My Intermittent Anger Explosive Disorder outbursts. How to get him understand that he need to remove himself.

[stayathomewife]

Sorry, English is my third language. Sorry what I wrote below might sound stranger to Westerners, but it not strange in my culture, and I'm sure I'm not the first rodeo in where I'm from China.

Long story short, I had a very dysfunctional and abuse childhood. Monkey see monkey do, I repeat everything I learn from my childhood, it like I want the history from my childhood to repeat itself. I was diagnosed with Intermittent Anger Explosive Disorder (IED). I was told it was stem from my abusive childhood living environment and learned behaviors, and genetics too, a brain disorder.

We are long term married, my husband whom with me for 14 years, he know all about my dysfunctional and abusive childhood, to my Intermittent Explosive Disorder (IED). He sees it all and knows it all. He said: He KNOWS everything, he UNDERSTAND everything, and he ACCEPT everything.

Perhaps it because he accepts everything about me, therefore he became an enabler?

When my Intermittent Explosive Disorder (IED).outburst flare up it doesn't last long, it small time frame. I went in rage from 0 to 100 back to 0 in a time span of about 4-5 minutes. But in that 4-5 minutes I caused damage to my husband which I feel very regret afterwards.

No, I no longer throw tantrums fits at him, I have learn to control my IED outburst episodes. It just I don't know how to get him to see that the way/his ways of deal with my outbursts is "enable" me. And enabling is not helping someone with IED like me.

I will give examples of my outbursts, and how he deal with my outbursts.
====== An example, during my IED outburst, I just grab a jar of ice tea on the dinner table, or I go to kitchen faucet and fill up a container or pitcher of tap water. And I told him I will throw it in his face just for the heck of throw tantrum.

He is so so patience, he said he will stand there, he won't move, and let me throw water at him as many times I want until I'm SATISFY. My hand was holding a pitcher that I fill it up with tap water in the kitchen sink.
omg,
He so serious and INTENSE, he grabbed my hand and he throw the pitcher of water in his face. Yep. he grabbed my hand and throw the pitcher of water in his own face, in his OWN FACE.

He said to me that he meant what he said, whenever I want to throw water at him, he'll do it himself he will throw it in face as many times until I'm SATISFY. He emphasize the word until I'm SATISFY.

My jaw drop, speechless, at the time I was still trying to process what just happened, he so intense.

===== Another example, during my episode, I slam everything that on the kitchen dinner table all down the hardwood floor, broken dinner plates, fruits, food, broken glass on the kitchen floor.
He not even mad,
he picked me up and carried me in his arms and put me on the living room sofa, he told me sit here wait for him and let him clean it all up, because he not want me to step on those broken glass.

He just quietly kneel down on his knee and pick up all the stuff I slam down (he skinny but very tall he 190cm so he had to kneel in order to pick all those stuff I slam down up).
He clean it all up, and he came calmly talk to me, he said I can slam it as many times as I want until I'm SATISFY, he emphasize the word until I'm satisfy, and he will clean it all up.

My jaw drop, I was speechless. It like he just so good at diffuse the situation, and deal with my tantrum. But then he enabler me.

===== Worst, during one of my episode, I grab Chinese DVDs and a book and throw in his face, the book hit his face and leave a cut where his eyebrow is, had it 3cm higher it would go straight to his eyes and would have damage his eyesight, he could have go blind in one eye.

Also a time, I slam the TV down the floor, and I yank out the power cord and I throw the power core in his face, it hit his forehead and his forehead bleed and bruise, it also leave a small scar on his forehead.

He always very calm and very patience with me, even in situations like that he still hugged me and said it okay, I cried as soon as I see how I physically hurt him, but he still hugged me told me it is okay.

No, I am 4'11" barely 149cm tall, him he almost 6'3" he 190cm tall, he not scare of me, when I asked him why he endure all this, he said because he loves me, and he said he he loves me very much.

No, I don't abuse him anymore, I have learn to control my IED outbursts. It just what I want is he remove himself from the IED outbursts of mine, he really not have to endure all this. I know he has his ways to deal with me, but his ways is not healthy for him, and I don't understand how to get him to know that is enable me, AND he needs to remove himself during my outbursts.

Is there away to get him to understand?

Honestly at the end of the day you're an abuser. You know you're hurting him.

The best thing you could do is leave him for both your sakes.

You don't have any children do you?

Well, it sounds like you're doing really well to have got your outbursts under control. Congratulations!

So this means you're no longer throwing things at your husband's head or smashing up your home? Why, then, do you want him to remove himself? It's your responsibility to keep him safe from your tantrums. You've said you have done this. So it's all good, yes?

WTF. Leave him. And get more therapy until you can stop hurting people.

Thankyou for your replied. I admit I am the abuser here, I paint myself as a bad person here, I didn't pretend to be a good person to get people to like me. I am an abuser so I admit I am an abuser.

Right, I have not abuse him anymore, and my IED episode has not flare up for years (with plural s), but it seem like I still get PTSD flashback from all the abuse I inflicted on him. Like I break down and shaking and cry, it like I went into panic attack and my anxiety kicks in really bad.

I just want to protect him from my outburst, last time my outburst flare up, I had to resort to handcuff myself. I myself bought handcuffs and gave him the key, I handcuff myself when my outbursts flare up, and I asked him do NOT remove my handcuff until my outburst episode over.

Well, he sort of listen, but then you know during my outbursts I just went into rage and I tried to break my wrists from the handcuff and it leave red marks, my husband see I struggle like this it hurts him so much, that he just remove the handcuff while I still in the middle of my outburst, and I end up hit him.

He said he rather get hit by me than see me struggle try to get the handcuff off and it leave marks on my wrists. He no longer use my handcuff method.

It been a long time since my outbursts, but I don't know, I just have this fear it might flare up again, I have been trying to control myself and my anger and my IED disorder.

I have told him to remove himself from my outburst, to even divorce me for me abuse him, he won't won't leave me or divorce me. I am at my wits end hence I ask here how to get him to understand he needs to remove himself during my outburst.

I keep having PTSD flashback of all of the time I abuse him. I am the abuser here, not the victim, I don't know if it possible for abuser to be traumatized by their abusive actions and have PTSD flashback, because I do have it.

I don't know what wrong with me, I have PTSD from abuse him, and I am the abuser.

Nobody on this forum is equipped to give advice on your complex situation and MH trauma.

the best advice is seek specialist therapy.

Thank you for your reply, @stayathomewife. Are you saying you want him to remove himself when you have flashbacks? Your PTSD sounds extremely distressing, but I'm not sure your husband leaving the house would change that. If I witnessed someone I love shaking and crying that much, I'd want to stay near them in case they got hurt.

It strikes me that, with your eagerness for your husband to go away when you used to attack him and now when you have flashbacks, you are trying to control him. You're also trying to make him responsible for your behaviour which, of course, is impossible. It would be a good idea to unpack this in therapy if you can.

I would tell him that he is not helping you, he is making you feel worse and not respecting the boundary you have requested.
I hope you are able to return to therapy. 💐

Why can't you be the one to walk away? It feels like, although you clearly appreciate many of the ways in which he tries to manage your behaviour, you are putting the onus on him, trying to claim that even his kindness makes him responsible, in a way, for things you should be taking responsibility for yourself.

Similarly, I'm struck by your repeated use of a label for your abusive behaviour, a capitalised formal diagnostic term. A diagnosis like that is simply a redescription of the behaviour, it doesn't offer any causality that suggests you are not as responsible as any other domestic abuser (many of whom have mental health problems). But I get the feeling that repeatedly framing your behaviour in terms of the label suggests that you feel it diminishes your responsibility for your actions.

Not helping. The OP realises she has a serious problem and is trying to address it.

We have no kids. Our child died at 1.5 years old du to brain disease that inherit from me the mom side, the doctors told us our child won't live pass 2 and he did die at age 1.5 years old. I still blame myself for it because I'm the baby mother and the baby inherit brain disease from the maternal side (me).

I understand that I need to control my IED which I did, it has not flare up for a long time. But my husband need to understand here that he is stupid for staying during my outbursts, he could have got hurt worser than a book throw at his face. He thinks he being the "man" for staying and enduring my outburst, sorry it not a solution.

I am sorry I have mental illness IED but I can still think, and there no amount of anyone call tell me that him staying and endure my outburst is a solution, sorry it not, and he needs to love himself more than sacrifice for me.

His problem is he too selfless of a husband, frankly I think he a love-idiot for staying with a wife like me.

You can't control your husband.

He chooses his actions. He chooses what to do.

If you have ptsd then treatment such as EMDR would be helpful. You need to see a psychiatrist or similar.

Are you the poster who posts about him caring for his mum and he washes your underwear and you're not allowed to work?
Just divorce.

@Kelly51

Yes I am the Chinese housewife poster who had a thread about my husband has been caring for his terminal illness mom, whom he pay for her Private Nursing home.
And yes, he does laundry and handwash my underwear.

And another problem of us is he refused my inheritance help, his manhood pride is too high, he said he will never use a penny of a woman's money. He rather carry the burden of his mom all on his shoulders.
He not want my help with his mom in any ways, I offer to use my inheritance to help pay for his mom Private Nursing home, but he shut me down every time.

But that is a separate problem. This post I am trying to get him to understand that him endure my IED outburst is not a solution, he thinks he a "man" can handle my outburst, well it not healthy for him, nor is a solution. And I don't know how to get him to see it.

His problem is he too selfless of a husband, frankly I think he a love-idiot for staying with a wife like me.

😂 That's for him to decide, isn't it? He's proved he loves you very much. One of the things an abusive childhood teaches us is that we are unlovable, or we don't deserve good treatment. This is a lie, but it takes a lot of work to stop believing it!

If you're interested in a stranger's opinion, I think that what he did was magnificent. He loved you in spite of your anger problem - and he TRUSTED YOU to get over it. You have stopped the outbursts, so you've shown him his faith in you was justified.

I disagree that he was stupid for taking your abuse. You're a lot smaller than him, and he knew it would be over in a few minutes. He made a judgement that you were unlikely to kill him or cause lasting injury (he was right, despite a couple of close calls) and wanted to be there so you would be safe. I don't understand why he focused on 'satisfying' your anger, but perhaps that's something from therapy or translates differently in Chinese. In any case, it helped, didn't it?

As the violent person at these times, YOU were the one who should have left the house. It's not reasonable to criticise him for not leaving you! You secretly hoped he would, I suspect, and you are still hoping he will leave you ... to prove to yourself that you aren't worth loving.

You are worth loving, though. Your husband proves it to you every day.

Thank you Mrs @Octavia64

It been years since my last IED outburst, I have not abuse him anymore, it just I keep get PTSD flashback from those time that I abuse him, it like when my mind rewind think of "how" I abuse him, I keep get PTSD flashback.

I think he trauma bond to me, and it not just from I abuse him, but from the death of our child too (the child of me and him together), that died of brain disease at age 1.5 years old, inherit the brain disease from the maternal mom side.

Is trauma bond a thing? It is right?

Just caught up with the last few replies. Do you love your husband, @stayathomewife? Do you want to divorce?

I think if you are now managing to control your temper and your husband has managed to live through that and still live and care for you, then you are very blessed and should move forward now without constantly thinking about the past. You have both lived through trauma, losing a child so young and there is no grief like that.
Try and move forward together and be thankful for his enduring love x

@Garlictest

You right Sir/Mrs Garlictest

His "unusual' ways and unusual response to my outburst actually work, I stop, as he interupted the cycle. In his expense though, 2 small scars on his face. But he forgive me time after time out of love me.

You right, I am self-sabotage, not only I sabotage myself, but I also sabotage my marriage. Happiness is just not the norm for me, I am more comfortable in my 'dysfunctional' norm.

I actually want him to divorce me, but I know he won't, and I don't want to divorce him because I love him too.

You right, when I told him I want him to remove myself, he said he understand and he know when to remove himself. He said he can take it so that was why he still there, he know how to remove himself when he can't take it anymore.

But he endure so much, I'm just so scare, if my IED flare up again, he might get hurt.

I even bought handcuff and give him the key, and I handcuff myself. But then during my anger episode, he see me struggle trying to get my wrists out from the handcuff and it leave red marks on my wrists, so he just un-cuff me, then yah. my rage and I slap him so hard that last time his lips bleed, I even punch him during my episold.

He should not remove my handcuff, but he does it I know out of love me.

I'm just at my wits end, I don't know how to get him to listen to me. I have already bought handcuff and handcuff my own hands, but then he unlock my handcuffs.

Have you sought treatment for PTSD?

Would it help to reframe the situation, that he helped contain your rage and pain, and not you both safe? I read what you described as being like a parent with a toddler who is having a meltdown.

I worked with children with episodes similar to yours, and felt the need to hold them safe and secure so powerfully, even as they were raging.

Are you happy, apart from this unresolved distress? Does your life look good to you? Do you want to be with him?
You don’t have to stay together out of guilt about the past.

I’m sorry for the loss of your baby, that is very hard.

I understand what you mean by “satisfy.” It sounds like your husband believes that you needed the anger to express itself, like steam coming out of a pot rather than staying inside.

If you fear the anger outbursts coming back, can you make a safe space in your house that is for you alone? Tell the husband that he needs to leave you to have quiet time and that you’re safe in your safe space. It could be a spare bed in the corner, a pile of cushions etc …

Sometimes people try to help a stressed person and it tips into enabling, as you say. Explain to him that you want to learn to self-soothe the anger away, and that venting the steam is not the only solution.

I wouldn’t try to psychoanalyse him too much if I were you. We can never get answers by ruminating about what someone is thinking. Talking to a therapist sounds like a better idea.

OK. I have to leave soon, so I'll have to say this more quickly than I would like.

How I understand your problems:

Your PTSD comes from replaying your abuse of your husband because your brain wants to prove you are awful. Your childhood made you believe you're unlovable. Your husband proves that you are loved by a good person. This is difficult for the brain that learned, early on, that you're bad. It keeps delivering these memories of bad behaviour to maintain the fiction that nobody good could love you.

The same applies to your insistence that your husband must leave you to harm yourself. It's also in the tragic way you blame yourself for your baby's illness - you didn't cause it, you didn't create your DNA! But, hey, what a powerful story for your brain to tell about how awful you are.

Please access self-compassion therapy - preferably with a psychologist, but there are good books and videos too - with the aim of soothing and healing your wounded inner child. I've done this work: it's heavy going at times, but it gets results. Also, I've got confidence in your husband's ability to help you with it if needed.

@Garlictest

Thank you Sir/Mrs Garlic test, I will contact my Chinese therapist again, the one that diagnosed me with IED, I stop going to her since I was able to control my IED and it been a long time since the last episode flare up. But seem like I still need to go back to therapy.

I know you say you have to leave, but whenever you have few minutes to spare, can you help me with this last thread of my husband: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/feeling_depressed/5170187-husband-tremendous-amount-of-grief-and-emotional-pain-complicated-grief

I also posted in the Mental Health section, I'm genuinely concern about him.

1. I agree that specialist couples therapy is the best way to go
2. your English is excellent. I am jealous of your linguistic skills (sorry, off topic I know!)
3. your husband may not respond to your episodes in a way that you find helpful at the time, but he sounds like a wonderful man who genuinely loves you, even though you have been abusive towards him in the past. That is something that is very rare and hard to find and I hope you fully appreciate him.

TBF I wouldn't waste time offering support here, this OP is very odd and has posted multiple times about the incredibly strange setup they have and won't change anything.