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Feminism: sex and gender

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Original poster

School uniform inspection?

79 replies

Madwife123 · 07/10/2023 04:23

Reposting here as I don’t think the posters in AIBU are understanding the question I’m trying to ask and that this isn’t about the skirt length or otherwise but the appropriateness of an adult asking a child to lift their clothing in public. Can I have some opinions on what you would do please?

DD aged 11 has just started high school.

The school is very strict on uniform which we knew. She has the problem of being tall and slim so when shopping for skirts, all the one’s that came to her knees were falling down on her, even with an adjustable waist. No option for the girls to wear trousers at the school. Skirt is the school patterned one, doesn’t come in different lengths and can’t just get any skirt as has to be a particular one. So the skirt she ended up with is a tiny bit too short. I’ve measured and it’s 1.5 cm above the top of her knee. She has thick opaque black tights with the skirt.

She was stopped by a teacher in the corridor at school and told her skirt is too short and to roll it down. She explained it wasn’t rolled up and the teacher told her to lift her jumper up so she could see her waistband and prove it wasn’t rolled up. This was in front of other pupils.

This really doesn’t sit right with me and I’m considering making a complaint but wanted to know if I’m overreacting.

I know she had a shirt on under her jumper but even so I just don’t think it’s ok that an adult can ask a child to lift an item of clothing, particularly in front of others. Are we not supposed to be teaching our daughters bodily autonomy? That no one has the right to ask them to undress in any way, no matter how small without their consent? She feels embarrassed and humiliated and is really upset by this and I just can’t understand how this can be deemed acceptable.

Would this bother you if it was your child?

OP posts:

Hollyhead · 07/10/2023 04:26

Hi ‘posters from AIBU’ also post here too you know. And my view would remain the same stands, bodily autonomy isn’t the same as being asked to show a waistband without revealing any bodily part. Being asked to reveal in private would be weirder.

Original poster

Madwife123 · 07/10/2023 04:33

@Hollyhead That’s fine. I do appreciate my view on this may be different as a CSA survivor hence asking here before raising with the school. It just makes me feel really wrong when she explained it but perhaps that’s just me.

OP posts:

NigelHarmansNewWife · 07/10/2023 04:40

I too have responded to your other thread. Showing the waistband of a skirt into which a shirt is tucked by lifting up the jumper worn over the top is not exposure of the body. If the teacher had asked your daughter to lift the cuffs of her jumper to show she didn't have the shirt sleeves rolled up or even remove the jumper, that wouldn't be exposing her body.

She wasn't asked to undress. I don't understand why you think she was? The only thing I can think was that the shirt wasn't tucked into the skirt when it should have been.

CeeceeBloomingdale · 07/10/2023 04:40

My opinion is the same on both boards. It's your responsibility to make sure she has the correct uniform and you failed in that which caused your DD embarrassment.

Hollyhead · 07/10/2023 04:44

@Madwife123 I understand from your second post that it’s probably a more sensitive area for you but I think in this instance, the boundaries are in the right place. I think a key one is does the child understand WHY they’re being asked to lift a piece of clothing to show another item of clothing, if not I’d agree they have the right to understand etc.

Marblessolveeverything · 07/10/2023 07:12

The teacher asked her to raise her jumper, she had a shirt on - no issue

If she asked her to raise the shirt - issue.

It was more appropriate to ask in an area with people around. It would have been completely against safe guarding to do so in private.

The school has a rule, you either move school or comply. And by the way I think the whole uniform thing is nuts. We don't have it here and people have yet to not figure out what to wear to corporate jobs.

You need to buy the bigger skirt and have waist altered.

Flipflopflopflip · 07/10/2023 07:15

I think you're really making an issues out of this. Buy the longer skirt and have it taken it. Issue resolved

RancidOldHag · 07/10/2023 07:21

My answer on AIBU still stands

It's OK for teachers to check uniform as long as removal/lifting is restricted to outer garments (such as coats and jumpers.

Other posters on the thread have talked about school uniform policy, and lobbying for a trousers option (I'm assuming that as you said it was not a private school, that it's girls only, which is about the only reason a state school can have no trousers)

You also mention that it's logo'ed. That goes against guidance (which I think is now statutory guidance) about affordability of uniform and why single suppliers generally should not be used

xyz111 · 07/10/2023 07:55

How should the teacher have asked to check the skirt wasn't rolled?

midgemadgemodge · 07/10/2023 08:15

Lifting a jumper - an article of clothing that is often taken on and off - isn't abusive in any way that I can see

Forcing girls to wear skirts is where I would be upset

StrictlyJowita · 07/10/2023 08:32

Really you have put your dd in a difficult position by starting her off in a skirt that doesn't adhere to the school uniform policy.

On a practical level, I don't see how this could have been managed. Her skirt is too short. As are loads of skirts. A school can either let this go - as my DD's secondary have decided to, or they can enforce the rule. As if they are doing that they can't ask every rule breaker to go to a empty room and find another adult.

At our secondary the school have stopped enforcing the skirt length. They say because it was taking up so much time they say but I imagine someone complained.

They are supposed to wear knee length skirts. We have the tartan box pleat type which form a sort of bustle when you roll them up.

It's bare arses galore on the way to work for me. It's not great. And now the new thing is to wear g-strings. Probably because they can't rebel against the skirt rule.

And the community is up in arms about the skirts. Facebook is on FIRE.
Why can't the school do something???

savoycabbage · 07/10/2023 08:48

Would this bother you if it was your child?

It would bother me that I'd given her a skirt that was going to get her in trouble.

When my dd started secondary it was newly acadamised (if that's a word) and they were super hot on uniform. I never heard a word about uniform from her. She wore the uniform, she wore Clarks brogues, she wore navy blue hair ties,

By the time my second dd started they had a new head and things were nowhere near as strict. DD2 stared wearing nail varnish. Then she wanted Doctor Martens with the yellow stitching. Then she was wearing a red bandanna like Rosie the Riveter.

It all became a distraction. We started getting letters home about boys wearing white socks instead of grey and wearing trainers so they could play football at lunchtime.

Pupils were getting sent home for nail varnish wearing so to push that rule they started getting semi permanent eyebrows and fake eyelashes. I felt like once the uniform rules were being bent there was a pile on. Whereas when it was strict nobody was trying to break the rules.

KnittedCardi · 07/10/2023 08:54

School uniform never fits. It's always too tight, too loose, too long, too short, because it is not made for either tall slim girls or short curvy girls. I always had to alter ours. Lifting a jumper is no different to taking it off.

KalimbaMoon · 07/10/2023 09:10

I don’t think girls should be forced to wear skirts, it should be optional. A skirt or trousers. No girl should be made to feel ashamed about how her skirt fits, or accused of trying to show off her legs. Knee-length skirts, unless bought in a Tall range, will always look shorter on tall girls. I know, I was one. And I would have given anything to wear trousers to school.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 07/10/2023 09:14

The uniform not allowing trousers is a problem. Asking to lift the jumper to check the waistband isn't.

AllProperTeaIsTheft · 07/10/2023 09:21

Lifting a jumper is not being asked to show body parts.

KalimbaMoon · 07/10/2023 09:32

Asking her to lift her jumper was humiliating. She had done nothing wrong.

Dogsogdog · 07/10/2023 09:34

You didn’t get the answers you wanted so you’ve come to moan here - total non issue. Buy her a bigger skirt and take it in

cosypompoms · 07/10/2023 09:35

I think you are hurt at your daughter being accused of something she hasn't done. I understand but I'd move on. You'll have bigger things to email over on the school journey and this time next year you'll realise this isn't that big.

SM4713 · 07/10/2023 09:43

xyz111 · 07/10/2023 07:55

How should the teacher have asked to check the skirt wasn't rolled?

This??? ^

You admitted yourself that her skirt is too short! She won't be he ONLY tall, skim girl in the year, so it needs altering.

CharlotteBog · 07/10/2023 09:43

I would ask the school for advice on the problem you have - that it is not possible for your child to meet the uniform standards.
Is this the first time they have come across this issue?

CeeChynaa · 07/10/2023 09:44

You’re making a second thread because you didn’t like the answers to your first one? Seriously get a grip

Theunamedcat · 07/10/2023 09:50

Shecwas not asked to strip she was not asked to show any form of skin the fault is yours for sending her in uniform that is too short teachers don't know she "doesn't lie" she is a teenager lying comes with the territory the teacher is probably fed up with parents and children breaking rules for no reason

Stop making teachers lives harder than it already is buy appropriate uniform

WeWereInParis · 07/10/2023 09:55

The main issue is that girls aren't allowed to wear trousers.

Witchcraftandhokum · 07/10/2023 09:58

A complaint is unjustified and will get you nowhere apart from becoming 'that' parent who staff roll their eyes at.

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