Sport

[Tibtom]

Once girls reach their teens they disproportionately drop sport. How can we encourage physical fitness in girls, especially in light of lack of changing facilities that respect a teenage girls acute need for privacy and dignity, or the lack of fair competition including any chance of success at higher leves?

Haven't read the whole thread but has anyone mentioned lack of space yet?

Yes boys dominate these types of spaces but there is also another problem in schools and that is the sheer lack of space within their grounds
More and more schools seem to have little or no playground space. Sports fields are sold off for housing etc.

It's the right kind of space as well, fields are great in summer but can't be used for most of the year.
We've put in AstroTurf on part of our field to increase the space that can be used year round.
However, any 'open' spaces quickly gets colonised by the boys.
Zoning is shown to be most effective at managing behaviour, promoting fairness and maximising space. You do need SLT to put physical boundaries in place though as in my experience just zoning by signage is ignored.

The comments about 'not wearing gym knickers' or 'being allowed to wear normal leggings/joggers' surely this has already been implemented years ago? I started secondary school 2002 and gym knickers were a thing of the dim and distant past then, and that was nearly 20 years ago! Even in primary in the mid nineties we never had to do PE in our underwear.

My suggestions

1. proper changing facilities or timetabling to allow children to either come in to school in sportswear or do it after lunch and go straight home. Enough private cubicles to change if needed, and time to do so, not being expected to walk ten mins to the local pool, get changed, have a swimming lesson, get changed and walk back all within an hour

2. different types of sport. This will probably mean a lot more money being spent (but worth it lower the health costs of an increasingly obese nation?) but could be managed if several local schools came together, tax benefits were given for private schools or universities to share their facilities with state schools, local clubs, gyms, uni sports clubs worked out cheaper agreements, etc. For lots of girls the standard team sports of netball, hockey, some dance, etc are boring and embarrassing. If they are introduced to a wide range of horse riding, roller derby, skateboarding, climbing, paddleboarding, skiiing, tennis, archery...the chances are most will find something they are interested in.

3. If you are going to do team sports a) actually bother to teach the children the rule of the game rather than shouting at them when they haven't picked it up by osmosis, and b) split them into groups according to ability so the sporty keen ones can play together and not put off the ones who aren't so good but can be encouraged to have a laugh if people aren't moaning at them for being useless. Could include more government subsidised after school and summer holiday clubs (with the teachers actually being paid to run them rather than expected to volunteer!) so also solve parents problem of childcare.

4. give teens 13-16 free access to gyms at certain times.

5. have a reconsider why PE teachers have such a bad reputation! It actually seems like quite a decent job, good salary, long holidays, job safety, much less marking than other teachers, get to be out and about which presumably is something you'd like if you are active - so god knows why it attracts so many aggressive creeps with a power complex!

Private schools already get tax breaks because they are allowed to be charities. I would suggest that they be allowed to keep their charitable status only if they properly share their facilities with state schools.

One observation about PE teachers, is that generally they are into sports/activity/competitive sports, and are usually fairly fit themselves. I think that can hinder their ability to understand/empathise with children, girls, who are reluctant to engage with sports at school. Especially those who are already a bit overweight and unfit. They don't get the deep embarrassment and worry about how they are perceived when they give an activity a try and are not as capable as the other children.

@Potteringshed

Oh, I have so many thoughts about this.

1. I think representation matters. A big issue for me when I was competing in my teens was that the women I saw represented as desirable, as aspirational, as, frankly, "real" women did not look athletic. They were smaller, thinner, more dainty. I spent years feeling "wrong" for being big and bulky. Even sports wear is modelled by non athletes. I wish there had been more role models like Gina Carano around when I was younger and I still think we desperately need more than just Gina Carano now.

2. I think PE is taught abominably in schools and is turned into a punishment so often. I wish there was more variety of sport available, so people like me who are crap at hand/eye coordination could be taught that sport can be fun and doesn't just have to be "have ball thrown at you and be shouted at if you don't catch it". Better funding for sport in schools, better funding for youth sports clubs, more options, and maybe PE teachers shouting less would be madly helpful.

3. I think the massive lack of broader interest in women's sport sucks. I'd love to see women's football broadcast at reasonable hours on TV, for example. That's something the wider media could hugely help with. There is something wrong when the only power lifter that most people know the name of is Laurel Hubbard because she's the only one talked about and that's because she's the first trans athlete. Most people couldn't name a female football player beyond Megan Rapinoe.

4. I wish sport could be presented as something that it's ok to be bad at. I know that sounds counter productive, but I am very sporty yet in my teens I dreaded PE because it felt like the space I went to fail and be told I wasn't good enough. Why can't PE be fun? Why can't we teach girls that it's ok to be a slow runner or a swimmer who just likes splashing about in the water? I love running now but it took me years to learn it was ok to just amble round the park and build from there. Competition should be an optional extra in exercise, not quite as bedded in at base and not quite so toxic in its expression.

The bias of PE teachers and coaches towards the pretty, blonde, slim girls I think I have seen documented sonewhere.

I've 2 DDs. Eldest for that stereotype and was treated as 'sporty'. Lots of opportunites throughout schools. Dd2 doesn't but she's got just as much handers coordination as DD1, and if anything is stronger and can throw and hit a ball with more force. As she has got older I have pointed out the more solid shaped or muscly (eg strong) young women in tennis, netball, hockey, swimming, etc... And I have battled with her to keep her in sports and she's improved hugely. But still, at school, she is treated as 'unsporty' It's so damaging that image and ability are tied up in this way.

It's been a struggle to buy both girls sports kit. Regardless of their sizes, cwe always have to buy online to get proper technical clothing and equipment for girls sports.

I also agree that girls (and many boys). would like to do PE sports and the emphasis not being on winning or being the best. It's so healthy to take part for the sake of taking part, to have fun, to get fitter. At school the message is, if you're not A team standard, why are you even bothering to waste everyone's time'

Media. Why did radio 4 have to have a piece on this morning about the Scottish football team losing. I seem to remember their women's football team playing brilliantly in the women's world cup and I never heard it mentioned on national news.

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Private schools are charities because the law says that the provision of education is a charitable aim. The tax break is worth about £200 per pupil per year, and if there was a way to just relinquish charitable status without closing the charity, I think many would take it. As things stand, they have to follow the law on winding up a charity which essentially means closure, the selling of assets and the donation of those finds to a similarly aimed charity.

I have never seen a workable proposal for how it would be done - if anyone knows of one, would they be kind and link it?

OTOH, private schools provide a disproportionate number of Olympians, and elite athletes generally (with the exception of boys' football where the elite academy set up dominates).

This might be because they offer a greater range of sports (many delivered by staff in lunchtime clubs) and have more sport timetabled.

in terms of offering a wider range of sport, I really don't see why dance is so rarely offered, plus dance-type fitness sessions.

And just like those who need learning support will go to additional support classes, I think those who are less good at sport would benefit from coaching to improve things like hand-to-eye coordination. We shouldn't overlook poor motor skills, and the earlier the intervention the better

I seem to remember their women's football team playing brilliantly in the women's world cup and I never heard it mentioned on national news.

Made even more amazing as some players weren't even being paid full time and had 'top up' jobs.

I know this adds another thing to the list of things a mother has to do but at least it is one thing of which we can be in control.

I'm not sure you can control genetics. A mother who enjoys sports is likely to have the right genes for it and therefore pass them onto their child.

I also think the way we teach physical exercise in school is poor and only works if you enjoy team sports. DD became physically much less active
because hormones hit in puberty which kick started her Hypermobility. She went from hyper fit to unable to do any of the sports offered either at school or home because they were completely unsuitable.

If you need just basic fitness; strength (weights, bodyweight) and cardio (zumba, body attack) there is nothing.

If anyone is interested there's a programme called Box to be Fit that provides the equipment and activity cards for boxing training. KS2 and upwards. Once you've seen it been run( they do a session to show you) it's really easy to run and great for self competition.

For me it was the focus on sport that was the issue. If I'dnbeen allowed to run on my own for a pe lesson I'd have loved exercise, but having the pressure of letting down a team was horrendous.

Pe kits are a problem too. My mum wouldn't let me shave my legs so every summer pe lesson was awful as I'd be teased about my hairy legs.

skip2bfit.com/senior-box2bfit?ref=box2bfit
The pack can be bought for 800 quid. Add a couple of crbs for parent volunteers and you could get started for under a grand.

@MouseyTheVampireSlayer Sorry to hear your SLT were so unsupportive. Those boys have learnt that being aggressive will help them get what they want and your SLT confirmed that. It's terrible that you were harassed by the boys

What can we as parents do to encourage zoning in schools? Are there any studies that show how successful it can be? Can we write to the school, academy group or LA? Basically, how can we r side awareness? I was thinking the decision needs to come top down for it to stick (as per your experience). Also, does zoning mean more resources?

Not sure I have any wisdom to impart but my 15 yr old DD has always loved PE and is taking PE GCSE. However there is only one GCSE class in her huge comp and out of 30 kids, only 9 are girls.

She's always loved her sport, particularly football which was a challenge when she was younger because it was a struggle to find girls football teams and she has always been shy and not wanted to join a boys team, which was often suggested when we couldn't find a team for her to join. I remember a boys team that she joined for a couple of weeks where none of the boys would pass the ball to her!

Thankfully we did find a girls team when she was around 8 yrs old and she's still with them. Encouragingly where there used to be 15-20 girls of different ages in those days, at training now there must be 50-60 girls of different ages which goes to show how far things have come.

Things that have discouraged DD over the years, particularly during early puberty were the onset of periods and the skin tight football kit - she still hates the fact that the shirts are clingy and fitted because she's never been a skinny minny and is v conscious of her body still.

At school she constantly moans that the PE teachers favour the boys and that all the examples during their theory lessons are about boys. Interestingly the girls do so much better in the theory that they are now being asked to tutor the boys to bring their standards up!!! Seems like girls are still being seen as a 'helpmate' !!!

She has a football assessment coming up at school and has to compete against the boys because there aren't enough girls who play football which has increased her anxiety.

She loves watching the women's football on TV and that has got much more coverage in recent years which is great, particularly for showing women who are muscular and strong rather than the Love Island type.

She would love to do PE A Level but has been discouraged by her teachers as she doesn't play for the county (she had a try out 5 years ago but was unsuccessful and struggles with her confidence so is reluctant to try again). I think it would be a real shame if this put her off as PE lessons are the highlight of her week.

Re a mother's role in showing the way, I would just say that I have a disability and have never been able to demonstrate any sporting ability for her. Over the years this had induced a considerable amount of guilt but I have tried to make up for it by all the hours spent in the car driving her all over the county for fixtures and training sessions at the local academy.

Not sure whether this contributes much to the debate but thought sharing my experience might help.

PS my younger DD is dance mad and loved doing this at school. They used to offer Dance GCSE which appealed to some girls who weren't keen on traditional sport Sadly they no longer offer it and I think this is a real shame. She's not at all pleased that this option has gone. Not sure whether it was down to funding or staffing, but I think dance can be a great alternative for those who aren't "sporty".

One thing that could be done is approaching the pta. Our pta raise a lot of money but they decide how it's spent and it's not always effective. We have a very expensive projector bought by the pta that gathers dust all year and is used for a cinema night where the kids chat, eat popcorn and mostly ignore the film.

Zoning is shown to work in a great deal of studies for safety and inclusion. Here's a nice little summary of why.
www.espplay.co.uk/why-zoned-school-playgrounds-have-new-importance/

I'd say most schools are part zoned at the moment. Small areas are built specifically but the large main playground area remains unchanged, because of the need to have an accessible court for netball etc.
However, moveable signage and barriers can be used to break up this space, but buying them isn't the difficult part. It's the implementation.
Most recess times are covered by support staff who are low down in the hierarchy. In the model that works, these staff are empowered to uphold the rules and sanction where appropriate. A very common culture however is for SLT and class teachers to regularly overturn sanctions and blame the low levelled staff for not managing behaviour well enough. This in my experience is simply not true, but means that more senior staff can apply out of sight out of mind- bad behaviour doesn't happen in our school approach.
I've had dinner ladies reduced to nervous wrecks and very calm lovely male staff been shocked and shaking by the torrent of swearing and abuse they've had, with SLT then blaming them for incidents. It's really toxic. I'm not sure how parents could help to be honest, as all schools have a behaviour system so the only way to know it's not being applied fairly is to ask the support staff and we'll behaved children.
I did this in a survey and used it as leverage to implement zones. As shown, the school did this in practice but in reality the zones are no longer in play. Yet if you look at our website it's up there, nice shiny zones etc.
My perhaps one question you could ask is when do the girls get an opportunity to play football. Don't be fobbed off by the everyone is allowed to play malarkey, as that doesn't happen. If the school hasn't got a timetable in place it's a good idea to ask for one that alternates girls and boys.

However, this on its own isn't enough. Generally the girls lack confidence owning space on their days and need an enthusiastic and bulshy member of staff to.facuilitate it. Once they've gained confidence they can back away but generally they need to get on hand because girls are socialised to let the boys play and before you know it the boys have taken over again. This is a good role for sporty parents with a bit of free time on their hands to volunteer for.

I suppose my main point is everything stems from behaviour and if that's not in place you can't make the improvement you need. Girls and shy boys will always stick to the fringes unless.empowered to do so and that takes a whole school and parental effort.

She would love to do PE A Level but has been discouraged by her teachers as she doesn't play for the county (she had a try out 5 years ago but was unsuccessful and struggles with her confidence so is reluctant to try again). I think it would be a real shame if this put her off as PE lessons are the highlight of her week.

Unacceptable and not inclusive at all. Schools insisting on this are on very dodgy ground. If she isn't too old already I'd recommend you take that further as it would be a shame if she missed out.

I know it's not strictly sport but since school I got into aerobics, then body pump etc. and the whole range of commercial fitness classes, forming a lifelong habit of exercise. Is this type of activity considered in schools?

I did enjoy the school sports, but I do remember how many girls were reluctant participants and wonder how many went on to take up adult fitness classes despite that.

The comment about timetabling and reserving pitches for girls sessions is spot on.

The campaign mentioned upthread is 'Make Space for Girls', they campaign for facilities and public spaces for teenage girls.
makespaceforgirls.co.uk/research/

makespaceforgirls.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Make-Space-for-Girls-Summary-of-Research-findings-December-2020-web.pdf

I did fitness circuits which is similar to body pump.
One difficulty is you need teachers skilled and confident enough to run these clubs. It usually falls to support staff as teachers don't have time, who are either not paid or paid their hourly rate which is so paltry it's not really worth it (most support staff have kids or a side hustle)
Paying support staff a good wage for running things would help in my opinion. They still have to compete for space with the competitive clubs, but showing support and appreciation for staff giving up their time is key.

@MouseyTheVampireSlayer - that's interesting- are you familiar with requirements for A level? I struggle to believe that everyone taking it would be an elite sportsperson. She's Yr 10 at the moment so would obviously wait and see how she does in her GCSE. Interestingly she was heartily encouraged to take GCSE PE by her Y9 teacher but unfortunately both her GCSE teachers are men who seem to know very little about the girls' capabilities (and possibly care even less). For some reason in Yrs 7-9 the girls were all taught PE by women teachers and the boys by men but at GCSE there are no women PE teachers. Cynically I wonder whether this is done to keep the boys happy!!

Note I don't do those clubs anymore because I wasn't supported in my behaviour management decisions. I was running a potentially very dangerous activity if the rules weren't followed and as the.school sent the message that kids not listening and wandering around using the equipment while I was explaining was appropriate I decided I wasn't going to take that professional risk, as they took away my ability to make it safe.

Of course it was a pair of boys that showed this behaviour and stopped a club that was popular with girls and less sporty boys and Sen.

I'm afraid I am primary so don't know.the syllabus. From what I can see though the only requirements are GCSEs or equivalent (not necessarily even in pe) and aptitude for theory.

However, judging by my past colleagues who have been pe teachers and thus presumably have the a level, there's no requirement to represent county. I can think of at least two teachers I could absolutely cream in most sports and I'm not even that good.
Looking at the course components a scientific.mind is more useful than physical eliteness. I'd be pushing your child's.science results or predicted grades as proof she'll flourish.

Oh and just to say, any teacher discouraging a pupil who is likely to get a god grade in their subject is an absolute idiot.
So if your daughter does take it I'd expect she'd have to do a lot of self teaching.
It's a ridiculous requirement as it would stop say an elite footballer who played for their town from taking part. I imagine that would bar a lot of famous sportspeople.from doing it.
Ridiculous.

Thanks. We will keep an open mind then and see how she does. She's doing triple Science and loves all the theory re sports so to us it seems like a natural progression. Realistically she probably isn't going to have a career as a professional footballer (but that's no different to most of the boys in her class too). However, I am a firm believer in encouraging girls to continue with their passions and it would be a great shame if she couldn't combine that with her education at some level.

Good luck with your continuing efforts in primary. We were lucky in that DCs primary offered a reasonable range of after school sports considering they were a small village school.

I do think it's so important to have female coaches and teachers when possible for the girls to have role models. DD also plays tennis and she was quick to notice that all the coaches at her tennis club are male. I keep telling her that she could change that as an adult and get into coaching herself but I doubt it's very well paid. It's noticeable too at the tennis club that whilst the younger players are evenly split into girls and boys, in the teenagers groups boys definitely outnumber girls. This poses problems for the girls who either have to take on the boys (and find this challenging in the extreme due to the force at which the boys hit the ball - often it seems to prove how superior they are!!) or have a very small pool of other girls to play against.

Most of my daughter's friends are not remotely interested in sport which again is hard because she doesn't have others to talk about these things with. It saddens me as she is often on the edges of her friendship groups as she's not into makeup or boyfriends but that's another thread. I think if women's sports had a greater presence in the media maybe girls would feel more inclined? Just musings really. I must read up on it so I feel more empowered .

Whilst she may not be a professional footballer, she can do so much in that industry.
Coaches, physics, even pe teachers (not that I'd recommend teaching if you want a good work/life balance and salary) they're all needed to encourage the next generation of girls.
This is why I think promoting the 2023 women's world cup is important as it's just starting to get the kind of publicity that will snowball.
In terms of friendship groups I know.i.lacked confidence in sport to really do anything at that age. It was only after discovering my own niche sport I realised I was actually good at something (certainly not great) I think as you get older you appreciate self competition and achievements a bit more. Possibly because comparison isn't encouraged as much as at school.

The world cup has been on the radar in this house for a while!! Hence constant begging from DD for us to go to Australia or New Zealand on holiday!!! Must get a lottery ticket and hope that Covid is a memory by then