Post Natal Depression/Panic Attacks

[Giz]

I'm new to this and also feeling low so bear with me......My son (my 1st baby) was born in feb 2000. I felt alright to begin with but then in the May I started getting really weepy and always felt tired, I didn't want to go out of the house, kept putting off visitors and just couldn't stop crying then in the June I was out at the local shops buying urgently needed baby supplies. I'd left my purse in the car and had to leave my shopping at the checkout whilst i went to get the purse. I returned back and a small queue had built up so I apologised to the people waiting and the the woman was very nasty in her reply to my apology.......I just lost it - uncontrollable sobbing, wailing like a mad woman. The staff at the shop were brilliant, they moved the people to another till and carried my shopping to the car. The checkout lady took the time to talk to me and gave me hug, she asked how old my baby was etc etc and she gave me look of complete and geninue support. It was then i realised things were not right so I went to my doctor.....She was wonderful and wanted to put me on anti-depressants but i was really worried about becoming dependant on them, she explined all the possibilites to me and I started on a form of anti-depressant. She said I'd need to be on them for a minimum of 6 months and then she'd reduce the dosage slowly as it's not good to just stop taking them one day. I did start to pick up I didn't get to what i considered my 'normal self' but i was not as bad as i had been. I could cope with going out more little by little. Then we had all the stress of moving. We moved and my old doctor who was lovely wrote a letter to my new doctor explaing what i was going through and at what stage we were at. I went to my new doctors as my prescription needed re-newing (i was only given a monthly supply). This was in the Sept so I'd been on the A/D for 2 & half months. The New doctor was horrid, she just read the letter, wrote out a months prescription and said "your baby is almost 8 months old you really shouldn't be on these now, only you can make yourself better". I tried to explain that although my son was almost 8 months i had not actually been on the tablets that long, but she just handed the prescription and said "yes well you'll have to do it on your own sometime" I got outside and just cried and cried. I was in a new town, no friends I could talk to, a doctor who didn't listen or seem to care - I just went home as fast as I could. Needless to say I didn't go back to the doctor again. I never re-newed my prescription and so stopped the A/D suddenly at the end of Oct 2000. I did go through a really bad time, i wouldn't go out at all, I didn't even get washed or dressed. But my son was always clean, dressed and idolised, all my time is focused on him. My husband kept saying "you've got to get out more I can't do all the shopping as well and the baby needs to get out and get fresh air, and xmas is coming need to get things for that" I didn't do any xmas shopping or anything my husband did it all. Then he said about taking our son to see santa in a grotto, his 1st xmas etc. I knew I had to do it and be there for my baby so we went out, all together....from then on I've got better ( I'm back to washing & dressing and going out with my son regularly) however I still cry a hell of alot, don't like large crowds of people activitites (for example I take my son swimming lessons as only 3 others in his class). But I'm getting weary and can't get past this last bit, can't stop crying over silly little things. My son is almost 15 months old. My husband is talking about a second child.......I don't know if I'm over this depression from the 1st one yet. In all others ways i feel ok to deal with another baby but then if i get PND again will it hit harder if i'm not over this bit. I feel so alone, I felt so positive i would get through this when i was with my old doctor but now i feel like i'm fighting a battle i just can't win!!

IS THERE ANY TIME LIMIT ON HOW LONG PND CAN LAST?

HAS ANYONE ELSE GOT IT MONTHS AFTER THE BIRTH INSTEAD OF IMMEDIATELY?

ANY IDEAS OF HOW TO GET PAST THIS LAST HURDLE?

I Had mild PND after my last baby (2nd child) & it was awful, I sympathise completely with what you are going through. I did manage to get through it on my own, but it took about 2 years. I was lucky in that I had 2 friends with 2 kids the same age ( less than 2 yrs apart) so we all supported each other. A friend of mine had very bad PND after the birth of her first, which didn't kick in til about 4 months. It took her a long time to get over it, with the help of her doctor. When she had her second, she went onto AD almost immediately and it didn't last anywhere near as long. Perhaps you should try changing your doctor, maybe talk to your hv & see if she can recommend someone more sympathetic. Just keep telling yourself that you will get through this - you sound like you are doing really well at the moment - keep it up!

Gis, it sounded like you were really starting to get back on track and then the new Dr offered you no support at all. I think you need to find a Dr you really click with, because it is an important relationship in helping you get better. I suffered depression about 10 years ago and when I moved, I ended up with a fantastic Dr who said if I ever felt like I was anywhere near the edge of that horrible black hole to come and see him etc ... hence I always managed to keep everything pretty much stable because I knew there was some support there. It made a HUGE difference.

I think you need to get back on the tablets just to help you through again for a six month period. I dont know how understanding your husband is with all of this, but now is not really the time to be thinking or discussing Baby 2, you all need to feel happy, secure, stable and ready.

PND doesnt always hit straight after a birth, your gap sounds really common. My friend had a similar experience to you, was just getting by and then got in a pickle in a multi-storey car park with baby, a horrid passers by comment and then problems trying to get the car out. Thats what bought it to head for her. Since then she has had her second baby, she took depressants and joined a PND group (maybe there is one in your area?). Her Dr put her on tablets again just before she had baby 2, and so far her and baby are doing really well.

Your baby is at the nice toddling stage and the sunshine is almost here, you can start to get out and enjoy things together, ducks, farm parks, swings, picnics, start on the little things, a little happy smile from them goes a long way in helping you. I hope things get better for you soon.

Hi Gis, I too had PND. My case was very severe (had a total breakdown) and I'm still taking a small dose AD 2 years on and just starting to cut the dose. I felt absolutely fine about 8 month ago and (under my doctors supervision) started to cut down but I really went backwards so upped the dose again. I think you probably need to go back on them again for a few months just to get you back to normal. Don't worry, they're not addictive and you'll be able to come off them slowly in a short while. I feel great now and just cutting back very slowly.
Your second doctor was wrong. You can't get over PND on your own if you've got a bad case. It's amedical condition and you need medication just like with any other illness. Is there another doctor in your practice you could see?
If not then I think you just need to bite your lip, ask for the tablets and ignore her response if she isn't very supportive.
RE> another baby. You definately need to feel better before you get pregnant. But once you do you can take a low dose of AD as soon as the baby is born. Quite a lot of evidence suggests that this can prevent a recurrence.

Good Luck.

Hi just wanted to offer support. Firstly can you see a different doctor? And secondly, I have suffered with mild PND after all 3 of mine and only realized after no.2, my doctor referred me for cognitive therapy, I didnt go further than seeing the counsellor as I recovered without help that time, but it can be very helpful apparently. You definitely need more support, try UKparents -they have a PND forum, you will find people in the same boat there, and of course you should find loads of help here, -hope this helps, please let us know how you get on.

Hello Gis,

My situation is very similar to many that I've read today It really was good to know that I'm not alone. My daughter is three in August and I've had PND or depression as I know call it near enough sionce she was born. When she was 15 months I went to the doctor and was presribed AD's which did help a lot. In November last year I weaned myself slowly off them and all was fine until february this year (who knows what triggerd it). It all went wrong and I was very depressed. Luckliy I knew the symptoms and wnet straight back to my GP and am back on the AD's. Slowly thiongs are getting better and I am receiving excellent couselling. I have a very supportive husband and family so in time I hope to get better. But this time I'm in no hurry to come off the tablets.

Just to say thanks to you all for your replies, it's helped a lot knowing other people have gone through it as well. Must admit though I was crying all the time I was reading all the messages, but i think it was from relief to hear from such supportive people (who don't even know me!).

I think I'm finding harder as I have no friends to talk to about it all since I moved. However, I'm going to be brave and book myself another appointment at the GP's to see another doctor....I'l let you know how it goes.....but THANKS TO EVERYONE you were great!!

Coming in late, here, but The Association for Post-Natal Illness might be of use to anyone suffering from PND. www.apni.org

Giz - I think you are courageous to share all this. I hope writing it down helped a bit. I don't know anything about PND myself but have you considered talking to a counsellor so you can put some of the worst parts of the last 15 months behind you. Clear away the nightmares and save your energy for what's ahead.

Good luck

I am not the sort of person people expect to moan,I am the reliable person.I do not have a single friend and a partner who is a waste of space.But I have two delightful children.After my 2nd was born last may I started to feel a bit down.I thought it was baby blues.It has slowly progressed to feeling terrible.I don't think I have PND but i have most of the same problems.Icry when I'm alone I am tired all the time i'm lonely fat and feel horrible.Somedays I feel fine,9 out of 10 i feel like I do today,crap.I grew up with my grandparents so anything like PND was frowned upon saying it was a new fangled thing no one had it in there day!
I have been to my GP who told me it was stress because my blood pressure was up too.I have seen another GP who said it was due to the contraceptive pill which I have changed twice. Sorry to go on like this but I just feel so alone.
Have I just got stress?
Can anyone help with any advice?

Max, you are not alone. I know lots of people, myself included, who have been hit by depression months after the birth. As for your GP stating your blood pressure could be up because of stress - no shit sherlock! Of course you are are stressed, you have two young children for heavens sake! However, I always think it's worth asking for blood tests - you could be anaemic, your thyroid gland could be playing up (happened to me yonks ago, felt extremely stressed - thought because of new man, new home, new job - turned out had very overactive thyroid gland and needed surgery) in fact it could be a number of medical things that are just adding to your load. So if you aren't happy go back and ask for more help. This applies to you too Giz as your new doctor sounds like a right old xxxxx. I'm lucky, I have a fab GP who has been very supportive but others are absolute harpies that need a good kick up the butt before they give the help they should! I don't understand why people go into a caring profession if they don't have an ounce of compassion in them - so if they don't help you switch GP's and complain about them to your local health authority. Rant over. I am now climbing off my soap box and taking some deep breaths.

well i feel that women should all give each other a pat on the back because dont we cope with it all???
my first child was an emergency cesarian and due to this i didnt bond with him at all and was back at full time work within 10 weeks. god what a state i was in.it took about 2 years to get some where with myself and i went to workshops on dealing with these feelings i was having towards my son.
anyway on the road to recover and pregnant with my daughter and working with abused children i went into business in a little shop and worked my butt off to then have a baby 6 weeks early and 3lb 6oz and then i had an asthma attack . oh god.
but on the third child i used a lot of rescue remedy and my oils. things were noy easy for me and there were stresses at home but this was the most beautiful third cesarian i could imagine .
I felt i had got a grip and i felt in control of the birth.
i called the shots and this was my baby... my life and i was going to live it.
so come on all you mums out there you are doing one ace job and creating the next generation of life .. xx

giz, after reading your first message it sounds to me as if you were well on the way to getting over the actual PND when you had to move and the stress of that probably kicked you into normal depression - if you see what i mean.

i didn't have PND with my first child, but when she was 15 months we moved back to england (we'd been living in america) and we went through months of living with in-laws, finding house, buying house, husband finding job etc., all of which i coped with, but it was a new place and i didn't really know anybody, and with me it was when we started to settle down a bit and get to know people that the let-up from the stress got to me and i was weepy and useless and horrible to my daughter for weeks...

you have certainly been very unlucky with your GP - she deserves to be reported for her attitude to you. counselling and a temporary return to ADs, as others have suggested, should help you get over this last little hump - you are obviously stronger than you were but you do need more professional support; could you write to your old GP to tell her the situation and ask for her advice?

good luck, anyway, giz - you deserve some!

This all rings very true for me! I am 3 weeks away from the arrival of number 2, but had severe post natal depression with my first daughter. To say that I am starting to feel a bit anxious is a bit of an understatement! I had Millie in London and found that my GP/health visitor there were hopeless and did not take me very seriously at all (despite the fact that I made 3 visits to see my doctor in the first month because I "just didn't feel right.." but was told to go home and get some rest and I would be OK!) However I am now with a fantastic doctor in Hertfordshire, am already taking a mild dose of seroxat (which is apparently safe in pregnancy) and I am just trying to be as positive as I can be about the new baby. I have much more support this time - my husband is great, my family is all very close by and ready to help - and I hope that all this coupled with the ADs, I won't have such an awful time. Does anyone have any tips on how to give myself the best possible start this time round? I have really grown to love being a Mum and thoroughly enjoy life with Millie now (despite such a shaky start!) and I really hope that I don't have to go through such an awful trauma this time around.

millie, i don't really know about PND as such but from what you say it sounds as if you have already given yourself the best possible chance - having a built-in support system, plus knowing that you have a great relationship with no 1 despite the bad start, should be enough to get you through almost anything.

having the second is quite a lot harder work than having the first (there is a message board about that!) so take any chances you're offered to have millie (are you both called millie or have you just borrowed her name?) entertained elsewhere, short of her feeling excluded - the first 6 weeks can be an organisational nightmare and it helps if you can rest and concentrate on feeding etc without the big one hanging around your neck!

i'm sure others will be able to give you more specific encouragement but good luck anyway!

There is a lot said about depression after birth, but what about before?

My daughter was unplanned, and though I decided to go ahead with the pregnancy, I was far from happy with it, I even considered adoption. The more pregnant I became, the worse my depression got. I started to get paranoid, I would hear strange noises in the house, often even see things out of the corner of my eyes. Sometimes I became convinced that something terrible was going to happen to me and/or the baby. Often my delusions would center on the baby itself, I would picture it as a demon, possessing me. I did not get treatment for this until I was 7 months pregnant and damn nearly killed myself. Then I got all the help and support I needed!

I went on the Dalton Regime after the birth to prevent PND, which it did, and I now take the mini-pill will gives me an added boost of progesterone, as I was diagnosed as having too much oestrogen. I have set up a website for mothers going through similiar experiences, it covers all aspects of an unplanned pregnancy and tells more about the Dalton Regime. If anyone is interested it is at: unplannedpregnancies.freeservers.com.

Depression is an illness - don't forget to push for your rights and NEVER be told that you are a hyprocrondriac!

Hi..felt compelled to write a message as I am fee4ling very much on my own and very WEIRD. I have been havig severe panic attacks for the last 3 months. My son as born in July and everything was so wonderful, which is why I felt it so hard to accept that I was eeling so awful, when everything shouls be OK (especially around Christmas when I was feeling my worst!) Doctor has prescribed Metazapine (zispin) After 3 weeks now, agitation and anxiety and panic feel worse than ever nad I feel completely spaced out. Went back today and have been told they can take up to 6 weeks to kick in. Does this mean I have to face feeling awful and panick for another 2 weeks? I don't know?

Has anyone else felt like this?

I feel short tempered, anxiousm andry, panicky all at the same time, it even waked me in the night, waking up in a sweat...awful...

I'm fed up with it and scared I'm never goig to feel right again. I've started drinking more as well to soften these edgy nervous feelings.

Help!

please....

Maxipie, I really feel for you, firstly what you are describing sounds exactly what happened to me, it really is truly awful. It does take a while for the anti-depressants to kick in, and they do tend to make you feel worse until you have taken them for a while, but do not worry (i know easily said), then will kick in and you will feel a bit better every day, which gives you that feeling of control back in your life.

I really do understand exactly what you are going through, and if you want to take to me further about this ask mumsnet to pass you email address on to me and i would be happy to write to you. Good luck, remember you will get better.

I remember taking ages to get off to sleep, only to wake 30 minutes later in a cold sweat and feeling panicky.

just seen that Sadie Frost has been admitted to hospital suffering from severe post natal depression after giving birth to her fourth child.

Hi everyone - have been feeling really terrible for last 3 days. Dreadful panic attacks and depression. I've been fine for ages but have been trying to come off seroxat. Allibubbles - are you still around - would you mind telling me again how you finally managed to get off it. I just feel like I've got no control over this.

Hi Kizzie. I don't know the answer to your question, but I didn't want to leave your question without an answer, if you see what I mean! I suffered from depression during my pregnancy, and was given progesterone treatment from the moment my daughter was born, which prevented me from getting pnd. However I have started a website which deals with both ante-natal and post-natal depression as well as other issues surrounding pregnancy at www.unplannedpregnancies.co.uk. It details alternative treatments and their effectiveness, and other women's experiences.
I should imagine that with anti-depressants, just like other drugs, coming off them will be an uphill struggle. You will have good days and bad days. These past three days may just be a glitch for you, you might find yourself feeling better again in a while as your body adjusts. I hope so anyway. Good luck.

Maxipie. I had terrible panic attacks and woke every night gasping for breath. I had to force myself to breathe, it was awful and I have so much sympathy for you. It will go though, I knew I couldnt live with these attacks and, with the right medication and therapist, I recovered. Now I am absolutely fine, I know you will get yours under control too. It is such a difficult and scary time for you but it will pass, it really will.

Have you looked at the thread "Coming off my pnd drugs"? There are a lot of others in the same boat, so maybe by pooling together you can get the support you need to pull through this.

Thanks for the messages - I'll definately have a look at the website. If anyone else has managed to beat panic attacks without medication I'd be really grateful if you could pass on any tips.

When I got panic attacks, the first thing I would do is tell dh. He would then distract me by asking something to do with Sherlock Holmes (as I'm a big fan), so he would say "What's that story with the guys with the red hair, Copper Beeches isn't it?", it isn't so I would argue with him and then get the book out to prove it. The point is that it distracted me long enough to stop the panic attack from progressing.
So my advice is, the moment you feel yourself going panicky, give yourself a task to do. Even if it's the middle of the night, go and clean the fridge, or write out a cheque to pay the bill. Anything to take your mind off it completely, preferably something mundane as then you will relax back into normality. Once I had done this and realised that half an hour had gone and nothing terrible had happened, I could relax a little and go back to bed.

Ask your GP to refer you to a Community Psychiatric Nurse, they have loads of tips on how to deal with anxiety, depression and panic attacks, and they often run workshops too.

HTH.