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14yr old Smears.

36 replies

LucyLiz22 · 03/11/2023 11:36

I’m a mum of 2. Son is 14 and daughter is 8 next week.
Without going into too much detail, my son smears. Not just a little bit, ALOT. His room is top to toe covered in smears, bed, carpet, walls, clothes, books, rugs, furniture, bags, toys, skirting, you name it, he’s wiped his faeces on it.
So when he was 2 I went through a huge battle with his biological. He was controlling and manipulative, lazy and aggressive. So I told him I wanted to end it. We had o my been together 2yrs. (My BC failed when my son was conceived). He didn’t like that and point blank refused to move out. Threatened to destroy my life if I left him, told me he would take our son, turn everyone against me, the works. But I was so beaten down, verbally and physically that I followed through with it. In the weeks that I told him I didn’t want ti be with him and him refusing to leave I had started talking to a man online (said man is still my man today, 12yrs later) and the ex hit the roof. When I went to work one day, I came home and the locks had been changed. (It was MY house). I called him, no answer, I called my family, my mum told me she was disgusted in me, that I had left, I was taking drugs, that I picked another man over my family, she wasn’t going to help me, I literally had nobody and I was locked out my own house. He shouted through the door that he warned me it would happen. He stopped me seeing my son. Told everyone that would listen I was a druggy and that I chose a man over my son, he threatened to harm the man I was then seeing, he told me I wasn’t seeing my boy, he started seeing someone himself who was the family hairdresser and she even told me that I was a disgrace of a mother. Everything I had and everyone who I loved thought I was this awful person. The only person who stuck by me and allowed me to stay with him and help me was the man I was seeing. This went on for about a year, I was denied access, my family hated me, no matter what I did, my ex came back with bigger and better threats. I couldn’t do a thing. And then on Nov17th 2012 I got a call from Social Services. They wanted me to collect my son from them and I was being handed FULL custody. My ex was found to have been Mentally, physically and emotionally abusing my son. His son. To say I was angry and heartbroken is a massive understatement. I didn’t have a proper place for him at the time, I worked every hour I could to save for legal help, but I ran to get him. And the sad thing was, my son called me by my first name, he had no idea that I was who I was because his dad had told him he didn’t have a mother. I blame myself to this day for everything that happened. I should of been stronger, I should of fought more, I don’t know how. But I should. So my family all started coming back in droves. I chose to not hold it against them, even though I do a bit to this day. Nobody ever apologised to me. They just all poured their hearts out to my son. Which yeah they failed him too. I got help from Social for him, I spoke to the doctors, I got him therapy. For literally YEARS! My lad spoke to a professional because the year of abuse he went through when he was younger really showed in his emotions and mental health. But from the age of about 6 to 13 he didn’t seem to be experiencing any problems. He hadn’t seen anyone since he was 11 and he’s not displayed any issues, but about 6 months ago he started smearing. I don’t mean a little bit either. Hug patched or faeces everywhere and in his pants. I’ve tried to ask him about it but for a long time he just said “I don’t know”. He wouldn’t say a think about it, he doesn’t clean it either. I was going in there weekly to and getting eye infections and getting sick I’m think from the germs. He had a gaming chair that he sat on everyday and it was thick brown and he didn’t care, he would fall asleep on it and rub himself all over it. Anyway, it’s taken a long time to get the Doctors to listen to me, for weeks they were telling me he was just constipated, giving him strong laxative which made him soil himself in his sleep. He would never tell me though. Just throw his pants away and act like nothing had happened. Anyway, one nurse finally did take it seriously and referred him URGENTLY to Young Minds. That was over 4 weeks ago and it’s gotten to much worse since then. His room is so so bad. So bad that it’s effecting my relationship, my partner had BAD OCD and him knowing he lived in a house with faeces everywhere is really playing with his mental stability. He’s said he is going to move out because he can’t live in the house with it. My son finally admitted that he puts his fingers up his bum, he does it about 20 times a day and wipes them everywhere. He doesn’t feel like it’s as serious as it is: his personal hygiene is diabolical. If I didn’t tell him, I don’t think he’d shower or brush his teeth ever. He constantly has faeces on him. I can’t go in his room now. I’m losing my ability to parent him because nothing I say goes in. He doesn’t understand that it’s bad. That he needs to wash, that he is destroying his carpet; room, possessions. He used to have an Xbox and he would happily soil himself and smear it when he was on it, so he didn’t have to leave to toilet, so that’s been taken from him. It’s been gone about 3 weeks now. I’ve told him he’s not getting it back until we’ve got him help. He knows that I’m trying to help him, we’ve both spoken to dr’s together, I’ve told him he needs to speak to a professional, but it doesn’t go in, if that makes sense. Talking to him is like talking to a wall and I don’t know what to do anymore: there’s nothing more that I can do besides wait for the help to come, but it’s not coming any time soon. He’s currently undergoing SEND evaluations but I’ve been told they can take up to 3yrs. I can’t deal with this for another 3yrs. I’m embarrassed to let anyone in my home, my relationship is breaking down with my partner, my son and their relationship. I don’t know how to communicate with my son anymore because he doesn’t think like I do. I don’t know what’s going on with him. I know it has to be trauma based, but when I speak to him about his past; he doesn’t remember. He’s been in the same room as his biological before (not purposely) and he’s had no idea who he was. So I thought that would mean he doesn’t remember the trauma. I just don’t know because he doesn’t talk to me: whenever I try all I get is “I don’t know”. If ever I push all it does is makes him cry. I don’t know what else to do. I dont know what I’m asking here. I think I’m just trying to feel less worthless and like I’m a bad mother. I’m trying to get him help, but help doesn’t happen fast. Feeling so low. Sorry for going on. Please don’t come for me. I feel bad enough as it is.

OP posts:
Kielyflower · 03/11/2023 16:19

I’m so very sorry to hear about the awful time you and your son have had and the resulting challenges you have now.

It sounds like you and he need professional support in real life.

Can you chase up the Young Minds referral or speak to the nurse?

Is school in the picture? They may be able to help with signposting or speeding up getting the help you need.

I’d also make an appointment for your son with your GP ASAP. And a separate appointment for yourself perhaps.

stayathomer · 03/11/2023 16:26

Dont be embarrassed, feel guilty, any of it, you know there’s a problem, you just need to start taking small steps. Bless your poor son and you. I know you probably love your partner but he needs to be a separate issue- he needs to understand your son has issues and try (somehow) to put them ahead of his. If he has to go then you have a child who needs you more. You all need to talk to people who can help and for today you need to sit down and just enjoy being with your son, whatever that involves, gaming, board game, family movie, a chat. Op huge hugs x

orangegato · 03/11/2023 16:38

Your whole family will become really ill from this, think of your daughter. She can never have friends home or be comfortable in her own house, that scars people forever you know.

He needs urgent, urgent help as it’s putting your daughter at risk. I wouldn’t stop phoning and phoning and documenting as someone needs to remove him from the home if necessary. It’s that serious.

AlwaysUnreasonablyFabulous · 03/11/2023 18:37

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Kielyflower · 03/11/2023 18:43

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Not a helpful post IMO. The OP’s son is a child who has been mentally, physically and emotionally abused by his own father.

OP, do contact your GP asap to get the help for your family that you all need.

Burnoutwhat · 03/11/2023 18:48

This was harto read without paragraphs a I'm dyslexic and it was long but it seems really hard for you so I persevered.

I worked in an adult learning disabilities service and there was a service user in another home who did this. So I think it's a thing if that makes sense.

Is he in school? Surely if so he get bullied because of the poo? What have the school said? Have you been back in touch with social services?

JustACountryMusicGirlInCowboyBoots · 03/11/2023 18:49

How awful for you all. If you can't go in his room anymore then who is cleaning up the smears? I'd push your GP and young minds and school fur help. I'm the meantime I'd be keeping his room with only the bare minimum in there so the rest can be cleaned and it can be kept clean. He is deeply traumatised to be doing this but he doesn't need to live in filth. It needs to be cleaned. Would he clean it himself if you told him to?

FusionChefGeoff · 03/11/2023 19:04

Oh wow this is such a lot for you to be dealing with. He's obviously been seriously damaged - I also wonder if the abuse may have been sexual at times.

Definitely keep pushing for help - is there any way you could afford private therapy for him?

Britneyfan · 03/11/2023 20:26

OP please ignore the couple of deeply unhelpful and judgemental posts on here.

By Young Minds do you mean part of CAMHS or the charity Young Minds? I’m a GP and I think the Young Minds charity is brilliant but I also think ultimately this is too severe/complex for them to help enough with. He should be referred to the mental health bit of CAMHS as well as their SEND bit. The waits for assessments for autism and ADHD are appalling and basically an absolute national scandal especially since the pandemic. If you can scrape up the money for a private assessment it would be well worth it. It does sound like part of the issue is possibly neurodiversity/SEND from what you’ve said especially about not brushing teeth etc.

I also still think chronic constipation could be part of it. It’s the most common reason for this behaviour in kids actually. I would ask for a referral to the children’s constipation nurse service.

Some of it may be trauma from the previous abuse of course but it’s a little odd to me that it’s just started 6 months ago and he was ok before when the abuse is quite a few years ago now. I would definitely be wondering if there is new abuse or severe bullying or something else upsetting happening somewhere and I think you should give him the opportunity to speak to the GP on his own if that hasn’t happened yet. Sometimes kids find it hard to tell you things as the parent.

This behaviour which is called encopresis is complex, and he probably doesn’t understand himself why he is doing it. Please know that he isn’t doing it to make your life harder (I think you do understand that from what you’ve said). I hope your partner and the sibling understand this too. He’s not fully in control of this behaviour, even though it seems deliberate. I’m not sure it’s ultimately helpful to essentially punish him by taking the X-box away. Being stricter isn’t the answer. It’s not going to solve the problem and it probably is going to cause resentment in your relationship. I understand setting boundaries with it from a practical point of view if he’s worse when he is on it though. But maybe try saying he can play but only for a set amount of time and he must go and sit on the loo to check if he need to go when you remind him to at intervals etc. or he can’t continue to play.

Pieceofpurplesky · 03/11/2023 23:04

Oh OP how hard for you all. Your DS needs help. He sounds as if he has PTSD and maybe puberty has brought back memories or thoughts.

Please get help from the doctors and even social services.

Schoolchoicesucks · 03/11/2023 23:24

If he's been "fine" from the age of 6 and this has come out of the blue then I would question whether there is something else going on, not necessarily related to that time as a young child. Or perhaps something that has happened now to have triggered it.

How does he manage at school? At 14 I can't imagine his peers would ignore this behaviour or the smell.

This isn't him being naughty. He needs specialist help through GP, CAHMS whoever will listen and take it seriously.

Does he recognise that it is unhealthy and unsanitary for you and his sister? Is he able to exercise any control or limits?

LucyLiz22 · 03/11/2023 23:46

Firstly Thankyou for the kind comments from people.
Sorry about the long and unstructured post. I just tend to write what is in my head with no thought and it’s come across really hard to read.
My son is in school, I’m getting him assessed by SEND, it all goes through the school and they’re terrible at keeping me updated. I’m constantly chasing and never getting anywhere. Same with CAHMS. (Yes he’s been referred to CAHMS, for the person that asked).
As for those that made some really awful remarks and even suggested my son be taken away, SHAME ON YOU! To read my post and your only opinion is “gross, he’s disgusting”, I sincerely hope you’re only on here to be a troll and not because you have children because i’d hate for a child to be raised by someone’s so judgmental and nasty.
My son cleans up his smears, I have to tell him too daily. His sister is the happiest, care free little girl who knows his brother isn’t well and always offers him help and support, she’s not affected by this at all. She’s never been sick, she’s never made awful comments and she loves her brother.
Tonight after just getting to another low in myself I say him down again and asked him why and it was just met with so many “I don’t knows” he doesn’t like doing it, he knows it’s not right, he wants help for it, he just can’t seem to express anything in regards to it. He doesn’t say anything bought it on. He doesn’t talk about anything else that’s upset him, in essence he is a very happy boy. He has everything he needs. We’ve all just come home from holiday, he’s got friends, he goes out. Just when he comes home and he’s in his room, this happens. He doesn’t do it at school, nobody out of this house and besides professionals know. He showers daily because I make him. I don’t live in a sh*t covered hovel with a child that smells of faeces, for you people that seem to think I do.
I’m going to call again this week and chase the referrals, I don’t have any expectations for SEND, I’ve been told that it’s next to impossible for a child to get that help. Which is just another failure for the people who need the diagnosis.
But like I said, Thankyou to those that replied in a kind and respectful manner.
Those if you that didn’t, I hope you step on Lego.

OP posts:
Lavender14 · 03/11/2023 23:55

Op that's so difficult. Could absolutely be trauma based, if he's not great verbally maybe something similar to play therapy or equine therapy might give him an outlet without needing to talk if he's not ready to. I'd also go through the gp, I know you've a lot in motion and I've just skimmed the thread but an assessment for asd as well as ptsd would be important. I'd also try to link him in with Youth services and youth groups in your area I'd particularly look at ones who are used to working with children who've experience of trauma like women's aid since your ex has used him to abuse you further. It sounds like he's been bottling everything up and now he can't hold it any more and to me it's the clearest sign he can make that he's no longer coping. He is probably right in what he says that he doesn't understand why he's doing it and at his age is probably very embarrassed and awkward in himself about it. Does he smear outside of the home or just at home? Sorry if I've missed it.

LucyLiz22 · 04/11/2023 00:00

He’s done it at his Nana’s on the underside of his mattress. He’s not done it at school as far as I’m aware.
I have everything in motion for help for him, it’s just a slow and long process and I’m having to fight people for the help. I’m trying to get him assessed for ASD/ADHD\Autism, but I’ve been told that it’s next to impossible to get that diagnosis, so I don’t know about that. I’ll continue to speak to the dr’s and school and allow him to speak to me if he needs too. But like I’ve said to him tonight, if he can’t explain to me or to a MgH professional why he’s doing this, I don’t know how to help him. It’s so frustrating.

OP posts:
Dani2206 · 04/11/2023 00:07

It could be a sensory thing and maybe you could try providing an alternative sensory need similar to what he is doing ...

specialkids.company/blogs/latest-news/44263747-specialkids-company-reveals-a-solution-to-poo-smearing
Also google alternatives for sensory
U could try contacting a support charity got suggestions

www.nhs.uk/conditions/autism/support/
Waiting times are 2 years plus and also if your DC turns 16 iv been told they are kicked off waiting list and have to start the process again.

Dani2206 · 04/11/2023 00:09

www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/behaviour/smearing/all-audiences
Also maybe fidget toys? Maybe see if when he feels like doing it or feels the need to do it etc to replace with a fidget toy/ stress ball/rolling bluetac etc

Britneyfan · 04/11/2023 00:35

@LucyLiz22 please don’t feel that if he can’t verbalise why he’s doing this, that a mental health professional won’t be able to help. They will be used to this and have their own ways of getting kids to open up or using context to work out what’s going on for him. Trust me, it’s really common for teens that I refer to CAMHS for mental health issues (including violent behaviour, school refusal, self harming etc) to shrug and say “I don’t know” when they’re asked about it or just not say much at all. I think partly that’s just teens generally! And partly I think they often don’t understand themselves why they’re doing what they’re doing.

Also I loved you saying to those unhelpful posters “I hope you step on Lego” 🤣

PabloandGustheGreySquirrels · 04/11/2023 01:15

Omg that is revolting. I'm deeply sorry for what your son was put through in the past, but this is horrific. It sounds very much like he genuinely needs in patient care in a sterile and most importantly, capable (professional care wise, I mean) environment. 24/7 carers on hand and psychologists. You can’t cope with this and it's not fair on your other child either.

PabloandGustheGreySquirrels · 04/11/2023 01:21

OP I'm not entirely sure why you're angry at some of the responses? You described a highly distressed boy sat in "thick brown" on his gaming chair and smearing faeces. Surely you can understand that this paints a picture of severe mental health issues. In patient care (even if just temporary) is a suggestion to help^^ not an insult??

LucyLiz22 · 04/11/2023 08:39

People telling me my son needs to be removed from the house and saying my daughter is suffering. No he doesn’t and no she isn’t. He needs medical help for a clear mental health issues. The poor lad doesn’t need uprooting from his home to boot. And my daughter is absolutely non the wiser.
Yes my description is awful, it’s an awful thing to have to live, for me and my son.
But if you read a post about a child being abused and then suffering servere MH issues as a result and your only response is “Gross” you have absolutely no tact or empathy and shouldn’t be responding.
That age old saying “if you haven’t got anything nice to say, don’t say anything at all”. Because at the end of the day; me, his mother has to read it and it broke my heart reading them. And I’m upset enough.

OP posts:
Pumpkintastic · 04/11/2023 09:00

Can you afford private counselling in the interim op? It will be about £35-40 a session but even just a few may massively help him while you are waiting and you can have a few and then go back ad-hoc as and when he really needs it.

Lavender14 · 04/11/2023 09:03

Most people with any sort of mental health condition do better in the community and in the stability of their own home and support network. Obviously there may be a few who need inpatient treatment until medication etc is under control but there's nothing to suggest that's needed here.

This is quite common behaviour for young people who have experience of trauma/adhd/asd so those saying he needs hospitalised are not giving appropriate responses.

Lavender14 · 04/11/2023 09:05

I was also going to suggest op, is it possible to go private? There are some health insurance schemes operating in the UK that might give you access to private healthcare? Which might speed along a diagnosis as the waiting times are very slow.

Callmemummynotmaaa · 04/11/2023 09:20

OP, I know he’s been referred to CAMHS but I’d go back to the GP and tell them it’s escalated. They may be able to prioritize the referral.

In terms of next steps: the GP above gave good advice. Unlike a lot of posters who say this behavior is “gross”, it’s also fairly common. Have you tried offering sensory alternatives??

Shaving Foam? Play dough or bread dough? Lotions with a strong smell (so essential oils?)

Conscious of your wee man’s age - but sneering could be a way of him trying to show that he’s not ok. It’s also something that (possibly) gives him control of his space. Rather than trying to push him for reasons/explanations (which can be shaming esp. as he may not know). Do you think you could gently talk to him about “listening to his actions”, name that you know he’s struggling and offer other spaces/areas he can gain control? (Taking his Xbox is kind of punishment for him not coping. If he’s cleaning up. I’d give it back! Unless you are worried about his contacts via it). Notice all the good things he does, that don’t relate to sneering! Ie. Managing in school. His relationship with his sister. That he’s trying to talk with you.

Basically: try take as much attention away from “it” as possible, and offer him as many alternatives as possible and reassurance. Must be scary for him too!

AlwaysUnreasonablyFabulous · 04/11/2023 09:28

LucyLiz22 · 04/11/2023 08:39

People telling me my son needs to be removed from the house and saying my daughter is suffering. No he doesn’t and no she isn’t. He needs medical help for a clear mental health issues. The poor lad doesn’t need uprooting from his home to boot. And my daughter is absolutely non the wiser.
Yes my description is awful, it’s an awful thing to have to live, for me and my son.
But if you read a post about a child being abused and then suffering servere MH issues as a result and your only response is “Gross” you have absolutely no tact or empathy and shouldn’t be responding.
That age old saying “if you haven’t got anything nice to say, don’t say anything at all”. Because at the end of the day; me, his mother has to read it and it broke my heart reading them. And I’m upset enough.

You may not like to read it but it's true. Your daughter is suffering, she's living in a house where one room is literally full of shite. This will stay with her. I'm sorry your son was abused but you are allowing the cycle of abuse to continue by making your daughter live in such a disgusting environment. As hard as it is, if you had the option to choose inpatient care for your son you'd be doing the best by both of them.