Off sick and manager wants to have a catchup?

[Applerumbles]

I’ve been off sick from work with MH issues for well over a year.
My line manager has just emailed to ask tor a catchup call to see how I am and what they can do to support me.
I can’t face talking to him (or anyone really) so would it be ok to say that I’m not well enough for a call and that I am still getting medical treatment for my illness?
Im not sure he should be contacting me if I am off sick and providing fitnotes?

The income protection pays whilst you are unable to return to work, potentially up to state retirement age or for a fixed period of time. It’s still subject to medical assessment regarding your fitness to return to work, with or without reasonable adjustments. You can’t just decide yourself that you’re all good to stay off indefinitely because they have insurance. Of course you must engage with the process.

No, I’ve been really ill and can’t seem to get better despite trying really hard. Would you be so dismissive if it was a physical illness?

I think the replies would be the same if it was a physical illness that had lasted for a year.

See4ms that way
The entitlement is incredible

So your condition is depression and anxiety?

I can’t really predict if I will be well enough to return to work.
Ive worked in this role for 20 years so that wasn’t me you are referring to.

You’re not the only person ever to have been seriously mentally unwell, in hospital, unable to function. That was me from June onwards.

However - in the midst of my delusions and suicidal thoughts I understood it way my duty to at least try to maintain a teensy bit of contact with my line manager. So she’d text me very sensitively every few weeks and we’d exchange a few supportive messages. My pay halved after 6 weeks. As a lone parent I HAD NO CHOICE but to go back to work, despite being in the Crisis House inpatient treatment.
Because I’ve been open with them and maintained a good relationship they’ve bent over backwards to arrange me a verrrrrry phased return - one which even in my bed-bound state I’m just about managing with. I have not had the luxury of decided I need to be off for a whole year despite the extreme nature of my psychiatric episode. I’m doing what I can, bits and bobs, some meetings from bed. And because I’ve worked so well with my managers and built up such good mutual respect they’re supportive of me doing as much or as little as I can, day by day.

Sometimes you just have to be a bit open, not stamp your foot and say “I’m ill so the usual HR sickness policies don’t apply to me.

If you aren’t able to deal with a phone call, tell them they will have to communicate with you in writing. Yes, they can dismiss you for sickness absence, even if it counts as a disability.

They may wish to get their Occupational Health people to assess you or see if there are any reasonable adjustments they could put in place that might support your return to work.

I would strongly recommend you engage with them rather than ignoring them or responding in an overly defensive manner.

Edited: I just saw your update. Given your length of service they may wish to discuss ill health retirement.

I would imagine that the chat is to ascertain if you are likely to ever return to work and that this has been suggested by HR
If they think not I assume they will be taking steps to terminate as they cannot keep a role filled by someone who is not able to return to work.

Other MH conditions and physical ones too (but work are not aware of those)

I’ve been really ill and can’t seem to get better despite trying really hard. Would you be so dismissive if it was a physical illness?

Yes, of course. My best friend has just had an op for cancer - her line manager has called her every week to see how she is.

Whether the illness is physical or mental, the employer should offer to make reasonable adjustments so that you can carry on in your job. These could range from special chairs, reduced hours, working from home, installing disabled toilets... all kinds of things.
If there are no reasonable adjustments your employer can make which would mean you could carry on working for them, and there is no sign of any recovery from you, then they can terminate your employment.

Well done you. 👏

You should be engaging with your manager, it's quite bad they've left it this long.

Could you ask for a different form of communication - email chat or teams call with camera off and use the chat function. The longer you leave this the bigger the mountain it’s going to seem to climb.

I’m a manager and our absence monitoring system regularly prompts us to make contact with individuals off sick for long periods of time. If you are not reasonably able to work for that long then why should they be expected to keep your job open? You’re taking well over a year if you are not feasibly any better than when you first went off sick. Occupational Health would be involved long before this length of time in my work too, are you public sector or private?

I don’t think it’s remotely unreasonable for your manager to have contacted you at this point. It is, however, highly unreasonable to expect to keep a job when you have been off for this long with no signs of improvement. You would be better resigning and then seeking a new job once you are better?

It isn’t costing the company anything as sick pay ended after six months but I am getting payments from the company income protection insurance. Im certainly not well enough to return to work at the moment

This is the same as my company - 6 months full pay then income protection payments after this, until retirement. I wonder if we work for the same employer op - it's a very large company and very generous package.

Have you checked the terms of these insurance payouts? At my company you can receive them until retirement age if you remain unwell BUT after two years your employment contract is officially terminated so you can't go back. Payments/updates are then provided through the third party insurer only. They stop if you return to employment elswhere.

I suspect that you're approaching the termination deadline op and/or they have important information to give you. It's simply not realistic of you to expect this situation to go on long-term with no changes or contact. Most insurance packages of this type have an employment-termination clause/deadline.

Are you paying for the insurance, often it's paid until you're back at work, retire of die whichever is the soonest so I'd check the policy. Are you signed unfit for work by your doctor and you send in fit notes regularly. I'd expect a catch up with my manager and oxcy health for longterm sickness, they won't employ you indefinitely. They will want to do a welfare check, see what help they can offer, ask if you want to return to work on a phased return, it's their responsibility to keep in contact and I don't see why you wouldn't want to speak with them.

I’m a cancer patient. Been off work since February. I have catch up meetings via teams with my Head teacher, every 3 weeks, for half an hour. I am due a stage 4 meeting with my Head and union rep. I’ve had an OH assessment too. I will probably have to go down the ill health retirement route.

You should absolutely engage with the process, as your employer has a duty of care towards you. Can you take IHR?

OP you are most definately costing the company. You are taking up admin resources, someone may well be having to cover your position, there is likely decreased output and you are taking offence that they want to know if you're in any position to return? That's a whole new level of entitlement.

Not a very kind response to someone who’s clearly been through it and wasn’t in a position to stay off work indefinitely.

I think you need to start thinking about things from a point of view other than your own.

Thank you for the kind response

I assume your comoany has a sickness/absence policy. These usually state what contact there is and what contact you are expected to make. It may include fitness to work/occupational health assements and meetings to discuss long term sickness.

The income protection insurance will also have their own terms. The company are paying for that and in fact the scheme my company has we still have to pay SSP as well. The insurance company may well ask for evidence/assesments as part of continuing to pay out. You would need to read the whole policy documents etc to know.

In my company our long term absence policy would first require an informal chat with a manager/HR followed up by a meeting to review the absence and see if there was anything that could be put in place to help you return to work. This may include gathering medical evidence. Depending on the outcome this could then lead to an absence disciplinary hearing/capability hearing.

I would have expected weekly communication during extended sick leave. If you are too unwell to hold the conversation, is there someone who can speak on your behalf? A partner? Union rep? Doctor?
You say it’s not costing your employer anything as insurance is now paying you, but you are still employed and are obliged to maintain contact with your employer. They, in turn, are obliged to maintain contact with their employee, they need to find out whether they can do anything further to help you back to work, for example. They need to know that you are seeking treatment for any illness.

You are getting a very hard time here. But it is normal to have catch-up calls, I was off for 8 months and had 1 every month at least.

Agree with @ShrimpyMcNeat
What communication have you had with them on the income protection insurance and the absence management process up until now, OP? Are you in a union, do you have any support navigating this?