**the 7th Tamoxifen Thread **

[MaryAnnSingleton]

here we are...

KK it is so interesting to read about your dad, please tell us more. My dh's grandfather and great uncle were fighting on the otherside. One was a recon photographer shot down, and never found over Soviet Union, the other was a doctor, Hilter made all those who wanted to be doctors have to join up during 1930's, so he was a doctor in North Africa, following Rommell. He was caught by the Russians in April 1945, and sent to Russian POW camp in Siberia, he was finally released in 1956, and his family then lied to smuggle him out of East Germany to the west. He only died a couple of years ago, I loved him to bits. He was taught English my a man matching my Grandfather's description in Berlin just before the war began, my grandfather reported Jewish students disappearing in the middle of the night, and was the recipient of a night time visit from the SS and told he had 24 hours to get out of germany, before he find himself with the same fate. He came home and joined up! Sorry I have hi-jecked thread now, but I find the amazing experiences of our relatives facinating.

Phil, I took a dear friend with me for my first appointment, everyone on here told me it would be a good idea, and they were so right. She kept me going, and was able to drive me home. I hope you have someone who you can share this burden with, and let them support you.

Cakes - I am glad that you haven't caught the vomitting virus.

SR the party sounds like they really behaved themselves. I am quite impressed.

MAS you will do a fantastic job with the illustrations. One step at a time, and I am sure that you will realise that too. It is horrid being hit by the low feelings you described. I get that too, sometimes like a sledgehammer out of nowhere. I listened to an interesting discussion about depression on Radio 2 or 4 (I forget) a while ago. A Dr who studied depression said that when you try to carry on against what your brain feels are impossible odds, you will reach a point where your brain will shut down - a nervous breakdown as it used to be called. To feel down sometimes, cry talk to friends about how you are feeling, talk about the challenges life is throwing at you and appreciate that you can't do everything is the way to keep yourself going and not become clinically depressed. This description perfectly matches my dh, who has clinical depression and has been on anti deps for the last 18 months, since his last breakdown. He actually denies the challenges around him, to himself, and then just reaches a point where he crumples. One of the problems is he is very private and doesn't talk to anyone except me, part of his wife impossed therapy is I make him tell his colleagues things - like about ds and me at the moment. They are so supportive, and he is much better. Gosh this is a long winded way of saying I think talking about how you feel, when you are low, when your self-confidence is low helps to bring you round. I hope you are feeling better today

LJ - I am thinking of you a lt, I hope you are home and comfortable.

It's me at last!
Thank you all for your thoughts and asking about me - sorry I have not been able to post until now.

Op went OK although did not even get taken down until after 6pm on Thursday! Starving and had to sit through lunch AND tea smells! Back on ward between 10-11pm I believe (couldn't see clock without glasses!)

Home Friday afternoon but really could do nothing for couple of days.

Had some probs due to state of broken right arm/hand re blood pressure and canula (sp?) which anaesthetist inisted on putting in back of right hand, which then got even more swollen and all benefit I'd achieved from physio was lost, had to begin again. Having blood pressure done on leg is EXCRUCIATING unless cuff is in right place! And one nurse tried TWICE to do blood pressure on my left arm - straight after op (I was v groggy but managed to stop her before it was fully inflated) and following morning too - very scary she could get it so wrong, may tell BCN as concerned someone this 'forgetful' could, eg, give penicillin to someone allergic to it.

Despite this, Left arm seems hardly affected at all! What a relief! Although still unable to lift/move vigorously of course due to pulling on scars.

Today is first day I am trying to Wear A Bra. Makes wounds feel pressurised and itchy but want to get out of house and need to be dressed for that. Not willing to join current apparent fad for going out in PJs! Have appt do examine wounds and remove dressings tomorrow am.

Left breast is weird - high, firm and pointy (good? but alien to me) but positioned a bit far to the left (almost under arm!). May sag into a better position with time... Makes right breast look even bigger and waist-length The difference is very noticeable 'au naturel' but strangely and thankfully much less so in a bra. They have very kindly offered to 'even them up' but can't even think of voluntary reduction op on poor right breast just now.

DH was weird about this - I mentioned it on way home from hospital and he expressed surprise that I would have a reduction on R rather than getting (already hacked about) L increased back to former size with an implant! I think he is going to find my new shape(s) harder to adjust to than me .

Smee - because of you, I couldn't stop myself asking to know the weight of what they removed - 350g - then trying to visualise this weight in cake and/or blancmange, damn you!! Glad your party was a success! Surgeon seemed delighted in my interest, by the way...

Kurri - was fascinated and moved by your info and pics about your dad, it's wonderful to have family history preserved (and therefore alive!) in word and print. You are lucky. What great stories!

MAS - hoping you are feeling better today. After my serious accident 3 years ago I started having panic attacks/anxiety. Had to go on ADs which I managed to come off just last August. On and off since op (and around New Year) am noticing familiar thumping of heart and breathlessness etc. Not surprising but hoping it does not get a hold again. Thinking of you and hoping this is but a brief 'visit' for both of us. xx

Will try to post more later. Must try to get something done today - promised DH would make a start on my Tax Return

all the war time adventures are so interesting -amazing what people lived and survived through-perhaps something we can use to help ion dark times possibly ?
Thanks for all your understanding and kind words- am feeling ok,slightly stressed because haven't done any work today so far (have spent a while with my dad trying to prevent Celeste getting up the chimney.She broke through the barrier we'd taped up last night and dad reinforced it today-no sooner had he gone than she was up there again !
philmassive- blurting that out might not be so bad-it's what you feel and possibly the same thought has crossed his mind so in a way to say it might help-because that's the very worst case scenario..somehow that's said -not sure if that makes much sense ? Hope it doesn't sound careless or crass

Just typed out a message to limejelly on her return and deleted it accidentally - grrr - but what it said was hooray that you're back,take it easy and don't rush into doing too much too soon. Hope you aren't in too much discomfort too. I am sure you aren't feeling at all like contemplating any evening up processes right now !
Thanks too for taking the time and for being kind and thinking of my 'state'- am practising loving kindness meditation which you direct to yourself,then project out to others,so everyone expect some warming,golden rays of loving kindness later today ! I am much better than on Sunday,it was a bit of a blip I think.
phil- if you type 'jane eccles illustrator' into Amazon in the books section a list of my things should come up- would be very surprised if anyone had any at home !!

at Celeste's POW camp attitude.....she will get up there, there is no holding her back!

LJ - I am so glad you are back and doing so well. My dh has been trying to persuade me to go up several sizes in implants.....for years. Men...can't live with them......please complete as personally appropriate

Hi all - wow what terrific wartime stories sparkles. I find this all so fascinating. My dad was too young for WW2 and was in the Home Guard so no fab stories but grandad was at The Somme. He got trench foot and was sent back up the line the day before the worst of the fighting broke out. He always remembered the medic telling him that he was lucky, as the rest of them would all be dead by the next day.

He could do a terrific impression of a rat snuffling around your neck

Sparkles - I always liked the smell and warmth and soporific sound of the launderette too. No Levi guys oin ours, though

Phil - like MAS says, i reckon getting that out in the open was healthy rather than otherwise. You've both looked the worst case scenario in the face, and acknowledged it: I don't think it is coming to that.

Lime Jelly - Wow! You sound like you are doing brilliantly. I am in awe - but don't overdo it. x

Ooh thank you, MAS, off to do it in a moment.

LJ, I knwo I'm just a newbie but glad you're back

Phil - MAS is a great illustrator, and she does great pictures and cards as well. She did DD one for her bedroom which has pride of place.....she's about to do one for my Mum, as well.

And you are not JUST a newbie, you are now officially part of the crew

PPS Finally off to see Jools Holland tomorrow, following the pre-Christmas cancellation. Yay!!!

oh Cakes -you make me !
Hooray for Jools - it'll be fab !
And yes,you are certainly part of the crew

Thank you for all the kind comments about my dad - he is so dear to me, and seeing him so frail now is so hard to deal with, he was always so full of fun, with a mischievous sense of humour. I will show him the photo when I go down in a few weeks time. He doesn't recognize recent photo's of himself but is better with old ones (esoecially if I drop a large hint like 'who is that handsome chap?' )

Fascinating to hear about you DH's grandfather and uncle Sparkles - there must be so many stories out there, people of that generation (and of course the one before) went through so much - the poor doctor in your family being a prisoner until 1956 (shock).

Cakes at your Grandfather's rat impression.

A quick funny story my dad used to tell us. One time in the prison camp they managed to get hold of a football, and were having great fun playing, the guards saw this and confiscated the ball. So the next day they played with an imaginary ball - pretending to kick it and head it to each other - the guards rushed down to confiscate again and were very cross to discover no ball

LJ - great you are home, but sorry you had scary episodes of nursing in hospital - thats the last thing you need. I'm glad your arm isn't feeling too bad, (I'm sure you should be lying on the sofa watching DVD's though, not doing tax returns !) It does take a little while to adjust to the new you, and to think about what reconstruction you may want in the future, but it sounds as if you are making good progress which is great

Phil - good that your DH is coming with you, don't worry about blurting your feelings out - I'm sure he has similar anxieties, and its a very natural feeling which I'm sure we'll all admit to thinking at some point. But it's mostly because you are dealing with the unknown at the moment, you don't know where you stand and the imagination runs riot, once you get to the hospital and talk to the doctors I am sure you will feel less panicky. And like Cakes - I don't think that is a scenario you need to contemplate anyway. (Oh and no 'newbie' nonsense, everyone welcome )

MAS - I'm glad to hear you are feeling a bit better today, depression can creep up out of nowhere and take you by surprise I find, be kind to yourself, and take things gently.

I'm sorry to hear your DH has problems in this direction Sparkles, it affects so many doesn't it?

I think I might brave yoga and aquastretch tomorrow, my stomach feels a lot better, although tailbone is still pretty sore - but I think I'll be OK to swim.

Ooops sorry about huge post

Go easy with the exercise, then KK. No heroics

I've just been for a swim but the pool was so full I aborted partway through. No fun AT ALL. And i do find that it needs to be either fun or, failing that, at least peaceful. With Whaleman and the One in the Swimming Hat both in at the same time, it was neither.

loved your dad's story KK ! it must be heartbreaking to see him so frail- I feel the same way about my mum- only a few years ago she was very active,on her bike,doing stuff,seeing friends- the ageing thing is so hard.
Cakes - am imagining Whaleman and the One in the Swimming Hat

Ooh great you are getting to see Jools at last Cakes.

I am imagining Whaleman and the One in the Swimming Hat too (do you get those awful middle aged men in tiny speedos who seem to parade around the edge of the pool for ages before getting in? - yuk).

How is your mum at the moment MAS, and how does your dad cope?

One of the things I find hard with dad is that he was always very polite and gentlemanly, but the alzheimers has made him have no inhibition on what he says so he can be quite rude to people (Obviously everyone understands.)but it seems so cruel that an illness makes him say things his 'real self' would be horrified by.

Sounds familiar, KK . My grandad was just the same. But you are right, people do understand.

Yes, we have old Speedo guys alright Whaleman sends up tidal waves (God knows what stroke he is doing) and the one in the hat just ploughs up and down slowly, taking a LOT of space and refusing to defer when she meets anyone coming hte other way. They have a perfect right to be there, of course, but they make it a challenge for everyone else. Especially together

oh I should draw them !!
It is sad what happens to the old ones- the change in your dad's behaviour must be so hard. Mum is ok at the moment,still very stiff and not able to move very much-dad is just immensely kind and patient -such a good person- l would be much more snappish and impatient.

Whaleman and the One

Cakes enjoy Jools I love Jools, listen to his cd's for hours and hear something different everytime! Have fun

Phil I hope you are doing ok today.

LJ - the only activity you should be doing is reaching for the remote, tax returns are definitely bad for your health.

I can just imagine that POW story KK, what characters they all were, just to survive it. A tough generation.

Has Celeste made it up the chimney yet!

am pleased to report that Celeste hasn't attempted to get up the chimney again !!

[Grin] she is just lulling you into a false sense of security...she has her eye on that chimney.

try again

Why do kittens like chimneys so much? Or is it just anything they can climb, and that they shouldn't?

My db has a little black kitten called Azzy (short for Asbo, as she is such a menace [ grin] )

Am a bit clueless where cats are concerned. Now, dogs, I understand....

Now I'll try again

Life is simplier for a dog, well certainly for our choccie lab, where only having a couple of brain cells to use to complete any task limits her imagination!