diagnosed with pnd 2 weeks ago, please talk sense to me

[poppypops]

Hi, my little boy is 6 weeks old. I was diagnosed with pnd 2 weeks. My main problem is anxiety especially around sleeping. I went for a few days with little or no sleep and got myself into such a state and had a complete meltdown. Fast forward 2 weeks and I have been on sertraline 50mg for the past 16 days and have been taking 3.75mg of zopliclone to help me sleep.

Started to feel a small improvement with my anxiety and low mood in the past 3 days so last night decided to take half dose of sleeping tablet. I woke up at 2 after little sleep and low and behold have been awake since. My little boy sleeps well so it's not him which is worse as I could rationalise that.

Basically, I have got myself into such a state today thinking this is it I will never be able to sleep again. Worried that I will end up back as I was 2 weeks ago and that is a horrible and scary thought. Having had a few goodish days the fall down is so horrible.

Please talk sense to me. Can anyone tell me a positive recovery story with sertraline. Once they are in my system a bit more should there be an improvement with my sleep or ability to fall back to sleep. I am desperately seeking reassurance that life will improve. I know 2 weeks is such a short time but it has felt like a lifetime getting here.

Hi poppy 9-2 is brilliant with no zopiclone! You should be really pleased, I think the sertraline is definitely starting to work for you.

I had the first night of natural sleep (with no zopiclone) in about 3 weeks last night. Slept 10 - 4 which I am really chuffed with.

This thread actually really helped me last night. I was feeling anxious but after reading it I really felt that I am not going mad, other people have experienced this and I am not a freak. I was starting to feel crazy, as all the health professionals keep saying "oh when you're tired you'll sleep".... errr, that has not been my experience! I felt calmer after reading this thread, so thank you.

I read some of my book in the evening to distract me. Then I used the Paul McKenna CD when I was in bed. In helped me relax, but when it got to the end and I was still awake I felt the anxiety starting to rise. But then I told myself to just enjoy relaxing and not worry about sleeping, and then I just nodded off.

I think my AD is starting to work too as I don't feel as anxious at all. I do feel really heavy today though and slow. Not back to normal but on the way hopefully

Morning. Poppypops thats amazing that you slept from 9pm - 2am and then dozed without taking the sleeping tablets. Try not to focus too much on being tired today. Thats more than enough sleep for you to function today fine. I know how horrible and all consuming it is at the moment but very soon it will all be a distant memory. The Sertaline will definately start to help and stop you being anxious and will also help you feel happy and positive. I slept for 9 hours last night which is the place that you will be in before the summer starts. Just be strong and hold onto the fact that you will be better very soon. Its such a hard thing to go through but you should be proud of yourself. When I felt anxious I just kept focussed on the fact that my life would get back to normal and it got me through the tough times. Thinking of you x

GetDown that is brilliant. Well done!!!! I am really pleased for you. I had a bad night on Thurs night, anxious because DH is away and my mind was racing with various thoughts for some reason and songs that wouldn't shut up, but slept better last night even though DS3 woke up at 5.30am shouting I WANT A BIG HUGGLE MUMMY! Over and over again. Very cute in hindsight but at that time I wasn't in the mood for a 'huggle' really!

Wonderful news Getdown. That is a step in the right direction. Fingers crossed for a good night for us both tonight. It is nice to have you for company, although, we both would rather be happy and well. We will be soon.

Alicia26, your posts are so so positive, thank you. I feel like I will get there reading them. Feeling ok so far today, trying not to think about the tiredness as suggested. Did you try any alternative therapies to help get you through the first few weeks? Had an appointment booked with a reflexologist this morning but she cancelled at the last minute. She wasn't comfortable to see me without having had my 8 week check with the GP. She wasn't clear on why. Really disappointed. It was giving me something to work towards if that makes sense.

Pleased you had a good nights sleep Becky. Your little boy sounds sweet.

Not that I am biased at all but DS3 is lovely :)

You will be happy and well again. It'll come.

Sorry your reflexology was cancelled. It does help to have something to work towards I think.

Hi there, sorry I didn't reply yesterday. Hubby went to a school reunion and I was entertaining my 5 month old and 2 step daughters :) all still asleep - joy! I didn't have any alternative therapy but as becky says its good to have something to focus on as a mental placebo. I had my appt with the psyc as at that time I thought that would cure everything. I remember just getting through each day focussing on the fact that I would be seeing him in just a weeks time for my first apt. The sertaline will work on its own but I believe that anything you can do to either give you a focus or to look after yourself during this time would be a real help anyway. Acupuncture is supposed to be helpful for 'real insomniacs' ie those not suffering short term because of depression. Exercise is brill even though you may not feel like doing it. These are all things that will help you until the ads start working but even if you don't do any of these and just wait for the ads to start working you will be fine. Stay strong. Not long now xxx

Morning, happy mothers day. Hope everyone has a nice day. Dd Awake since 5 as she was so excited about giving me my surprises and having breakfast in bed. 5am wake up has resulted in a very tired 4 year old who is bouncing off the walls after eating most of the chocolate she bought for me!

Took half zopiclone last night so slept ok. Plan not to take any tonight. Had bad anxiety zooming around all afternoon yesterday so wanted to know I would get some rest. Not ideal but hate feeling so anxious and the thought of no sleep was pushing me over the edge. Hope this anxiety settles soon.

How was your night Getdown? X

Hi poppy I tried with no zopiclone last night but was still awake at midnight (despite going to bed at 9:30 feeling very sleepy ) so in the end I took a quarter of a 7.5 tablet and then fell straight to sleep and slept till 7. I think I actually fell asleep naturally before the zopiclone started working, but I had felt the anxiety rising as I lay there and just wanted to put a stop to it. Sigh. I hate having to take the zopiclone. Just wish I could go back to a normal sleeping pattern. But I guess we will get there, just have to be patient with ourselves.

The house is such a state, as I basically haven't been able to do anything for the best part of a month now. I started to feel really anxious and frustrated today looking at all the mess and not knowing where to start. My DH was really good he said let's just spend an hour tidying and stop there. I feel a lot better just having done a little bit of tidying.

That's so sweet about your DD. My DD (also 4) made me a card and picked some flowers from our garden and put them in a vase for me this morning.

GetDown a quarter of a tablet is hardly anything! I think you did well to sleep 'almost' naturally and sleep so well. You are doing great!!! DH and I both had a funny night. My DH never, ever, ever cannot sleep but he was awake at 2am and I even found him downstairs drinking milk. The weird thing was I started to worry about him and I couldn't get back to sleep until I knew he was asleep.

Hope you are all having a good mother's day. GetDown that is so sweet of your DD to pick you some flowers. Lovely. I was given a few presents and we went to the tip, the Range and then B&Q this morning (woohoo) and MacDonald's for lunch (double woohoo). But it's all good fun really.

Thanks becky. Sorry your DH didn't sleep too well. I bet he is not worried about it though! My DH is the same, he normally sleeps anywhere, anytime. He just doesn't worry about it at all. It's pretty unusual for him to have disturbed sleep, even during really stressful periods at work.

I am having a bit of a wobble Just thought "what if I don't sleep tonight?" and am now getting a bit anxious again Arrgghh it's so frustrating. I know these thoughts then make it even more likely to happen. It's such a vicious circle. But how to stop these thoughts? Wish I could just not worry about it. I just have this fear of staying awake all night, not getting a wink (which does happen) and then just having a terrible day the next day where I do not cope.

Sorry for going on about it. It helps to pour it all out on here, I think DH must be sick of me going on about it.

GetDown what if you don't sleep tonight? What are the chances of you having no sleep at all? How many nights recently have you had zero sleep? Not many, is it? So the chances are, even if you do get anxious, you will get some sleep. And if you do have a really bad night, the following night you can take a zopiclone if you are end up being really anxious. It's not a big deal.

Thanks I know you're right but I just can't help it. I feel so lonely in the night when I can't sleep and it seems to stretch on forever. And I wind myself up into more and more of a panic. I hate it.

And I've kind of made a "rule" that I can only take a zopiclone after two consecutive bad nights... because the anxiety about taking them is nearly as bad as the anxiety about not sleeping I get into such a state.

Just have to hope that the ADs are starting to work (I do believe that they are) and that the original cause for the insomnia is being treated. Just have to deal with the psychological aftermath now.

GetDown I know how lonely it is when you can't sleep. It is a horrible place to be. I know. But the only way not to go there again is to not dwell on being there, not think about how lonely it is and not dread being there. It's so hard I know. You have to just say to yourself 'so what if I can't sleep?' I know it is sooo easy to say that and so hard to actually convince yourself of it.

Getdown it sounds to me like you've turned the corner towards recovery - not there yet, but going the right way.

And if you can get a good night sleep with a small piece of a tablet well fine. For ages 1/8th of a tablet of mirtazapine helped you sleep...

madmouse you are so right, I used to find even an 1/8 of a mirtazapine tablet would do the trick for me. I think this post-natal thing though... it just sends my body into anxiety over-drive, and nothing seems to work. The dose of quetiapine I am on, and the 30mg of mirtazapine would send any "normal" person to sleep for a week! The psychiatrist was really surprised that I didn't sleep the first night when she'd given me quetiapine. But I know I can sleep and just have to hold on to that fact, and that things will get back to normal. I feel a bit gutted that I am back on two different meds, after all that effort to get off everything, but maybe I'll get off it all again in a while, just have to concentrate on getting well again first.

Thanks becky for understanding, I know you know what it's like to feel lonely and scared by the nights. I am just trying to tell myself that my bed is a safe place where I can just have a bit of "me time" and not think about sleep right now.

sorry poppy for hyjacking

I just wanted to post re sertraline. My PND was diagnosed late on, and I didn't have obvious sleep issues (although between DD2 and mumsnet mobile i was awake a lot!) but I've been taking sertraline for two months and they've really helped. I had anger and anxiety. Now I'm calmer, happier, more able to deal with toddler tantrums, baby wailing and the chaos at home! Like a PP said, I'm happier than before having DD2. A lot of things, even going for a run, seem to be easier now a layer of anxiety has been taken away. I too had a dry mouth for a couple of weeks and the occasional headache but no side effects since.

I hope you sleep well tonight. X

Don't be silly getdown, we are in this together. You are doing so well. I know that the nights are long and lonely but it is short term. That's what we have been told and we must believe it. I also hate the lead up to bed time, I start planning my attack early on. The will I take the zopiclone or not debate plays over and over in my mind. Its not healthy and I am trying hard not to do it. I suppose that's what the sertraline in time will address, the anxiety? Same for the medication you are on. PND sucks big time.

When I am having really anxious moments I find myself looking at my lovely little boy and thinking 'I really do love you so much and even though I wish this wasn't happening I would still have had you even if knew in advance that I would be feeling like this'. It would scare me more facing this challenge if I resented him or didn't feel such love for him.

I am finding everyones posts so reassuring especially alicia posts, they are so encouraging and at the moment that is what is keeping me focused......sorry alicia, no pressure! :)

Hope you have a good night Getdown. Thank you for joining me on this thread. Feels nice not to be on my own x

Thanks for your message msbossy. The more positive sertraline stories I hear the better. I am so desperate for this tablet to be the one that helps me. Can't face the thought that another 2 weeks down the line I will have to try a different tablet or god forbid nothing works!

Pleased you are feeling a lot better now.

Hello.
I had really bad insomminia post ds, and stupidly never went to the doctor, but looking back I was a basket case.
It's good that you are tackling this,and not pretending everything is OK, like I did. I did get zopiclone at one point (although never told the doc about the PND because I thought they would take ds away if they knew how nuts I was-see I had become so bad I was totally irrational).
Anyway, I felt I couldn't take it, as I was a single parent, and was too anxious about being drugged.
So, I tried some other things, with advice from a hypnotist, which helped actually:

Firstly, make sure you are eating plenty of slow acting carbs. Lay off sugar, as this will often cause you to wake too often in the night, or too early in the morning.

When you are in bed make tiny circles on the sheets with your thumb.
Say to yourself that you have to keep doing this, no matter how tired you get.
It's amazing how focusing on one small physical movement can take the focus off whether you are sleeping or not. You will find that you are struggling to keep doing the tiny circles, and when you can't keep going, you will fall asleep.

Also, practice relaxation exercises in bed. Feel every part of your body become heavy and still, from your head, going down your whole body.
Mentally focus on each part of your body, and don't rush.
Often it is the tenseness of our limbs and muscles which keeps our bodies from relaxing fully into sleep.

Tell yourself that you don't have to sleep-the body being relaxed and your eyes being closed will produce the same hormones that you get from sleep, and help you to feel refreshed.
Take the pressure off, and just enjoy the feeling of being relaxed.

Sorry-flippin essay here, but I know how bad it can be, and I just wanted to share some of the things which helped me. I sleep pretty good now!

Hi getdown and poppypops. Hope last night was ok for you both and you had a nice Mothers Day. I have been reading the posts and thinking about the best thing to say to get you through this time. A couple of things might help..... When you are in this place I found that everything caused anxiety -worrying about taking sleeping pills, worrying about not sleeping, reading on the internet and thinking that I would get all the worst side effects from the ADs, that Sertaline wouldnt work for me and that I would need to try lots of different meds, that I wouldnt be able to go back to work, that I would become really ill because of lack of sleep, that I would never be able to sleep again, that my relationship would fall apart etc - basically I catastrophised about everything. You need to remember that this is all part of PND and is NOT real and none of the bad things that you are worrying about will happen once the ADs start to work properly and that wont be long now. All the anxiety and worry will go. I did a test to see if I could make myself anxious this morning and simply cant do it. The ADs have switched that part of my brain off. The other thing is please dont worry if the techniques that are listed dont help you. I remember buying so much to try and help me sleep like CDs, books etc and lying awake listening to Paul Mckenna on a loop for ages and thinking even this wont help me - there is no hope. It wont be until the anxiety goes away that you will be able to sleep properly so dont beat yourselves up or get anxious if these things dont work - often they made me worse cause I just lay there focussed on them the whole time and it made me think about not sleeping which made the anxiety worse. Becky is absolutley right - you are not going to become ill through lack of sleep and the only consequence is that you feel awful the next day and soon this will be a distant memory. The only thing that really worked for me during this time was that I got it into my head that it didnt matter, it was only short term and I would be better soon. This allowed me to turn going to bed into a nightmare into actually thinking I am looking forward to going to bed because even if I dont sleep I can relax and rest. I just let my mind drift and read my book. So please try to control the anxiety yourselves until it is controlled for you. I promise promise that this will all be a distant memory really soon so hold onto that fact and be proud of yourselves that you are coping with something so awful xxxxx

alicia you have hit the nail on the head when you say about the illness making you anxious about everything and catastrophise everything. That is exactly how I have been. It's like the illness latches on to any little thing that could make you anxious and it becomes a massive deal. I was convinced I would get addicted to zopiclone. Also my DH has had to take a lot of time off work to take me to appointments etc. and I was catastrophising about him getting in trouble or losing his job. We have a holiday booked in April and I kept thinking how we would have to cancel it, and how it would all be my fault.

I am actually feeling a lot better today. It's two weeks today since I started the higher dose of my AD and I do feel like I am finally getting there. The anxiety is hardly there at all this morning. I slept without zopiclone last night from 10:30 till 4 and then dozed until 7. Everything seems calmer and somehow brighter this morning. I am definitely feeling more myself.

poppy how was your night? Hope you are feeling ok today.

nowthenwreck I am so sorry you didn't feel able to seek help for the PND. I am in awe of you how you could survive this being a single parent. I have barely been able to do anything for the past 3 weeks, the insomnia and anxiety have been so bad. I can hardly imagine how hard it must have been for you. Well done for getting through it. Thanks for the tips, and I'm really pleased to hear you sleep well now that is really positive.

Catastrophizing! That's something I was very, very good at. My lovely CBT councellor was often quite amused by the extent of my catastrophizing. It's funny how someone else pointing out the ridiculousness of your thoughts makes you see things in a slightly different perspective. One exercise he did with me was to write down one side of a piece of paper what I thought would happen if I didn't sleep and on the other, what did happen. Needless to say the first column was huge.

Thanks GetDown I think it was a bit like ' Nam, looking back.
Best words of advice for anyone suffering similar stuff is always "this too shall pass", and it really does.
Good luck OPx

Just wondering how you are getting on poppypops? How are you feeling?

I had a not great night (awake till 1am ish, then awake again at 6) but feel fine today. The anxiety is hardly there. I hardly thought about sleep at all yesterday.

However I am at my appetite Just went to the supermarket, and found myself craving food so badly, I bought a packet of mini sausage rolls and ate the lot! I would never normally do this. I stupidly read the packet afterwards and realised I just ate 800 calories . Feel really appalled at myself. Even as I was eating them I felt awful but just couldn't stop myself! I know it's a side effect of mirtazapine and quetiapine, so am going to have to be really careful.