Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: chat

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Amber Heard&Johnny Depp verdict

1000 replies

Miscfeminista · 31/05/2022 14:28

Continuation of previous thread

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552076-amber-heardjohnny-depp-trial?page=36&reply=117586863

Speculations on verdict, news related to it, insights into specifics of legal matters, opinions and impressions…let’s keep it going and see how verdict finds us >>>>>>>>>>

OP posts:
Thread gallery
9
Autumndays123 · 02/06/2022 17:23

TalkingCat · 02/06/2022 17:21

He is extremely vindictive and spiteful, he means to ruin her. No way he won't take payment. He'd love nothing more than to bankrupt her.

As would I in his shoes. I'd have her sell her house, car and belongings to pay for what she put me through if I were him.

Autumndays123 · 02/06/2022 17:24

I've just seen Elaine on another US show this morning, she's getting around quite a bit! It's awful that she's portraying the jury and judge as incompetent and stupid. Especially the judge, who in my opinion seemed fair and neutral throughout

TiddyTidTwo · 02/06/2022 17:27

I just watched one (CBS?) it was not much better but the NFL guy pushed back quite hard on her along the lines of if he loses a game he reflects on what he did wrong instead.

prh47bridge · 02/06/2022 17:29

Evidence excluded from this trial included her therapy notes showing contemporaneous reports of Depp's violence

If this is correct, it would have been because her therapy notes simply recorded her claims of Depp's violence and are therefore worthless as evidence. They are hearsay.

medical evidence about her broken nose

There is no medical evidence about her alleged broken nose. She was questioned on the lack of medical records in court and stated that she never sought treatment.

and Stephen Deuters' texts which are crystal clear on the fact that Depp kicked her on a plane ride

Don't know about this - whether they were put forward as evidence and excluded (and, if so, on what grounds) or whether Heard's team didn't put them into evidence at all. In DV cases, it is not uncommon to find the victim agreeing with the abuser's version of events in an attempt to placate them, in much the same way that victims often blame themselves for their abuser's behaviour.

Much was made in this trial of the 'nonexistent' wall phone in Australia (the one Amber said Johnny smashed up)

No, it wasn't. Depp stated that he ripped the phone off the wall. The only question was whether it had been smashed up or not. Depp accepted that he may have smashed it. I believe the manager of the apartment block said that the phone had not been smashed. The significance is that Heard alleged that Depp had cut off his fingertip smashing the phone. If the phone was not smashed, this was clearly untrue, although it does not prove that Heard was responsible for the injury.

He said he'd never headbutted her, and when confronted with audio proving he had, pivoted again and claimed it happened accidentally when he was restraining her

The audio does not prove he headbutted her. It simply shows him using her characterisation of events. It adds some weight to her allegation, but it is far from conclusive. His position is still that there was no headbutt, but there may have been an accidental clash of heads when he was trying to restrain her. An accidental clash of heads is not a headbutt, so I don't see this as a pivot.

Testimony from her friends where they were literally in tears over seeing the state Amber was in after he attacked her

There was no testimony from her friends in this trial. The only witnesses supporting her were her sister, people on her payroll and paid expert witnesses, something Depp's team emphasised to the jury in summing up.

The photos

Which were undermined by showing that there are identical photos with no evidence of bruises. No-one knows whether photos with bruises were doctored to remove the bruises or vice versa, but you shouldn't doctor photos that are going to be used in evidence. Doing so will always cast doubt on their reliability.

LetitiaLeghorn · 02/06/2022 17:30

TalkingCat · 02/06/2022 17:21

He is extremely vindictive and spiteful, he means to ruin her. No way he won't take payment. He'd love nothing more than to bankrupt her.

If I were him, I'd request from her just the amount that was owing to the two charities and then give it to them straightaway. Or even say forget the money, and pay off the remainder of her pledges himself. Except I don't know how much money he has left.

However, if it were me going against my ex for saying untrue and vile things, I'd effing bankrupt him. And go back for more.

(However, as I actually believe some of what she says he did, I wouldn't be that harsh on her.)

TalkingCat · 02/06/2022 17:30

Autumndays123 · 02/06/2022 17:23

As would I in his shoes. I'd have her sell her house, car and belongings to pay for what she put me through if I were him.

That's what he should be doing for what he did to her. The victim-blaming and DARVO on here when it comes to a woman that was a clear victim of abuse is disgraceful.

Sandra1984 · 02/06/2022 17:31

ObjectionHearsay · 02/06/2022 17:10

I have a feeling he will decline payment. He knows she can't pay it, and I don't think this was ever about money for him.

Yes he's going to take her money because his earnings have dropped massively in the last years due to loosing his blockbuster roles and having to maintain his life crazy style, yatchs, a drug habit, houses all over the world and a bunch of 24hr "yes men". He's going to continue screwing her (metaphorically speaking) as much as he can because a) He needs the money and b) He hates her and knows that 10 million is a total drag for her. His ship started sinking a while ago and made sure she sank with him too.

This is the story of two narcissists who refused to let go and move on with their lives so had to continue destroying each other for reasons unknown. Without proper solid proof evidence of police/medical records she should have never written that article, but she took the risk and paid for it.

Sandra1984 · 02/06/2022 17:35

The message I get from the verdict is: If you're going to join the meetoo movement that's totally fine, but please do your homework before and have some very solid evidence before you jump into that ship.

TiddyTidTwo · 02/06/2022 17:36

Stephen Dueters texts I've seen those. Considering what else was admitted what would be a reason to exclude them?

The data? I don't know.

Also the air stewardess on the said flight was on JDs witness list. There were a few more they ended up not using.

Makes me think there's an issue with those texts which could be refuted on rebuttal?

Speculation of course.

BlanketsBanned · 02/06/2022 17:43

TiddyTidTwo · 02/06/2022 17:23

Probably time and the opposite if he takes it.

I'm surprised at the amount I thought it would be minimal.

He could settle for a smaller amount or just gift it to one of the charities, not ACLU though!

I dont think he wants her money, it would be better donated but agree not to aclu. Elaine is just digging an even bigger hole, you can't accuse the jury of being influenced by sm and the judge being unfair, it was her job to prove all the swathes of evidence but she couldnt.

Sandra1984 · 02/06/2022 17:43

@TiddyTidTwo Also the air stewardess on the said flight was on JDs witness list. There were a few more they ended up not using.

I would be VERY surprised to see a stewardess admitting on camera to the rest of the world (that includes her employers/airline) that she likes to take psychedelic drugs with the passengers while doing her job when she's supposed to be in charge of the safety and security of the flight.

TiddyTidTwo · 02/06/2022 17:47

Sandra Christ. What tangled webs they all weaved!!

I thought it was a private jet but I think I assumed that

TheWeeDonkey · 02/06/2022 17:51

Of course he'll take her money. Now his career is over that's a hefty smack addiction he has to pay for.

Sandra1984 · 02/06/2022 17:51

TiddyTidTwo · 02/06/2022 17:47

Sandra Christ. What tangled webs they all weaved!!

I thought it was a private jet but I think I assumed that

Oh ok, then my mistake. Sorry I heard the whole statement on court telly and thought it was a commercial flight, not a private jet. My fault.

Still... the lady was working and even if it's a private flight she's still in charge of safety and security and employed by a company. It doesn't look good for her.

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 17:54

If this is correct, it would have been because her therapy notes simply recorded her claims of Depp's violence and are therefore worthless as evidence. They are hearsay.

Years of reports and bruising observed in therapy. I believe her. I think it's ludicrous they weren't allowed in but I'm aware of the reasoning.

There is no medical evidence about her alleged broken nose. She was questioned on the lack of medical records in court and stated that she never sought treatment.

Untrue. She saw an ENT after the relationship ended but wasn't allowed to bring it in to her testimony.

Don't know about this - whether they were put forward as evidence and excluded (and, if so, on what grounds) or whether Heard's team didn't put them into evidence at all. In DV cases, it is not uncommon to find the victim agreeing with the abuser's version of events in an attempt to placate them, in much the same way that victims often blame themselves for their abuser's behaviour.

If you read the texts saying "When I told him he kicked you he cried. It was disgusting", referring to him as a lost little boy who just wants to get better and saying this will be a turning point, as agreeing with the abuser's version of events to placate them, that's your prerogative. It's as clear as day to me however that it doesn't fit that picture.

No, it wasn't. Depp stated that he ripped the phone off the wall. The only question was whether it had been smashed up or not. Depp accepted that he may have smashed it. I believe the manager of the apartment block said that the phone had not been smashed. The significance is that Heard alleged that Depp had cut off his fingertip smashing the phone. If the phone was not smashed, this was clearly untrue, although it does not prove that Heard was responsible for the injury

She thought he might have done, she never claimed to know exactly what happened. It was continually brought up as showing she lied and she was asked where the photos of a smashed phone were. Depp admitted in UK court he had indeed smashed up a phone.

The audio does not prove he headbutted her. It simply shows him using her characterisation of events. It adds some weight to her allegation, but it is far from conclusive. His position is still that there was no headbutt, but there may have been an accidental clash of heads when he was trying to restrain her. An accidental clash of heads is not a headbutt, so I don't see this as a pivot.

"I headbutted you in the fucking forehead. That doesn't break a nose."
I'd say that's conclusive. And it shows Depp’s lies.

There was no testimony from her friends in this trial. The only witnesses supporting her were her sister, people on her payroll and paid expert witnesses, something Depp's team emphasised to the jury in summing up.

Yes, a particularly horrible way to shame someone given victims of abuse often end up very isolated. I'm talking about the testimony from Rocky Pennington, Io Tillet Wright et al. And one of Depp's oldest friends saw finger mark bruises on her arm.

Which were undermined by showing that there are identical photos with no evidence of bruises. No-one knows whether photos with bruises were doctored to remove the bruises or vice versa, but you shouldn't doctor photos that are going to be used in evidence. Doing so will always cast doubt on their reliability.

There are pictures clearly showing her injuries. I agree two were identical, but they do show her bruises. Yes there was doubt cast on them, but there was also an expert rebuttal to that. Amber's experts were consistently more qualified in their fields as well. I'm not sure 'metadata grandpa' or whatever he was being called, is someone I'd put a huge amount of stock by.

To sum up, she had plenty of evidence. You can poke holes in it if you want to but it's a fact that she had evidence going back years. Obviously we disagree, I wanted to respond to your points but I don't think it will be helpful to keep going back and forth.

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 17:56

Yes, a particularly horrible way to shame someone given victims of abuse often end up very isolated. I'm talking about the testimony from Rocky Pennington, Io Tillet Wright et al. And one of Depp's oldest friends saw finger mark bruises on her arm.

Sorry, to be clear - recorded depositions. Sad for Amber that they didn't turn up to support her in court but it's not everyone who would have the courage to go through that on the world stage. I'm not sure I would. And if you're going to say they're no longer friends, I know that. It doesn't take away from what they witnessed at the time.

ObjectionHearsay · 02/06/2022 17:58

Just playing devil's advocate.

So if he takes the money he's making her pay and ruining her more.

If he doesn't take the money, he's doing it to look good and that's vomit inducing.

The man can't win can he 🤦🏻‍♀️

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 17:58

Stephen Dueters texts I've seen those. Considering what else was admitted what would be a reason to exclude them?

Hearsay. He wouldn't testify so his texts would be hearsay.

Londondreams1 · 02/06/2022 17:59

In other news her new film In the Fire sounds amazing and I don't like films generally, so maybe people who support Heard could support her by going to see it.
I remain on the fence, they were both abusive, she made some biting raw comments to him that basically would've seen her getting hit by other men, and he did the same to her.

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 18:00

ObjectionHearsay · 02/06/2022 17:58

Just playing devil's advocate.

So if he takes the money he's making her pay and ruining her more.

If he doesn't take the money, he's doing it to look good and that's vomit inducing.

The man can't win can he 🤦🏻‍♀️

Tbf I would see it as performative if he didn't take the money, given his obvious hatred of Amber. But would still think more of him doing that. I don't think he will though.

Autumndays123 · 02/06/2022 18:03

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 17:54

If this is correct, it would have been because her therapy notes simply recorded her claims of Depp's violence and are therefore worthless as evidence. They are hearsay.

Years of reports and bruising observed in therapy. I believe her. I think it's ludicrous they weren't allowed in but I'm aware of the reasoning.

There is no medical evidence about her alleged broken nose. She was questioned on the lack of medical records in court and stated that she never sought treatment.

Untrue. She saw an ENT after the relationship ended but wasn't allowed to bring it in to her testimony.

Don't know about this - whether they were put forward as evidence and excluded (and, if so, on what grounds) or whether Heard's team didn't put them into evidence at all. In DV cases, it is not uncommon to find the victim agreeing with the abuser's version of events in an attempt to placate them, in much the same way that victims often blame themselves for their abuser's behaviour.

If you read the texts saying "When I told him he kicked you he cried. It was disgusting", referring to him as a lost little boy who just wants to get better and saying this will be a turning point, as agreeing with the abuser's version of events to placate them, that's your prerogative. It's as clear as day to me however that it doesn't fit that picture.

No, it wasn't. Depp stated that he ripped the phone off the wall. The only question was whether it had been smashed up or not. Depp accepted that he may have smashed it. I believe the manager of the apartment block said that the phone had not been smashed. The significance is that Heard alleged that Depp had cut off his fingertip smashing the phone. If the phone was not smashed, this was clearly untrue, although it does not prove that Heard was responsible for the injury

She thought he might have done, she never claimed to know exactly what happened. It was continually brought up as showing she lied and she was asked where the photos of a smashed phone were. Depp admitted in UK court he had indeed smashed up a phone.

The audio does not prove he headbutted her. It simply shows him using her characterisation of events. It adds some weight to her allegation, but it is far from conclusive. His position is still that there was no headbutt, but there may have been an accidental clash of heads when he was trying to restrain her. An accidental clash of heads is not a headbutt, so I don't see this as a pivot.

"I headbutted you in the fucking forehead. That doesn't break a nose."
I'd say that's conclusive. And it shows Depp’s lies.

There was no testimony from her friends in this trial. The only witnesses supporting her were her sister, people on her payroll and paid expert witnesses, something Depp's team emphasised to the jury in summing up.

Yes, a particularly horrible way to shame someone given victims of abuse often end up very isolated. I'm talking about the testimony from Rocky Pennington, Io Tillet Wright et al. And one of Depp's oldest friends saw finger mark bruises on her arm.

Which were undermined by showing that there are identical photos with no evidence of bruises. No-one knows whether photos with bruises were doctored to remove the bruises or vice versa, but you shouldn't doctor photos that are going to be used in evidence. Doing so will always cast doubt on their reliability.

There are pictures clearly showing her injuries. I agree two were identical, but they do show her bruises. Yes there was doubt cast on them, but there was also an expert rebuttal to that. Amber's experts were consistently more qualified in their fields as well. I'm not sure 'metadata grandpa' or whatever he was being called, is someone I'd put a huge amount of stock by.

To sum up, she had plenty of evidence. You can poke holes in it if you want to but it's a fact that she had evidence going back years. Obviously we disagree, I wanted to respond to your points but I don't think it will be helpful to keep going back and forth.

As soon as the ENT specialist was mentioned to be honest I thought it was more to do with her well-documented cocaine problem.

ObjectionHearsay · 02/06/2022 18:03

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 18:00

Tbf I would see it as performative if he didn't take the money, given his obvious hatred of Amber. But would still think more of him doing that. I don't think he will though.

I see what your saying.

Maybe he will take it and donate it to the children's hospital. That's a charity very close to his heart because of his daughter.

Aspiringmatriarch · 02/06/2022 18:08

As soon as the ENT specialist was mentioned to be honest I thought it was more to do with her well-documented cocaine problem.

She said it showed past fractures. But I'd have to have more information to make a judgement on that and it wasn't allowed in. Not sure why Depp would object to evidence of her being a cokehead though.

Miscfeminista · 02/06/2022 18:09

If this is correct, it would have been because her therapy notes simply recorded her claims of Depp's violence and are therefore worthless as evidence. They are hearsay.

They both attended therapy. He did not deny violence to therapists, that's why some of them called it"mutual abuse". Only what Depp says is not hearsay I guess

There is no medical evidence about her alleged broken nose. She was questioned on the lack of medical records in court and stated that she never sought treatment.

She had more recent medical records that say her nose is in bad shape and she'll need some surgery. It was broken apparentley but not the bridge of nose being completely shambled as everyone seems to imagine. People live with deviated septums that obstruct breathing for years, be it caused by injury or inborn

Don't know about this - whether they were put forward as evidence and excluded (and, if so, on what grounds) or whether Heard's team didn't put them into evidence at all. In DV cases, it is not uncommon to find the victim agreeing with the abuser's version of events in an attempt to placate them, in much the same way that victims often blame themselves for their abuser's behaviour.

Exactly, we don't know on what grounds it wasn't submitted in evidence. It may have been as simple as Deuters not consenting to that being used but I don't know how that works, I'm speculating. In DV cases it's also very common for people to justify abusers in all kinds of ways

No, it wasn't. Depp stated that he ripped the phone off the wall. The only question was whether it had been smashed up or not. Depp accepted that he may have smashed it. I believe the manager of the apartment block said that the phone had not been smashed. The significance is that Heard alleged that Depp had cut off his fingertip smashing the phone. If the phone was not smashed, this was clearly untrue, although it does not prove that Heard was responsible for the injury.

At this point I would say you need to rewatch the trial. He has flat out denied that there was a wall phone on US trial(he"didn't remember")but in UK's one he says he just doesn't know"how much time he had spent on it". She said he might have cut his finger while smashing phone(since she did not see when his finger was cut), not that he did

The audio does not prove he headbutted her. It simply shows him using her characterisation of events. It adds some weight to her allegation, but it is far from conclusive. His position is still that there was no headbutt, but there may have been an accidental clash of heads when he was trying to restrain her. An accidental clash of heads is not a headbutt, so I don't see this as a pivot.

He explicitly says in the tape it happened but that her nose injury could not have been from it because"it wasn't so bad". You are trying to cover up for him harder than his lawyers seems.

There was no testimony from her friends in this trial. The only witnesses supporting her were her sister, people on her payroll and paid expert witnesses, something Depp's team emphasised to the jury in summing up.

You are right: despite these people distancing themselves from her, they still agreed to testify with what goes to her defense. That's not"only"and mentioning paid expert witnesses is close to irrelevant because they weren't outnumbering Depps expert witnesses as far as I remember

Which were undermined by showing that there are identical photos with no evidence of bruises. No-one knows whether photos with bruises were doctored to remove the bruises or vice versa, but you shouldn't doctor photos that are going to be used in evidence. Doing so will always cast doubt on their reliability.

There was absolutley not a single picture to picture comparison where there was a bruise and one with no bruise on it. You are either intentionally misleading or really haven't followed. Her expert witness testified that the picture was simply opened in what is titled photoeditor, which is default app on Apples products for viewing pictures, not that there was editing done. JD's expert witness successfully misled a lot of people on this.

OP posts:
FrippEnos · 02/06/2022 18:11

It will be interesting to see what grounds AH thinks she can appeal on.

As far as I am aware she would have to first prove that there were errors in the trial or that the judge's understanding of the law.

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.