Obstetric violence - legs forced open against my will

[NibliaBiblia]

When I was in labour with my daughter, the midwives spent twenty minutes trying to force my legs open to get me flat on my back with my legs up. There was no emergency. It was so they could get a better CTG reading. I physically resisted for as long as I could and verbally told them to stop. They didn't stop until I gave up. After that they did other things without my consent, but I did not they to stop them again.
I complained to the hospital and they have done nothing. I complained to the police and they told me there must have been an emergency. I've complained to the NMC and the CQC. I hope they will do something but it's a long process so I won't know for a long time.
The police used to say that domestic violence was a private matter. They used to say that if you got in the car/went into the apartment/were drinking then you must have agreed to it. I think this is exactly the same type of justification, applied to equally criminal behaviour.
I don't think my experience is abnormal. I think this is fairly routine. They thought that when I gave up that meant I consented.

What was the reason for needing to have the CTG? Not everyone has them in labour so was this due to something that occurred during labour or because you were high risk? Also, you say to get a better reading…. Were they struggling to get a reading based on your position and movement?

The midwife should not have touched you in the way and should have just documented that she was struggling for a good trace because of your position (for example).

Yes. I told her I hadn't consented, and she asked the midwife who was present, who said i had "consented" (eventually gave up) so she documented that i had forgotten having "consented".
Bit of a joke tbh

It is enough - if they've offered and explained they are not liable. But that does not stop them from assaulting and coercing women when they don't agree with their decisions.

It must be hard for midwives who are worried about dead babies. Sometimes you just need to do what they ask. My midwife told me to stop screaming and use my energy to pushing the baby out. She was right.

There was meconium, which is associated with increased risk but common at my gestation (around 30% at 41 weeks) as I said, I agreed to the monitoring, just not the position. I think the monitors were slipping. I wasn't even moving, just lying on my side.

Yeah. I am. And I hope every other woman who is assaulted is also a pain, so that people who do this to us eventually have to start facing some consequences.

Me lying on my side was not a danger to my baby.

What do you think was in it for them? Why do you think they were pushing you onto your back? For shits and giggles, or to check your baby wasn't dead?

Empathy works both ways

You shouldn't lie flat on your back for ctg. Why did they want your legs open. Were they doing an internal at the same time

It might be enough to prevent a guilty verdict in a court of law but not to stop the suspensions/investigations/being slagged off in the media/inquiries and prosecution. Very few families are willing to shoulder the blame when things go wrong as a result of their choices and maternity units are still judged on criteria such as live births and maternal injury and mortality. So yes, there would need to be systemic change not this damned if you do/responsible if you dont approach.

Why did you bother going to hospital if you are such an expert? Honestly they are there to try and protect you so you and your baby don't die. If you don't want that get your own midwife and crack on at home.

I think it was for their convenience, and because they think that is a woman says no that just means they need to keep "explaining" until they've "gained consent".
I don't need empathy, I need to be sure that I'm not going to have my legs forced open without my consent, and that if it does happen there will be consequences for the person who assaulted me.

Sadly when people do this, and then they or their babies die, the midwifes and doctors STILL get slagged off in the media as the woman, who ignored all medical advice 'didn't understand the risks'

So walking into the hospital means i don't get to so people from touching me without my consent?

They're not judged on whether or not they've coerced and assaulted women. There are no consequences. That's the problem.
Cardiologists are judged on whether people die but they don't hold people down and forcibly shave their chests for ECGs.

Well why were they touching you with your consent? Hmm? Because they or evil rapists, or because they were trying to keep you and your baby alive? You don't seem to be able to grasp this

The only thing I'm complaining about is having my legs forced open against my will. They were using physical force to pry me legs open for 20 minutes and then documented it as "consent".
That is not consent.

Why were they?

Women with mental capacity are still allowed to make decisions even if they result in their baby dyIng

That's true, they are. And sometimes women in labour panic and can't think straight and need a bit of encouragement. I can remember panicking at the pain when my baby's head was coming out and trying to get off the bed, and the midwife sternly telling me I needed to listen to her and push. She was right, I did. Listening to what I was saying at the time and letting me get off the bed would have ended with my baby being severely injured or dead. I had the capacity to not push and stand up, but the midwife fortunately used her judgement and didn't just meekly go along with what I was saying because 'consent'

Because that's their preference and it's easier to keep the monitors in place I guess. I've talked about this with many people from the hospital and not one of them has offered any justification whatsoever.
Luckily random people on Mumsnet know better than the deputy head of midwifery, the outpatient maternity matron, and several other midwives that it must have been necessary!

You were criminally assaulted. The staff involved should be charged.

Every woman who is assaulted by medical professionals needs to make a police complaint. There are no excuses for this.

The patient in their right mind and with mental capacity has an absolute right in law to decide what happens to their body. It doesn’t matter what the staff or posters here think is best.

The NHS culture is increasingly appalling both in terms of how patients are treated and in how new staff are bullied and corrupted. A young relative is currently in his first F1 placement as a qualified doctor and I’m revolted by the culture of bullying and a complete lack of professionalism shown by the doctors and nurses he’s encountered to the young doctors. It wouldn’t be tolerated in any other profession or workplace. We need more undercover reporters and filming. Seems to be the only thing that works.

I’m on the medical teams side.

i wanted limited monitoring as i was trying for a vbac. They got quite pushy for monitoring and my baby’s heart rate dropped and then plummeted and never recovered. They insisted on a vaginal dilation examination while I was screaming in pain at 9cm with no pain relief. At the time I was pissed off but they saved my baby’s life by insisting on a crash section. I was pushed into theatre in 3 minutes. My baby could have been brain damaged.

monitoring isn’t important. until it is.