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Feminism: chat

300 babies lost due to fixation on natural birth

35 replies

MoltenLasagne · 26/03/2022 22:56

The final Ockden report into failings at Shrewsbury Trust are in tomorrow's Times. Dreadful reading, and the stories of being ignored by midwives and doctors are sadly very familiar to many.

Those poor families who suffered due to these policies and then had to fight against cover ups to get justice. It is a national shame.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/95c4dfc6-ad13-11ec-9f8f-48b5aba04080?shareToken=cee7e35a29b97e868e46576145630ae6

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SpringLobelia · 30/03/2022 13:52

When I say I find this validating in some way- it is because for years when I have said that I felt something had gone horribly wrong with his birth I have been fobbed off at every turn. The 10 hours in labour really pisses me off. I was in labour in the hospital from 8 am in the morning (the only time they would allow me to come in when I rang them at 11 pm the night before to say my waters had broken and I was having such severe contractions I was passing out) and the child was born 1 am the following morning from going to hospital so even the being in hospital time alone was far in excess of the claimed 10 hours.

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givethatbabyaname · 30/03/2022 14:05

I’m so sorry for all the women, and all the children who have suffered because of poor healthcare.

I’ve never, ever understood the push for “natural” versus “medicalised” childbirth. Vaginal birthing is fraught with risks for mother and for baby. What is modern medicine for if not to improve our chances? The recent trend towards brainwashing women into believing drugs damage, that intervention is fraught with risks and should be avoided, breastfeeding is the best option etc is horribly, criminally cynical and self-serving. Getting at pregnant women when most aren’t medically qualified enough to know best for themselves, tugging on their Achilles heel - it’s Machiavellian, evil. Almost entirely unrelated to the best possible outcomes for mother and baby, almost entirely to do with the management of funds in a public healthcare setting and a baseline disregard for women’s health. Geriatric care and medicine is even worse. I can’t bear to think what is going unreported in that field.

NHS healthcare can be amazing, truly world-class. It can also be shockingly life-damaging or, as we can see, fatal.

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ForTheLoveOfSleep · 30/03/2022 14:10

My younger sister very nearly died due to regulations such as these. Her first child was over 9lbs and she was begging for a c-section but they kept making her push. She managed it but burst an artery in the process and was immediately rushed away for surgery and several blood transfusions. My mum was with her and she vividly remembers the midwives faces going ghost white once they realised what happened.

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BigGreen · 30/03/2022 14:34

JFC I felt ill reading the scale of this and the victim-blaming. Can't we protest or something? This makes me want to just show my upset and outrage on the streets.

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Terfeywithallthetrimmings · 30/03/2022 15:05

It makes me absolutely mad reading this. Do we imagine for a moment if men had to go through a similar kind of trauma to labour they would be forced into doing it "naturally" and at risk to themselves. My children are both grown up but both hospital births were traumatic. In both cases, i was denied pain relief for hours and verbally dismissed and belittled for wanting it. First time, I was eventually given an epidural which was bodged and resulted in a dural tap. Not nice. Second time, they failed to get all the placenta out and it came out later when I was on the (very crowded) ward. Somehow I was to blame! Women are still being treated like dirt and put at risk when at their most vulnerable. It has got to stop.

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UsernameNotAvailableHmm · 31/03/2022 18:29

So sad to hear
Thoughts and prayers for all involved in this horrific scandal

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ikeairgin · 31/03/2022 21:12

I've been thinking deeply about this issue for a long time.

Can I first say that it's appalling and a tragedy and a disgrace that it took mothers, not the inspection bodies to pick this up and my heart goes out to all those mothers, partners and families affected by this.

Clearly, the issue isn't one type of birth prioritised over another per sae. We are mammals. We birth well when we feel safe. So many interventions and practices around birth are to ensure that the health care professionals feel safe in their practice, not that the mother and partner feel safe and listened to. Birth is not safe for some women, however, that's a fact.

We have a sense called Interoception, it is a lesser-known sense that helps you understand and feel what's going on inside your body. Mothers when birthing often know when things are going wrong- because of this.

What it actually boils down to is a refusal to listen to women and practice woman-centred-care. Woman centred care is staff intensive but it does lead to better outcomes for birthing women. There are studies that clearly show this but it is expensive. There was a midwife home birth team in London called the Albany Practice who were experienced practitioners in woman centred care and they smashed the intervention rates and they had better outcomes for their women who were generally from lower socioeconomic backgrounds, so a double whammy in results. They were closed down because it was felt that the women in their care got a better service (and we must ensure a shit service for every woman, we can't have some getting a gold standard of care and showing up the hospital practices) and that the cost of providing this care where the women (98% of them) were delivered by their named midwife (it was a case-loading style of service provision) was felt to be too much.

Instead we load on the cost of poor care off into the future. I have a child with a SpLD which may or may not have been caused by hypoxic-ischaemic encephalopathy (HIE) at birth - we will never know. Add in the repercussions of my trauma and the cost of treating my poor mental health and there you are - actual avoidable cost.

I put that in not to bang on about my own trauma - which incidentally pales into insignificance compared to what some of these families have suffered but just to say I do have/had skin in the game.

I sat on a maternity services liaison committee (as it was known back in the day) because I was passionate about woman centred care. I found to my horror that the NHS is as institutionalised as any other large public body. It has been designed to work for the staff and not for the patients. There is bullying and intimidation at all levels. It really is like turning a large ship to get things changed I found. This was 18 years ago, but I see that not much has changed in the interim.

It's about time we demanded one midwife for one woman. And the same team throughout. Anyone remember domino care? That was where your community midwifery team / hopefully your named midwife came out to you in early labour, assessed you and went with you to hospital to deliver your baby. All gone. There's a national shortage or midwives, and those that enter burn out pretty quickly due to the unsafe working conditions, there literally aren't enough midwives on the wards.

We must make noise and demand change. This second rate and under-staffed and under-funded model cannot continue. We owe it to these women and babies to demand better. Birth is a risky business but research shows what makes it safer and that IS woman centred, compassionate care. That means listening to women, and acting on their concerns.

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Villagewaspbyke · 31/03/2022 21:15

I don’t think it’s just money. I think it’s dogma and poor management

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Villagewaspbyke · 31/03/2022 21:16

Also lack of respect and lack of willingness to listen to women

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Cameliah · 31/03/2022 21:33

At 41 weeks pregnant with an enormous bump, I suffered through a 24 hour labour before the midwives agreed I needed medical intervention and transferred me to a ward to see a consultant. The consultant was horrified and said my stomach was huge, the baby was massive and there was no way I could have given birth naturally without serious injury to myself and the baby. She said wtf were the midwives thinking?! She arranged a c section immediately and she said she wished she’d seen me sooner because a baby that big should have been induced about 37 weeks - a whole month earlier!

While I was waiting for my c section, the midwives who were monitoring me still kept saying things like “Are you sure you don’t want to try for a natural birth? You can still change your mind about the c section?” Even though they had literally just heard the consultant saying “god you’re huge, attempting a natural birth would have killed you and your baby”. My husband had to ask the midwives to stop saying those things because it was distressing me.

So yes, there is an obsession with natural birth at all expenses and it’s dangerous and costs lives.

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