered me a date in a couple of weeks, unfortunately we will be away for the whole time in between and they couldn't schedule the pre-op so I have to wait again, but hopefully not much longer. Am starting to feel panicky about the childcare aspect, my two are 6 and 8 and I spend an awful lot of time ferrying them here, there and everywhere in termtime.

I've been wondering about the immediate aftermath, having had forceps/episiotomy/masses of stitches with the first DC, can it be any worse? Maybe that's where it all goes wrong, I was up and about within hours of that lot, home and business as usual in a couple of days, it must have all put far too much strain on everything. But no one told me how careful I needed to be with my stitches.

Does anyone know if I will need to have a Mirena coil removed for rectocele repair? I'd rather keep it in or get it replaced while on the table as I'm worried that a sudden change in hormones might make the aftermath a whole lot worse. I ought to ring the hospital and ask.

Hi everyone,

I'm new to the forum - I've just discovered it and have found the posts really useful (as well as hightly amusing!!). My prolapse symptoms have been getting worse since the birth of the last of my 4 children. I have tried to ignore them and suck up my pf muscles for years until a friend recommended a lady in nearby Leeds - she is a leading Urogyny specialising in all types of female incontinence and pf repair.

LackaDaisy - her name is Ms Christine Landon at the Nuffield in Leeds. I was referred to her through the NHS choose and Book System and by asking for an appt on a Tues am - I got to see her directly. She was fantastic, answered all my q's and diagnosed a large rectocele and moderate cystocele. She said she does 8! procedures per week and has put me on her 6 wk waiting list. Please go and see her I'm sure she will help you. I'm still waiting for a date so will keep you posted.

Whoknows, had similar deliveries to you & I don't remember anyone telling me not to lift, drive, or even take it easy after the births either. Particularly with DC2, I was heaving DC1 around after 2nd degree tearing and I can't believe that didn't contribute to the problems.
My DCs are a little older than yours & I was worried about how I'd cope too. However, it hasn't been too bad so far. I got my parents to look after them for the first week (as I'm on my own), then I had a week with them & they've been on holiday with their dad for a few days this week. The biggest problem for me was not being able to drive for a month, which is why I went for the summer holidays, as the holidays are the only time I didn't have to drive to do the school run.

I've been signed off work for 6 weeks, but my plan is to go back after a month - but just do half days for 2 weeks.
I was really wiped out for the first week, so I'd say you definitely need some help then.