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Original poster

Help me make sense of MMR - hype or theory

941 replies

felicity10 · 17/02/2011 20:53

OK, so I've been through a few pages of previous posts, I must be missing something because I can't make sense of it!

DD is 1 and I've had a letter about the vacs from the GP. I've heard about the MMR in the news few years ago and about the link to autism, but I just would really value your views.

Single vacs with no mumps or the MMR? Confused Can anyone point me in the direction of key MMR issues?

I just don't want to get to the gp's and then feel like I am getting bullied into having the mmr - it is normally very no nonsense nurses who barely speak english, so will be unlikely to give me a clear answer as to any risks.

I am amazed that we have this lack of clarity in the UK.

Many thanks in advance!

OP posts:
rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 19:59

"because the majority of studies aren't finding what you're trying to show."

do we have to go through this again?

The studies you link to, stata, are accepted by the scientific community as being weak -- and so poorly designed that even if there was a correlation, the stuides wouldn't pick up on it.

why, why, does this need to be repeated so many times

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 19:59

SEeker, sorry to be low: I think I was low. I hope your mum gets better.

ChunkyPickle · 03/03/2011 20:00

rightpissedoff:

While we're on the subject of GSK...don't know how much I ought to say really.. but you could check out the staff movements between UK immunisation policy dept and GSK.

Well, they're all immunoligists no? In my industry you'll find that a lot of us have worked for the same companies/governing bodies too.

It's not a conspiracy - it's that if you want someone with experience (I would hope that you want someone who understands the issues making policy on it!) then they need to have got that experience somewhere, and where else are they going to get it than at a company in the industry??

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 20:03

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

StataLover · 03/03/2011 20:04

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 20:07

No -- you have accused mothers on this thread of belonging to the "anti-vax" movement. You've accused those mothers of lying about their children. They are therefore by your own admission the object of your ridicule. Disgusting. Apologise.

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 20:08

Beach is right - you do need to get a grip.

Beachcomber · 03/03/2011 20:09

Hey stata, do you know what?

Why don't you come round to mine and make a funny video about my daughter!

We could make up a song!

Here's a couple of ideas;

You could take the piss out of me for looking endlessly for a doctor who was willing to document her having reacted badly to a DTP vaccine which has since been withdrawn for being unsafe!

I could take the piss out of you for having a PHD and yet not being very clear on what a control group is and when/why it is relevant!

Think of the fun we could have.

Beachcomber · 03/03/2011 20:13

Sorry to hear about your mum seeker. Sad

No worries on the commenting on the science stuff - sorry if I was sarky about that.

StataLover · 03/03/2011 20:23

Yes, indeed. Real children. Who will die from vaccine preventable diseases due to the scaremongering of the anti-vax movement.

Aaah, I think I get it. Do you use the word 'study' to refer to a 'case-control' study? Or a randomised control trial? Since they both have controls and they're both types of studies, I'm not sure what type of study the generic word 'study' is applying to.

ArthurPewty · 03/03/2011 20:28

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StataLover · 03/03/2011 20:33

I haven't accused anyone of anything rpo! Goodness, you're so incredibly dramatic, always taking offence (and ever ready to give!). I pointed out that not all stories of vaccine damage are true - if yours is, then you know that's not you. I haven't accused anyone of lying - i asked if it's a possibility that someone, in all the anecdotes, could be making it up. Again, if that's not you, all well and good. On the other hand, I believe on numerous ocassions you've accused many people of lying - including the GMC, BMJ, Lancet, Elsevier etc. Why is it OK for you to do that?

And I've always been very pleased to hear that you're not fully fledged members of the anti-vax movement despite your devotion to St Andy.

StataLover · 03/03/2011 20:44

So what kind of study are you referring to with the word study? I'm still very confused. Confused as to why a case series study isn't actually a study.

I'm more than happy to explain to you the different types of study as used by most of the scientific community if you're interested and what they mean. We can then compare and see if they match up.

ArthurPewty · 03/03/2011 20:51

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StataLover · 03/03/2011 20:56

Absolutely fine to question stories that might seem dubious. I agree.

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 20:57

Oh bollocks. Yeah me too. Except Fiona Godlee never emailed me.

Leonie, I do believe you're Spartacus. [smiel]

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 21:00

A [smiel] is a rueful or shamefaced smile doncha know.

StataLover · 03/03/2011 21:00

Richard Horton is doing fabulous work promoting global health, gawd bless him. He's great. he's so nice that I couldn't possibly imagine him lying. My intuition tells me so. So you're wrong on that one.

rightpissedoff · 03/03/2011 21:01
StataLover · 03/03/2011 21:01

And I'm still waiting to be enlightened why a 'case series study' is not a study????

silverfrog · 03/03/2011 21:03

so he wasn't lying when he described the 1998 paper as "an excellent case series - good science, which still stands" then?

rememebr this was when he was appearing for the prosecution at the gmc trial you are so fond of quoting form.

he also wasn't lying, I take it, when he said he wished the paper could be considered on its own merits?

StataLover · 03/03/2011 21:03

Oh, that's too bad RPO :(

StataLover · 03/03/2011 21:04

Well them we're all in agreement that Richard Horton is not a liar and his public retraction of the 1998 lancet paper was also not a lie

StataLover · 03/03/2011 21:05

silverfrog, please please tell me why a case series study isn't a study?

ArthurPewty · 03/03/2011 21:06

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