Those opposed to surrogacy, what are your views on egg donation?

[wholeeverything]

I'm a gender critical woman with a high degree of skepticism about commercial surrogacy. I'm also facing the possibility of never having my own child.

Thinking hard about egg donation, I am conflicted about my own views about the ethics of it, from the point of view of the egg donor. What are your views? I am particularly interested in the views of those opposed to surrogacy. Do you see it as the same issue?

I feel like I cannot think objectively because of my own fertility issues. I am personally fine with the ethics of the child's rights, in that I would view it as similar to adoption with a child having the right to know their biological origins, and that then being something for me to decide if I am OK with at a personal level. Where there is full transparency, I don't see it as violating the child's rights.

But what about the young women selling eggs? Is it invasive, dangerous? Should it be viewed like surrogacy or selling an organ? Is it only considered by women in financial hardship, i.e. effectively coerced?

Hrtft

I am staunchly against surrogacy but for egg donation

Is egg donation invasive? I am pro sperm donation

Pro adoption though

I don't believe in surrogacy or egg and sperm donation.

Does anyone know why women in the UK can’t choose to donate spare eggs after they finish IVF and have some left over? I’m sure some women would do so, to help other women conceive.

You can. When you have finished your family via IVF you have 3 options: destroy, donate to science/research (and ultimately destroyed) or donate to a hopeful family.

Embryos and eggs vary in quality and generally women do need to have been under 35 when the eggs/embryos were frozen.

It is a hugely sensitive personal decision though. There is no way that we would have donated our embryos to another couple.

I did not exaggerate the impact that a gestational carrier has on- merely pointed out that there was one. I’m not in favour of surrogacy because the baby is removed from the mother immediately after birth, which is not the case with a baby born from a donor egg. Children can be profoundly unsettled by many things whether they grow up in a family to whom they are biologically related or not. I think you would accept that not all adoptees, for example, grow up with more than humanity’s normal share of angst, and a child born of donor conception is never separated from its birth parents.

I am not sure why you are talking about risking your life for money, since payment for egg donation is illegal in the UK. I would also say that there is no direct benefit to me personally from my DD’s decision since I also have three DGC who are related to me genetically. I can say that there is no difference between the way I feel about my DD’s children and the way I feel about my DS2’s children. All of them appear to be growing up as happy and healthy children in loving families and I am just not seeing the doom and gloom of your prognostication. None of us know how things will turn out for our children and grandchildren in the future.

I’m a mum of a naturally conceived teenager and a donor egg conceived tweenager and I have read this thread with interest. There have been times while reading that I’ve felt defensive about our choices but overall I still feel comfortable with the choices we’ve made and the family we have.

Treatment was in the uk with an altruistic donor who already had a child (this was important to me not as proof of fertility but because it gave me reassurance she knew what she was donating) and our son will be able to find her details when he’s 18 if he wants to. He knows about her but so far hasn’t been very curious.

We have limited information about her, including basic medical history (I realise that’s not ideal). The donor was from another country but lives here and was a basic physical match for me (height, skin tone, eye colour) not because I want to pretend his history is anything other than it is but so our family looks consistent. He looks like his dad and like his brother. Some features are unfamiliar like his nose. I’ve never seen a picture of the donor so I don’t know if he looks like her.

I’ve read about epigenetics but it’s not really important to me. I think someone mentioned a ‘fairytale’ in an earlier post - I know I’m his mum because I gave birth to him and love him every day but I know I’m not his biological parent. he is biologically related to his dad and brother (half brother genetically).

why did we choose egg donation rather than adoption? Because we talked a lot and honestly and we didn’t think we would be good adoptive parents. I wonder how many people on this thread saying ‘why not just adopt’ are adoptive parents themselves or is it only people with fertility problems they think should be obliged to adopt. That doesn’t seem in the best interests of children who can’t stay with their biological parents.

Before we decided to go ahead I grappled with the idea of whether it was fair on a potential child. My husband’s view was that a child would be glad to have the opportunity of a life. And I hope he’s right. We love our son very much and so does his entire family including my side. Although it was a tough road I don’t have any regrets about how things worked out because we have our wonderful son and I don’t wish for anything different.

One of my main motivations for wanting another child was so our first son had a sibling. I’m not sure if I’ll be judged for that but I expect that’s a motivation for many second children.

I don’t know what the future holds. There are no guarantees for any child growing up. But we believed we could be good parents and I hope we’re going our best. I think of the donor often and wish her well - she’s the person in all of this that because we don’t know her and how’s she’s getting on all these years later I’ve got the biggest question mark about, and I hope she doesn’t have regrets about her gift that I am thankful for every day.

The baby is removed from the mother when it is a donor egg. The biological mother is the one who created the egg.

As one constantly needs to point out to anti-abortion advocates, an egg is not a baby. An embryo is not a baby.

And posters upthread wonder why I bothered to mention abortion rights...

It becomes a baby and that baby is biologically related to it's birth mother. Semantics and abortion rights don't change that fact.

Say what now? A donor conceived child isn’t biologically related to its birth mother.

Eggs are not babies, in fact the majority of the eggs women have die off by puberty and can never become babies.

But the egg is not some unimportant ingredient. It contains half the dna that will make up the child. If you use a donor egg, you are getting someone else's biology, not yours. I'm not saying that's a disaster or immoral or whatever - i just think families who use donor eggs should be open and realistic about this.

Ok sorry I used the incorrect term. What I meant was, donor eggs are biologically related to the donor. That donor egg who them goes on to become a baby and then an adult has been separated from its biological mother. That's important and shouldn't be dismissed as a trifling matter. Where we come from is very important and isn't and shouldn't be up to the adopters or birth mothers etc to decide it's inconsequential because it matters and it's not for them to decide it doesn't. That's my point. I don't have any issues with abortion.

My DD and her DH were firmly advised by the fertility clinic to be open and realistic about that, and given age-appropriate resources to explain it to the children. So far, as with @LattePatty 's DC, neither child has felt the need yet to explore it further, but of course they will be enabled to do so as and when that happens.

I note that nobody here seems to be wringing their hands about sperm donation, which contrast in terms of control strikes me as yet another attempt to police the actions of women as regards their reproductive choices.

I have the same views on sperm donation. Everyone has the right to know where they come from and imo it should not be treated like buying a new dress.

Sperm donation is obviously different. We used to be pretty sure who our mother was- the issue of dads was always a bit up in the air. Many people have had a real shock via a dna test.

I think the same issues apply - people should be honest about it. I mentioned up thread another thread on mumsnet where the OP was just beginning to realise that the sperm donor they used might have been a factor in their daughter's high anxiety and possible neurodivergence.

often a woman wants to experience pregnancy

Replace “for money” with “for financial incentives” - very common in the U.K., as you know. I’m sure the egg donor who is the biological mother of your DGC received financial incentives, and in return has a significantly increased risk of terminal cancer among other things.

It’s a rubbish argument to throw up your hands and say “bad things can always happen/kids can be upset by anything” - the unexpected can’t be equated with deliberately creating a child in a suboptimal situation, which situation also carries risks for the human being that has supplied their genetic material. Most parents don’t deliberately place their kids in potentially harmful situations, whereas kids born of donors have been created with that reality.

@Chickadeeinme sperm donation carries no risk to the donor. Egg donation is completely different in that respect, which materially affects my views on it because, as I’ve mentioned a couple of times now, a close friend of mine is dying at 45 as a result of egg collection.

Life is frequently suboptimal. I have had close friends who died from lung cancer because they smoked, others who damaged their physical and mental health through alcohol use. Are you proposing that nobody should ever choose to do something that carries a risk? My DD likes to go rock climbing - should she not do that because she might fall and damage herself?

The obvious difference with is that your DD has also the benefit of another woman’s egg, while that other woman has all the risks, which are not well explained.

Trying to absolve yourself by responsibility by saying “shit happens” is a pretty unattractive argument.

There are zero risks to a man who donates sperm and their is no risk to the health, future fertility or life of the mother or child from doner sperm.
Women donating their eggs are risking their health, future fertility and life.
Women gestating babies that are biologically unrelated to them are 4 times more likely to suffer complications during pregnancy including infant and maternal mortality.
The objections are to the risks women are put at, risks that men dont face, and we object to the commodification of women's bodies.
This is not about removing reproductive choices ie abortion but the prevention of women being harmed for the wants of others.
You can try and paint this as a pro life vs pro choice argument to ease your conchense but it won't work we know the harm that comes from egg donation and surrogacy and we are not going to be quiet about it until it is all made illegal and everybody involved in the buying and selling of babies and womens bodies are jailed and treated like the monsters they are

Just because someone wants something doesn't mean that they should get it

The other woman presumably halos has the benefit of a wanted child or the eggs wouldn’t be available for donation. Any woman receiving a donor eggs goes through most of the same process as the donor. In my DD’s case she had eggs harvested twice before it became clear that her own and her DH’s genetic material was essentially never likely to succeed.

i love the way posters on this thread seem to think I should take some responsibility for a choice I had nothing to do with, or to examine my conscience for its obvious deficiencies. Sorry to disappoint you but I have no uneasy conscience about this and I think you are mistaken to elevate your personal reactions to a universal rule. I won’t criticize you for making that choice of course, but I disagree with it and would have done so even if all my DGC were genetically related to me.

Are the risks higher of she doesn't keep all her eggs? I mean she's doing all the treatments any, isn't she?