Is it true that clever people go to 6th form and people who aren't go to college

[thistimeiknowitsforreal]

Evening all,

It was always drummed into me that after GCSE`s that if you are intelligent you went to or stayed at school and went to 6th form depending on your previous circumstances.

But if you weren't good enough you went to college instead.

Whats your experience in this area ?

There were no 6th forms in a 100 mile radius of where I grew up - it just didn't exist. All colleges were known as a 6th form college to us, but they were just the local community colleges.

That`s an interesting can you please elaborate ?

I went from a sixth form college to a Cambridge college, anecdotal but there you go.

Depending what subjects you study, In my area you can attend sixth form and college, in the same years.

You posted this a few weeks ago. Why the repeat?

I’m sure this got asked relatively recently on here.

My children’s school doesn’t have a sixth form so my son goes to sixth form college and is doing A levels.

The other college here offers alternative courses to A levels. It depends what you want to study. I know some of my sons friends got good enough grades to do A levels, but chose the other college as there were courses they liked that could lead to the career they wanted. There’s lots of choice for kids which is a good thing. A levels at sixth form aren’t for everyone.

That's how it was viewed when I was at school (early 2000)

Same for me.
My daughter is leaving school this year (predicted 8s and 9s across the board) and her school doesn’t have a 6th form. None of the schools in this town do. She could get a bus or train for an hour to a school in a different town but why would she do that when she can do her A levels at the 6th form college in our town?

You go to the place that offers your subject/s and where you feel you will learn best.

Most schools round here don’t have 6th forms. Ds’s school did but they offer an incredibly limited number of A levels, plus some Btecs & a Work Skills programme. They don’t offer music so Ds went to the local college.

Round here, all the state secondaries have sixth forms and the colleges are mostly focussed on vocational courses (though they do offer some A levels). The sixth forms usually have higher entry requirements than the colleges. So there probably is some truth in what the OP said.

But there's also I think a split between those who like the "safety" of a known place with known rules versus the freedom of going to college where everything will be new to them (certainly that was a factor for my DC). And between those who want to study something more for the joy of studying it versus wanting something more vocational. Most 16 year olds don't know what career they want so sticking with school and known subjects is a better option for many until they get a clearer idea of what direction they plan to take.

Most young people where I am stay at school until they are 18. Every school offers 6th form. I only know two people from my whole year in school who left and went to college and that's because they wanted to do a specific GNvq.

It's not about intelligence it's about the structural inequalities which impact attainment from before a child even starts school.

This absolutely has an impact.
A person's socioeconomic background will influence whether they choose A levels or a more vocational route.

However, as people have mentioned already, not everywhere has a 6th firm attached to their school. In an area close to me everyone goes to college but there are different types of college.

I thought this. Didn't it get deleted too?

The cleverest people go wherever best suits their needs.

I have 2 girls at uni. Both heading for top results. One went to college, the other to a grammar sixth form. Course availability was key.

No state schools with a 6th form near me. Post 16 education is at a private school (local) or colleges many, many miles away (and I'm not in a rural area).

I think when we were at school (a long time ago) this was the perception but I’d say that nowadays it’s nothing to do with intelligence but more to do with intentions post qualification and preferred learning and assessment style (disclaimer: this is a personal opinion and I have no evidence for it

In my area of herts , you did a levels at school and college was for vocational courses like health and social care, and plumbing.
So I can see the stereotype for college = dumb and school = smart.
However my dh grew up in London and college was the only option. Within an hour of his house only private schools had sixth forms.
It must be regional.

I’m in London and all the schools I know of have sixth forms. Most stay at school or swap to another school. Those that leave at 16 tend to want to do a vocational course not available at school. Two of my DDs did A levels at school, though one swapped schools. Another DD left school to do a vocational course while also doing three A levels.

In areas where schools have 6th Forms, often schools offer only some or no vocational courses, so schools have a large proportion of 6th formers doing A Levels. There is a bigger choice of vocational courses at college these understandably attract more who want to do them and typically they have less stellar GCSE grades. Of course there are exceptions.

This is further skewed by the fact that areas with state Grammar schools and large numbers of private schools, offer A Levels only in their 6th Forms and often have higher entry requirements. Therefore these places gain higher grades at A Level as they are naturally more selective. Therefore such places have higher properties of higher ability kids. In some of these areas, it’s only the selective schools or those that were previously Grammars that have sixth forms and othe schools don’t have 6th forms. Given more high achieving kids (and it is linked to socio-Economics….which isn’t the same at all as saying those from less well-off backgrounds can’t be clever) attend schools with 6th Forms, they are also in the 6th Forms whereas kids from 11-16 schools are more likely to go onto college than move to another school which has a sixth form….and those that do are likely to be high achievers wanting a traditional route and also willing to follow one that the majority from their school don’t follow.

Of course in areas with no 6th Forms in schools this won’t apply and of course there are some well known highly academic colleges which take massive numbers and get amazing academic results such as Hills Road, Cambridge. Anecdotal evidence will always find some mazingly bright kids going to college and doing fantastically, and avoiding the schools they could have gone to. This is all true, but broadly speaking and generally the OPs statement is correct - on a macro level, clever children aka those with higher GCSE performance are more likely to be found in schools and if you look at the prior attainment of all students starting 6th Form in schools compared to colleges, it will per head, be higher for schools.

I can never understand why anyone would want to stay on at school.
God I hate this MN bullshit faux naivety. You do understand, you just can’t come up with a better way to be sneakily judgemental and patronising.

Are you having a bad day or is there a back story to the post you’re replying to?

More academic children tend to do A-levels
Less academic children tend to do BTECs and alternative qualifications.

Some more academic children choose BTECs or alternative qualifications if they know what they want to do as a career and the BTECs/Alts are a better fit.

School 6th forms tend to only offer A levels. 6th Form colleges tend to offer A levels, plus some BTECs. Technical colleges tend to offer BTECS and other alternative qualifications.

On average the grades needed to go on to A levels at school 6th form > the grades needed to do A levels/BTECs at 6th form college > the grades needed to do BTEC or alternative qualifications at technical colleges. But each child needs to choose the course that suits them best.

This is such a weird concept, I don't think it is true.

I went to 6th form college, I didn't want to stay at school.
I got 3 A levels, an AS level, 2 BSc and a MSc so I wouldn't describe myself as "not good enough" exactly!

My daughter is very clever but planning to go to tech college as they have a wider range of the arts subjects that she's interested in.

Fwiw where I live are only colleges, no school 6th forms so there's only colleges but some are technical colleges and some are 6th form colleges. People tend to go to the 6th form to do a levels and the tech to do more specific or vocational courses.