Off sick and manager wants to have a catchup?

[Applerumbles]

I’ve been off sick from work with MH issues for well over a year.
My line manager has just emailed to ask tor a catchup call to see how I am and what they can do to support me.
I can’t face talking to him (or anyone really) so would it be ok to say that I’m not well enough for a call and that I am still getting medical treatment for my illness?
Im not sure he should be contacting me if I am off sick and providing fitnotes?

Sorry - ignore what I said then!

Definitely get the union involved - they have specialist in this area

OP, if you don’t engage with the process at all, your company will have no choice but to start the process towards terminating your employment.

i don't think it's unreasonable of your manager. What is the situation at work? are they able to hire someone to cover your work, or are your colleagues having to do it? I have worked in places where they would have to distribute the work because as long as someone is officially employed - including long-term sick - the headcount rules meant that nobody could be employed, and no temp cover.

That is quite an assumption. What makes you think I am not trying to sort out my health troubles?

Yes. Because that is what the insurance policy that the insurer was paid for does.

do you not understand income protection insurance?

I agree with u @FoxLoxInSox 👍

Rubbish !!!
You are clearly astoundingly ignorant of psychology / mental disorders !!!
active engagement in recovery models are crucial
just like with physical health
doing nothing - such as stating “I cannot communicate” is a blocking statement -
OP is communicating fine here …. When it suits !!!
look up treatment for mental illnesses-
it is highly unlikely any treatment path would include avoidance !!!!!

I am sorry to hear you are so unwell OP.

Two years ago I had a complete breakdown and started having suicidal ideation and I ended up under the care of the Crisis team for a month. I was off sick for over two months.

What I did was to keep my workplace informed by email of what was happening, what treatment I was getting and when I was a bit better I told them I could come back to work but the the GP was suggesting reasonable adjustments. I was referred to occupational health by HR and the OH assessment also recommended reasonable adjustments.

Frankly after a year it is perfectly normal that your manager wants a catch up and I am surprised that it has taken that long. It is part of most companies policy to keep in touch with staff who are on long term sickness.

if you are unable to come back to work then make that clear in your manager in the call and keep it short.

Speak to you union.

What do you want to happen long term? In the end I suggested a financial agreement to HR and I left my workplace because it was a toxic environment that was making my health issues worse. I am much happier now that I am out of the job.

What don’t you understand about income protection insurance?

policies can pay out for different lengths of time - in this case the OPs company have paid the insurer for a policy that pays out income until retirement of an employee becomes sick. It would have web more expensive because it pays out for that long.

its not that the OP doesn’t “intend” to go back to work - its whether she is medically able to. There is an ongoing medical assessment that evaluates this.

so again - how is it immoral if the OP is unable to work and therefore the insurer is required to pay the insurance cover it has been paid to provide?

I assume if you were sick and couldn’t continue to work you’d leave and rely on state support?

That’s not moral - frankly it would just mean you were too stupid to get income protection insurance. Which you can get individually and not through a company.

You asked what my question meant and I told you

So why not answer the question instead of being argumentative

Realistically you need to try other avenues of intervention and your employer might want to know what you plan to do in order to ensure there is a possibility of you returning to work at some point

You are engaging perfectly well on here so why not ask if you can start a conversation by email?

All you have to do is email back to your manager say “Hi, it is nice to hear from you. I’m sorry my illness has made it difficult to stay in contact but I do hope you and the team are all well. Would you mind giving me an outline of what we need to talk about during the catchup meeting? I am still unwell and I was hoping we could include Occupational Health or HR in our catchup so that we cover everything in one go - but it depends what you are hoping to discuss with me. Kind regards”

Your employer absolutely can dismiss you on the grounds of ill health unless your contract says otherwise. Do you know what your contract says?
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/work/dismissal/check-your-rights-if-youre-dismissed/if-your-employer-wants-to-dismiss-you-because-of-long-term-sickness/

A telephone call or face to face with a manager is a very different context for communication than posting on mumsnet

Exactly -
the “I can’t communicate I’m too mentally unwell” is not true
be honest
you don’t to talk to your manager because ???

You’ve had a lot of really weird responses on this thread OP.

I can only conclude that a lot of people genuinely don’t understand the point of insurance.

My only advice is purely practical - get someone - ideally a lawyer, if not then CAB - to check the terms of the insurance. Different policies look the same but work different ways. Our work policy is also “half pay to retirement” on the face of it, but if you don’t jump the right hoops the right way it can be stopped. Make sure you know where you stand.

Can you imagine that posting anonymously on mumsnet may be quite different to communicating directly with a manager?

@Applerumbles.
My husband was a lawyer when he developed a brain tumour and became unfit to work after a couple of years. He had an income protection insurance through his firm and they paid him 60% of his income tax free. He did resign from the partnership and the company(Canada life) took over paying him so it may be that this could happen to you. You will be taken off the company payroll and the insurance company will pay.
It may be that as 2 years are up that the company needs to see you under instruction from the insurance company to move the process forwards.
I can understand being mentally unwell makes it very difficult to engage as people do become avoidant because of the illness and you just get anxious and want to hide..
My husband had to have an annual review every year to ensure he wasn't fit for work which is fair enough.
The insurance we got helped us maintain our lifestyle and save for the future for our children who were teenagers when he died.

Obviously it would be lovely if you could get better but that may be a problem. I had a couple of patients who were fine for years then got debilitating mental illness and couldn't work again..I really felt for them.
One of my colleagues died in 2017 and another colleague went of sick with depression, tried to come back until she just couldn't as I was carrying her through her work and she then retired a few years early due to MH problems.

I think you should email your union if you have one and ask for support. It maybe that they need to refer you on to occupational health for further review as per the terms of the insurance policy.
Good luck and I hope you feel better.

If is, and is a lot more important!!!
so it would be be appropriate to put time and energy into communicating with manager as opposed to investing time and energy into avoiding the inevitable - she will need to communicate with her workplace -
she hasn’t said she is mute ? So needs to be honest about the actual problem is

probably anxious about having a difficult conversation
maybe exploring if she will ever return
if so, what could that look like ?
all legitimate questions that will need answering
if mute - can write answers down for advocate to verbalise

Also just because you have sickness benefit and it is not coming from their pocket it doesn’t mean they have to keep employing you indefinitely

https://www.davidsonmorris.com/dismissal-for-sickness/#elementor-toc__heading-anchor-4

If it was my business I would not see the point in keeping someone on who had not been able to find a solution to their illness after 18 months - I’d start thinking they lacked desire to get well. I’d be keen to see what they had done to improve themselves.

Thank you, that sounds very reasonable

There is a level of complexity where an employee is receiving income protection insurance - especially where the policy covers up to retirement age.

put simply (but it’s not that simple) the employer isn’t really giving employees the benefit of the policy it’s saying it is if it then terminates because of ill
health if it meant that the income protection is stopped (although there is case law on this which could be interpreted otherwise)

basically if there is medicla evidence that concludes op more likely wont be able to return to work then it’s a question of what the insurance policy says and depending on that what a settlement wojld
look like.

buts it’s complex and companies often fuck it up.

thats not the point
the point is she CAN communicate -
in some form or another - there is no point colluding with the assertion that she cannot
given some conversations are more difficult than others

If it was my business I would not see the point in keeping someone on who had not been able to find a solution to their illness after 18 months - I’d start thinking they lacked desire to get well. I’d be keen to see what they had done to improve themselves.

You don’t understand much about chronic / long-term conditions, do you?

Stop it, what do you want op to do. Define incurable, some mh illnesses have no cure just symptoms management.

Thank you, that’s very kind and helpful. I’m so sorry about your husband.