Enjoy beating up women? Become a policeman!

[Clymene]

An FOI request by the Bureau of Investigative Journalism has found that most forces simply don't investigate allegations of domestic violence against serving officers:

'there had been nearly 700 reports of domestic abuse by police officers in the three years to 2018 – averaging more than four a week. Less than one in ten reports resulted in a dismissal or warning. Only 3.9% of reports resulted in a conviction, compared with 6.2% among the general public.'

The police are deeply institutionally misogynist.

Full article (warning, contains graphic details of physical and emotional abuse): www.thebureauinvestigates.com/stories/2021-06-15/years-of-living-in-fear-police-still-failing-partners-of-violent-officers

I don’t.
I interpret the thread title as meaning that those who like to hit are going to be attracted to positions where hitting is sometimes legal.
My abuser joined in the days where beatings were pretty normal. It may be better now among young recruits. I don’t know.

@Clymene

Asaph I see the Not My Nigel crew are out in force this morning

I agree. Some of the minimising on this thread is shocking.

What would you like other officers to do about it? If I see something wrong, I report it. If I get allocated a DV case, I investigate it. If I don't see my male colleagues "abusing" their partners in their private lives then what action am I supposed to take? Can you see inside other peoples' houses and minds?

The cops investigating other cops for DV won't be known to them and will be on a specialist professional standards/anti-corruption team so they won't be investigating "one of their own" as you seem to imply, other than the fact they do the same profession.

The CPS do direct investigations and enquiries. Any evidence that is or isnt gathered is written on the evidence log and can be requested so you can see exactly why enquiries were or weren't pursued by the police.

These posts just aren't helpful. It stops genuine victims coming forward because they think the police won't be bothered. We are bothered. If we can't convict then it's not on you (and most of the time, not on us). Most DV happens behind closed doors between two people, the same with rape. That's why it's so hard to convict.

I interpret the thread title as meaning that those who like to hit are going to be attracted to positions where hitting is sometimes legal.

That makes sense. The problem isn't the police, the issue is that certain professions need to be extra vigilant, and spot and weed out those who abuse their position.

Abusers will be attracted to positions they can abuse. We're quite conscious of that with roles related to children, but the same principle would apply to police.

Some of the most sinister and upsetting threads I've read on the Relationships board have been from women being abused by partners who were policemen.

@Gothichouse40

I object to the inflammatory title of this post. I know decent police officers who are men and who do a very difficult and thankless job. They are not all the same.

I didn't say they were. But the fact is that if you are a man who enjoys hitting women, then joining the police is a good career choice because you're much less likely to be investigated, be suspended, lose your job or be prosecuted than in most other jobs.

That's true, the statistics bear that out.

Sadly the title of the thread has overshadowed the entire point of it. It's turned me off to listening actually.

The cops investigating other cops for DV won't be known to them and will be on a specialist professional standards/anti-corruption team so they won't be investigating "one of their own" as you seem to imply, other than the fact they do the same profession

To be one of their own they surely don’t have to be friendly with each other. You’re surely going to have a connection and empathy for someone in your profession especially in jobs like the police.

Also people keep coming back and repeating not all policemen but we’re not talking about anecdotes. How do you explain the lower conviction rate for the police charged with DV compared to the general population? Are the police more likely to be married to liars?

Predators are attracted to organisations with weak safeguarding and you don't want to discuss that because you dont like the way its being talked about?

You are part of the problem.

I can just imagine your attitude when taking a witness statement.

Also this;
''Gardaí ignored thousands of 999 calls about domestic violence''
irishlegal.com/article/garda-ignored-thousands-of-999-calls-about-domestic-violence

@MaMaD1990

Sadly the title of the thread has overshadowed the entire point of it. It's turned me off to listening actually.

Well, the women who are being abused by their police officer partners probably don't get that option, do they?

Rushing to defend abusive men, in FWR no less, ffs.

@Wiltshire90

What would you like other officers to do about it? If I see something wrong, I report it. If I get allocated a DV case, I investigate it. If I don't see my male colleagues "abusing" their partners in their private lives then what action am I supposed to take? Can you see inside other peoples' houses and minds?

The cops investigating other cops for DV won't be known to them and will be on a specialist professional standards/anti-corruption team so they won't be investigating "one of their own" as you seem to imply, other than the fact they do the same profession.

The CPS do direct investigations and enquiries. Any evidence that is or isnt gathered is written on the evidence log and can be requested so you can see exactly why enquiries were or weren't pursued by the police.

These posts just aren't helpful. It stops genuine victims coming forward because they think the police won't be bothered. We are bothered. If we can't convict then it's not on you (and most of the time, not on us). Most DV happens behind closed doors between two people, the same with rape. That's why it's so hard to convict.

Have you actually read the report I linked to?

Here are a few extracts:
"The Met has admitted that the officers pursuing Grace for alleged harassment were based at Robert’s London police station." So, most likely known to Robert.

"officers who, at the very least, failed to live up to society’s expectations of how its police public servants should behave and a number of whom were alleged to have abused the power policing gave them to intimidate and silence their partners."

"The Bureau reported on force after force botching the investigation and found, in some cases, the police even appeared to become complicit in making the victim feel harassed."

This is not a few bad apples, it's a systematic failure of the institution to protect members of the public who make allegations against their employees.

Is it unhelpful for the investigation to have been carried out? Or should we just not give it any publicity?

Where I am any police officer IS investigated and very thoroughly for dv or any other offence. The title of this thread is inflammatory, you can see from the posts that the title has been taken different ways. Also abusers in general tend to gravitate towards positions of power, social work, clergy, medical profession to name but a few. Not just the police. You cannot class all male police officers in this way and no, Im not excusing domestic violence in any way.

@LouiseBelchersBunnyEars did you get up extra early today to practice being such an idiot? No wonder women are put off posting in here.

@whippitwoowoo

This is awful and so depressing but it’s not all policemen. I’ve been married to one for 22 years and I have never been disrespected in any way by him. He is horrified by abuse and understands the harm this behaviour causes.

Would he have no qualms about arresting his boss if he found out he’d beat up his wife?

Did you mean PoliceMEN? It's not completely irrational for people to be turned off by such a ridiculous title. If you're trying to 'fight the good fight' and inform as many people as possible, language is important - after all, that's discussed at length on this board too. Sad that the title has turned people off, which makes posting about it rather counter-intuative.

The CPS are also responsible for the low number of rape cases taken to court. I assume this is a 'risk averse' strategy and it's time for some sort of enquiry, or new way of working

I wonder how much of the failure to convict is the CPS thinking a serving Police officer makes a good defendant, experienced in court etc, so it isn’t worth their while prosecuting.

I work with the police and generally these days protocols have changed- as pp said there’s no longer external investigation, there are procedures for investigating an officer. In the year I’ve worked with them at least one officer has been sacked for DUI. If an officer has any call to their property the call is flagged immediately and the safeguarding and whatnot kick in.

Hopefully this means fewer officers can carry on with no consequence.

Generally if any of our cases fail to be prosecuted or convicted, it’s the CPS who make that decision.

No one is classifying all male police officers as abusers.

I have a close long term friend who is a male police officer. I am quite capable of considering issues within the police wrt investigating DV without thinking that the OP is accusing my good friend of being an abuser!

Investigating DV and getting to the point of a case being taken forward to court is a difficult process. It needs recognising and discussing, rather than people getting defensive or shrugging their shoulders and refusing to think about it because it's too difficult.

@Clymene

Asaph I see the Not My Nigel crew are out in force this morning

I did have a good chuckle at how rapidly the NAPALTing started for their own husbands, friends and family.

Given the tight knit nature of emergency services communities, I can well imagine how isolated the wives and partners feel when they finally attempt to escape and how hopeless it must seem.

The CPS were the ones who made the ultimate decision to discontinue the case, not the police.
The CPS decide based on the ‘evidence’ presented to them, by the police.
I worked in the police for 15 years and knew a number of officers who were violent, abusive and some who were paedophiles (and were convicted).
It is the kind of job that is a magnet for bullies and control freaks, as well as the many others who genuinely want to contribute to society.

Not My PC Nigel

"Would he have no qualms about arresting his boss if he found out he’d beat up his wife?"

This is the problem. "My" officer is junior. Her seniors are the colleagues and former colleagues of my abuser. After saying to me for a long time "we have the evidence we need" she suddenly started chasing me for more evidence (and is continuing to do so).
I see two possible explanations:

1. Sarah Everard's death leading to a policy change

2 Him turning on her (he turns on anyone who challenges him) and her now fighting for her career - and probably wishing she'd never been allocated to me :(

@Gothichouse40

I object to the inflammatory title of this post. I know decent police officers who are men and who do a very difficult and thankless job. They are not all the same.

No, they're not all the same. Just like not all men are rapists. But all rapists are men. The evidence shows that PoliceMEN have a higher incidence of being domestic abusers - and thats just the ones who’s partners are brave enough to come forward. This is not personal. It is not about your husband. Just like a thread about males who rape wouldn’t be personal or about my husband. It is factual though.

www.theguardian.com/society/2019/oct/20/domestic-abuse-within-police-force-to-be-investigated

www.theguardian.com/society/2019/oct/20/domestic-abuse-within-police-force-to-be-investigated

'Toxic culture of sexism' within the police.

some of the minimising language here is really patronising, it's like a bingo card on my life

"it's not helpful"
"sadly"

all these opinions written from lofty heights.....

What on earth is going on on this thread. Those statistics are fucking awful, surely you can all see that?!