I can't cope with life

[BertieBotts]

I don't know how to do the things that normal people do. It's a struggle to remember to look after myself, let alone do normal things like housework.

How can I function as a human when I can't think ahead enough to wash my hair regularly?

I'm so afraid that everyone who loves, supports or cares for me will find out soon enough that I'm letting them all down and then they will disappear and I will have nobody. I'm so afraid that my son will grow up to be lazy and disrespectful because I am lazy and don't respect myself.

I'm spiraling now, so hoping that writing this will help. If I disappear it's because I've reached the point where I can sleep rather than overthinking all night.

Ok, first thought.

She is clearly setting you TOO MUCH to do. This is too much stuff in one go for the state you're in. It just is. Have you ever seen on the housekeeping threads where people recommend the Flylady programme (it's an American name, I've no idea what it signifies). It's for chaotic households, and she builds up your tasks every day, and the first one, the one you do for (I think) a whole week, is keep your sink clean. That's all. Just the sink. Not the sink AND the bathroom AND hoovering the sitting room every day, because who wants to suddenly form habits in all those things at once? It's biting off too much.

If she isn't responding to your distress by reducing the amount of stuff to something you have a hope of actually achieving then she isn't being helpful.

Second thought, ONE of those things would potentially be fine if (and it's a big if) you were actually on board with it, felt you could get on with it, and understood how to do it. She needs to work with you on it.

And the trouble is, items 2 and 3 actually conflict with things you value - you value being able to lie in, and you value being on the internet. Ok, I'm totally with her that eventually those things will probably dissipate as you learn to be more flexible and decisive about the pattern your day takes. But STARTING with these things is crazy. The whole point about the first habit-forming step is it needs to be easy. It needs to be a habit you can actually get slightly excited about achieving. It can't be something you don't bloody want to do, that's insane. I love that you didn't come off the computer because you didn't want to. That sounds just like me. However depressed I am, I never quite lose my stubbornness when people suggest damn fool ideas to me. It's a quality I cherish in myself for that reason.

Is there an inviting habit of some kind, that you can think of?

On item 1: so the paper format clearly doesn't work for you - would the phone work for you? Does your note app allow you to, say, put in the headings of the columns she wants you to write under, so you're sort of doing it her way?

Just another more general thought, would it help if she wrote down the instructions for these tasks? Or emailed them to you? It would only take her two minutes. Weirdly I find I pay a lot more attention to bits of paper that have been written on by other people.

Right, basically, what Eurostar said in much less words.

I'm going to bed shortly but I'll be back in the morning.

I have one idea though. Do you think you could set yourself a goal of changing one light bulb PER DAY until they're all done? Obviously, this would first involve checking what wattages they need (one day's task) and then buying them (the next day's task) and if you're like me trailing all the way back to B&Q because you got it wrong for the next day's task . What do you think?

Children generally feel more safe where there is consistency of course but the odd lapse of eating something after toothbrushing won't confuse him for life and won't give him tooth decay :-)

Sometimes difficulty with doing stuff etc can be because you grew up in a house that was that way and simply haven't learnt other ways of being, other times because you are depressed, other times because your brain is wired that way (there's a great book about adult ADD for instance called, "you mean I'm not lazy, crazy or stupid?!), things like low confidence, fear of failure can be behind some of it or just being damn bored by all that day to day domestic and personal stuff...or maybe something else.

Whatever is going on for you, it sounds like you are distressed and that you care and that you are getting insight by seeing patterns. Maybe you will change a lot, maybe only a little, there are people who have done great things for the world with unwashed hair and dusty houses. Self-acceptance and self-compassion are what I'd encourage you to try and find.

Sleep well :-)

One more thing, I suspect your DP is trying to be helpful in a slightly misguided way. I think a lot of norms non-depressed people are bought into the positive psychology stuff to the point where they think it's a disaster if you're thinking negatively and rear wildly back from you, which is absolutely NOT what you need. You're going to need to be your own best friend here.

Actually, really? Grousing on about being a failure at this or that does not, in itself, cause the sky to fall in. Actually you and life goes on exactly as before. Nothing is jinxed, or made better or worse, by the fact that you've had a moan. This is something I got from my own DP. In fact all the people who've ever said really, truly helpful things to me, none have been counsellors...

Anyway, off now. Night night x

An email could work. I don't think she is technical, though.

I know about the baby steps thing, but I find it hard because it seems that a baby step for me is oh so tiny that it's utterly pointless, I spend all my energy focusing on that and everything else gets left behind and life isn't really like that, and so then instead of celebrating whatever I have achieved I just panic and beat myself up about everything else going wrong without noticing that this is just a continuation of the status quo and I haven't quite got there with that step yet.

Those three examples were set on three separate weeks :) Not all on one day. But still. I thought the paper/table thing was a good idea but I just found that when I was in a negative thought spiral I didn't feel like writing in a little table, so I didn't. I have no self discipline for doing things I don't want to! I have started writing a negative thoughts diary, so when I get in my spiral (usually late at night) I sit up, write down everything that's in my head even if it's jumbled, and then somehow it's gone and I can fall asleep. (And I have a record for counselling.) I tried to do that tonight but DP is here so I didn't want to turn the light on and I know when I go up to that dark bedroom all the thoughts will start circling again, so I need to be properly tired.

Night MadBusLady and thank you :)

DP has been helpful for the most part whenever we've talked about this and generally encouraging and reassuring and great, I think he's just running out of stuff to say, he's been saying the same things for two years and nothing has changed with me

My mum is huge with the positive thinking thing. She is encouraging too but again I think has run out of ammo with which to help. This doesn't help my fear that I'm a totally useless person and generally unsolveable problem!

a baby step for me is oh so tiny that it's utterly pointless

But it isn't tiny for you, is it. It's huge. Having a shower at 7am every day is a huge, difficult thing for you. Otherwise, you'd be able to do it easily, wouldn't you. That is the reality you're faced with. And it IS an achievement to manage it, even a couple of times. There's no point in trying to judge what you do against other people's reality (including your unhelpful counsellor's). This is yours, the one your genes and environment have handed you. Your choice is between taking (what is to others) a tiny baby step, and taking no steps at all.

I have no self discipline for doing things I don't want to!

Me neither, even on a good day. That's why counsellors are supposed to set you stuff that you are actually happy to try to achieve.

By the way, you realise you are actually writing the negative thoughts diary now?

Paper doesn't work for me generally, by the way, and DP just doesn't understand it at all any more. I live in hope that sooner or later everyone else will join us in the 21st century.

REALLY off to bed now! Hope you can manage to sleep a bit (or if not, continue writing the negative thought diary, here or offline?)

That's true, this thread is a kind of diary in itself.

If I had lightbulbs in the house then I'd change them all at once It's the remembering to buy and the fact that a trip to anywhere which sells lightbulbs seems like climbing mount everest I need to get some connectors to plumb in a dishwasher, too, so I could get both at once it's just timing it.

Hi bertie :)

Isn't madbuslady nice? :)

Is this a stupid question? Why don't you have a shower at night? If you don't like mornings why is getting up in the morning and having a shower the best plan? If you do it at night (or have a nice tiring bath with all lavender-y things in it?) we could nag you to do it you could work up to it a bit more?

Good morning dear Bertie

I know what it's like to feel I can't cope or that the simplest thing is too much.

I'm lucky I haven't had to cope with serious long lasting depression for a long time now. Is there any one thing that you would particularly like to be able to do? Is your hair bothering you or is it just wanting it to look decent in public?

Really glad some good people came along

BTW amazon sell lightbulbs apparently...

Morning :)

I want to get my hair cut because I feel it takes forever to wash/dry when it's long which is adding to my feeling of "It's too hard". I was skint for a while so my mum was going to organise this but hasn't yet.

Feeling even worse now :( When I went to bed last night I was feeling all positive and like things would get better and then I suddenly thought of a conversation I'd had with DP (he's working abroad but is home for a week, first time he's been back so a bit weird) and I got really angry/upset and then was still pissed off this morning so when I got up with DS and then DS was being whiny and annoying and DP shouted/said his name so I shouted from the other room "Either get up or stop shouting at him" and now he's just come down asking me to come up and talk to him once DS is at nursery which I was planning to do anyway, except now I feel like I'm about to be told off

Morning Bertie.

And thanks Nagoo, what a lovely thing to say.

Sorry about your argument this morning. He's not really going to tell you off, is he? What was the original conversation about that bothered you? Will you be able to talk to him calmly, nicely etc about why you were upset?

No, he's not a controlling arse, I just felt all defensive.

The conversation was that he felt like I was using him as free childcare as soon as he got here and going off to work, which is true, but I can't exactly help when I have to work (okay, I could have booked more days off, but originally he wasn't going to when I stayed with him, and I didn't think about it and they were short staffed). AND although DS isn't biologically his he says he sees him as a son and has been encouraging him to call him Daddy which is what I'm now angry and upset about as it seems he doesn't want to act like a Dad so why is he bothering? It's way too early in the morning for me to be eloquent so I will cry at him etc but I don't care. He either acts like this relationship is serious and he's a dad or he can act like it's casual but don't fucking build up my son's hopes and then disappear

On the hair thing. Well that's interesting, isn't it. So turns out you have already formulated a solution to the problem of your hair being difficult and offputting to take care of, and it was to ask for help from your mum, who undertook to help you.

And she hasn't done her bit yet.

So, in this particular case, your mum (who I'm sure is absolutely lovely, doing her best for you etc) is actually the one "at fault" if you can call it that.

Not you!

And yet you come on here and beat yourself up about not wanting to wash your hair. When you have a strategy, you've asked for help, and you're waiting to receive it.

Disclaimer: obviously I don't mean she's really "at fault". Perhaps it's not even been very long since she agreed to help you. I just mean the ball's in her court right now, she's the one with an obligation to fulfil. This is the thing - most people really don't expect themselves to be perfect in fulfilling their obligations all the time. Whereas you (and I) do. I bet your mum hasn't woken up this morning paralysed with guilt and worry that she hasn't booked your haircut yet and it makes her a bad mum and you'll hate her etc etc.

I don't think you have to be eloquent. If you're not thinking it all through clearly right now, could you say that and ask if you can talk later instead?

I don't have DCs so maybe I just don't understand the pressures, but honestly, that sounds like a normal couple's squabble about childcare arrangements to me. It's clearly connected on in your mind to a separate underlying worry about his overall commitment - and I sort of see your point that there is a contradiction in what your DP is saying.

I just suspect (could be totally wrong) that if you were to (calmly etc) apologise about not having thought ahead with booking days off, and point out the contradiction re: your son and childcare to him (without couching it in terms of "If you're going to leave, sod off now!" obviously), he'd probably be a bit sheepish and see your point.

Unless of course there are other ways in which he doesn't act like the relationship is serious. I'm assuming he is (a) a reasonable person and (b) doesn't have kids himself?

It's just that if I were to suddenly become a stepmum, even with the very best of intentions, I'd be bloody terrible at it at first. I literally have never thought through all the obligations and implications of a dependent. Maybe he hasn't really put it all together yet.

It's just been hard doing it long distance, and he mentioned last night that it would be easy to slip back to a casual relationship which is apparently (?) supposed to take the pressure off me, but actually just makes me feel shit because I didn't feel any "pressure" anyway. (I have a feeling we've been through this before).

I know it's not about "casual" in a sexual sense but ugh. Anyway I need to talk to him.

Oh argh. Yes, it sounds like he's being well-intentioned with the "taking the pressure off". I imagine he hasn't got yet that "the fog" and all the problems that flow from it have nothing to do with him.

It's bigger than that :( we just broke up. I'm gutted. I have to go to work though at 12 so trying to hold it together and then a friend of mine is coming over later so i'm not on my own.

Kind of knew it was coming but not now... this is not helpful to my general state of mind :(

Oh god Bertie, I'm just trying to catch up.

have a

It might just be a fight chicken.

I can relate to how you feel Bertie - I find it hard to be organised, my house is a mess, I forget quite a lot of stuff, I don't have systems for things, don't always open post or respond to phone calls, I find it hard to know where to start so procrastinate a lot ...

what's behind all of that ?

well, basically I think I either have a long-standing mild depression or aspects of attention deficit disorder.

Have you thought about whether you might have ADD ? (It's possible to have it without the hyperactivity element - so ADD instead of ADHD ? - ADD more common in girls and women than ADHD ?) Have you always felt like this - that your mind is in more of a fog than other people's ... that you find it hard to focus and concentrate, and get easily distracted ? Perhaps something to consider ? Even if it just helps you understand and accept your individual differences more ?

Basically, whatever is behind how you feel and behave, I feel it's best to give yourself a break, be kind to yourself as you would be to a friend. Personally I think few people are truly lazy in that stereotypical way - I reckon there's usually a lot going on behind the scenes, behind the superficial appearance of things that some people might be judgy about. But remember, not everyone is judgey ... in my experience all the nicest people that I'd want to be friends with anyway, aren't

I've also had experience of at least two counselors who didn't get it - didn't understand or truly accept that the stuff I was finding hard, was stuff I'd actually find it hard to do ! Them asking me to do it wasn't really enough of a help !! eg. I said I felt bad as my DS was still sharing with his sister as we hadn't tidied up the spare room to be a bedroom for him. I really felt overwhelmed by that task, but counselor gave me hardly any strategies for getting started. In the end DH sorted the room for DS which was a reasonable solution for us since DH doesn't have so many issues regarding tidying and sorting stuff. But anyway, I found counselor over-ambitious and really not very understanding or helpful. I think she should have set me easier tasks and then I could have experienced some sense of accomplishment. Build up gradually is surely the approach to take. I think many counselors don't start at a low enough rung on the ladder from my experience. I had another counselor who seemed really shocked when I told her my DC's weren't brushing their teeth every night.
Sure, it would be good if they did. I understood that - that's why I mentioned it ! But I needed some help with strategies, motivation, organisation etc. that was why I was there ! I think a little tick sheet could have been a good idea for me - not just lots of talk round and round in circles !

Good luck Bertie, I hope things start to look up soon. Please be kind to yourself. One step at a time hey ?

I don't think it's a fight, it's been a long time coming, I'm just sad. I think we'll stay friends and support each other but I don't think we would have been right long term. I suppose we might get back together at some point, but I'm not going to hold out for it.

Oh ((( hugs Bertie )))

X-post with yours as my essay took a while to write x

Have a cuppa with me Bertie ? I've just put the kettle on