So uni fees are going to increase?

[nearlylovemyusername]

University sector calls on Labour to raise tuition fees to ‘stabilise the ship’ (ft.com)

Given paywall, the essence it this:

"One former university vice-chancellor said the fact that Labour had acknowledged the sector was “in crisis” indicated that Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer and Phillipson, who have not ruled out a tuition fee increase, were likely to act.

“The short-term pain of putting up fees could be blamed on the Tory inheritance . . . and then traded against a transition to a better deal for young people, which Labour can deliver before next general election,” he said."

So it won't be limited by VAT on PS, uni fees will be up, potentially significantly and repayments for higher earning grads will go up much more - this is what artical says.

and the same for operating costs

Then a pp was highlighting some (incorrect) %s for international student numbers earlier in the thread; however if they meant income from international students then their figures start to make a lot more sense.

These show, in order of total income, the tuition income percentage UK undergrads, and UK postgrads, and the overall UK %, then the same for international undergrads; international postgrads and the overall international %

As this is MN obviously an RG flag is needed.

The final two columns show the total fee income - in £'000s (should have said that about the earlier data too, all £figs are £'000s) - and the percentage of total income that tuition fees represent.

As an example on the attachment tuition fees accounted for 82% of Coventry uni's overall income; and international students contributed 66% of the tuition fee element.

Scottish Unis are red highlighted just due to the tuition fee difference there.

and the tables for the rest

and

Sounds like - in the longterm - parents need to start saving up for university fees from childhood. To at least reduce the burden on graduates over their work lives

In addition - government could consider subsidies for courses that correlate to taxpayer needs. Although I do feel conflicted about that .....

No one else in Europe has uni fees but they have just as many kids going to uni.
Not true! (And I do wish posters would stop posting opinions about "Europe" as if it is one entity but I digress....) My son goes to Uni in Italy and pays 2000 euros a year.

Mine wanted to do an MA in Holland. €3k for EU students. €16k for UK students. Definitely fees for everyone though.

Yes, it is a lot cheaper for EU students (which DS is luckily). Another Brexit bonus!

When we were EU we got cheap eu fees too. And Erasmus. And here’s that good old Nigel Farage telling us how it is again with the same idiots sucking up to him! The uk is looking increasingly foolish.

They'll need to increase ( although the proposed increase from 9,250 to eventually 10,500 is very small), or the government will need to subsidise UK students again.

Why conflicted?

Graduates pay more tax for longer than non graduates, even grads of post '92 universities that are so denigrated on these boards.

The rest of Europe subsidises their university sectors to some extent, why not us?

This is an area that impacts wealthier kids less: eg many in DS’ school have gone to the US / Europe / india to study as it’s cheaper. It will mainly impact poorer kids without the resources to leave.

If you need a loan for fees/living costs, Europe is probably too expensive. Non EU fees in the Netherlands area about 10,000 euros.

The US certainly is far more expensive than the UK and I'd question someone leaving the UK to go to the US because the UK is expensive.

@Aladdinzane - you are forgetting that a lot of British students have second and sometimes even third nationalities. And European unis are increasingly offering English programmes too, I keep saying this- our Goverment is asleep at the wheel. We can’t afford to lose young talented people. Every country is already competing for highly skilled high tax paying workers.

Top US unis have huge endowments and they are coming into our grammar schools! They will subsidise the talented even if middle earners and above!

Not that many though, in the wider scope of things many UK students are stuck.

Even then, you cannot borrow money from the Student Loan Company to pay for fees for European Universities, so if you are reliant on the loan, rather than parental income for funding, you're stuck too.

Sigh.

Yes top US universities do have large endowments but getting in is the key thing, the Harvard acceptance rate is 3.9% and that is deceptively high because it includes people who were accepted because of Legacy/Deans List/Staff children, all of whom have a higher acceptence rate.

43% of white students at Harvard I believe are covered by this figure.

So yes people get in, but it's very, very rare, and full funding even more so.

Even then, when you look at the data for Harvard students, something like 67% of students are from the top 20% of US income. This is due to the socio-economic bias in the selection process.

But yes, tell me about "talent".

Son, girlfriend and another couple were caught up in COVID lockdowns. First one sent home from halls. £180 pw per room. Second year because landlords were in chaos decided to go back into halls.

Now bearing in mind these halls, two of them high rise payable to unite were once again £180 pw. Seven rooms per flat. We were really pissed off that the other five rooms were for international students who had to be quarantined for 14 days I think, so apparently son and girlfriend couldn't go into the kitchen while the international students had access.

It was farcical, who was opening windows, wiping down between use to prevent diseases spreading. No-one. Even the cleaners wouldn't come in. The kitchen was a hellish dumpster of take away boxes because the temporary students hadn't unpacked yet obviously, so ordered takeaway.

Son calculated that unite were taking in gross £8 million on two blocks of flats.

Friends on a different floor had the same issue it was an isolation building.

Between the four of them they were paying £2400 pcm for a room.

Luckily third year they found a gorgeous two bedroom flat in the business sector of the city, well away from everything. All inclusive at £1600 pcm. The flat above was rented by a premier foitballer who was rarely there so ideal for finals year .

Unite really are robber barons I've decided. I've no idea if the university see any of that money though.

Yep and they are also giving our top private school students "free ride" places as well.

I know of a kid in a private school who's been offered a completely free place (scholarship) to a top US uni and is going. Got straight 9s at GCSE and predicted all A stars for A level. Rejected from Oxford - there is a certain calibre of person who just won't accept that and so is going to a top US uni instead - for free.

Oxford, Cambridge have a different criteria for student acceptance than the USA.

:)

This story comes round every time. The number of UK kids given free rides to US Ivies is not in anyway high, nor common. Nor would most private school kids get a free ride due to funding being need based.

It is true that Oxford and Cambridge have different criteria for acceptance from the USA.

Both however can be seen as different tests of socio-economics, the US being more so than Oxbridge.

Although, with the private school stranglehold on Oxbridge loosening, I see private school parents tell themselves the story about free rides at Ivies and top US schools all the time.

They are rare, and as you'd have to have a household income under 80k to qualify (even your home equity can be used as part of the calculation for some).

Unite really are robber barons I've decided. I've no idea if the university see any of that money though.

No. Unite is a private profit making company. Unis don't see any of the money they make. That said unis can't afford to build halls these days so private accommodation provider full that gap.

I think it depends on the parents’ demographic. We have a lot of Indian families in our grammars and they are suddenly very pro US and other places. Where is this coming from? Is it just aspiration? Girls can get fully paid soccer scholarships too if they are any good etc. It’s like suddenly the great British ideal is no longer the biggest aspiration. I bet most will stay but I am talking about aspiration.

If many Indian students in India itself now prefer the US to the U.K. it may even be coming from there. If there isn’t a big price difference for internationals here vs there that would make sense.

American here, and I absolutely will be encouraging my dc to go the the US for uni - my perception is that the quality of the education is better, especially at the second or mid tier, and then better job prospects when they graduate.

I wouldn’t count on financial aid / scholarships making it any cheaper than the uk, though - from my perspective it will cost more but is a better investment.