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If you had PND with the first, did you have it with the second?

67 replies

jabberwocky · 29/09/2005 11:44

Still doing my research for a possible second pregnancy. Had a long talk/row with dh yesterday. He is still so traumatised by the PND I had with ds I don't know that he'll ever agree to a second child. I did suggest that he get involved with a study I saw on the birth trauma association website and he is actually doing it! So, maybe something will come from that.

Any stories good or bad would be greatly appreciated.

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jabberwocky · 03/10/2005 18:13

Oh, and also, I have always felt that mine was triggered mostly by ds's traumatic birth but my mother did have depression at some point after I was born, although at that time they didn't call it PND I don't think. For years she just said she had mono. As it turns out she was hospitalized with psychosomatic paralysis of her legs! She says much of it was caused by living next door to her parents/mother at the time and we subsequently moved. But, I do wonder if it was not in actuality PND.

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ghosty · 03/10/2005 19:43

Hmmm ...
My mother had a 'nervous breakdown' when I was 3 weeks old ... they all put it on the fact that she had 4 children under 5 AND an infirm father to look after. Apparently my grandfather bit my mother when she was feeding him and she lost it ... ran out of the house, my dad had to chase her down the road and she had to be sedated.

When I was first diagnosed my mother was horrified ... she said things like, "No one told you it would be a walk in the park", "In my day we just got on with it" and "Do you realise you will have this on your records forever? That you have a mental illness? The stigma stays with you forever"

It was only later that she admitted (not to me, but to my dad) that she remembered the feelings of hopelessness and that perhaps she had had PND.

She still says now though that "They didn't have it my day ... you just had to get on with it whatever you were feeling"

jabberwocky · 03/10/2005 19:52

Interesting, isn't it ghosty? I can remember her telling me once how the psychiatrist would come into her hospital room to talk to her and she would just glare at him and refuse to speak. The way she related the story it was almost as if she were proud of that. She has always been very supportive of me going on meds but seems to think counselling is a waste of time and money.

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ghosty · 03/10/2005 21:34

That is definitely a generational thing though isn't it jabbawocky. My parents still believe that drugs are the answer for everything and anything 'alternative' is hocus pocus.
My parents both take handfulls of prescription drugs from the doctor (painkillers, blood pressure pills etc) and don't actually see that lifestyle changes (healthier food, more exercise, less alcohol) and alternative health options (acupuncture, homeopathy, vitamins) might actually make them healthier and reduce the need for all their drugs IYSWIM? I am not saying that drugs aren't necessary but I personally think that you can do more to improve your situation (whatever it is) than just relying on them.
My doctor was prepared for me to be on ADs indefinitely ... it was me that went to him and said I wanted and needed something to make me better and make sense of it all rather than exist day to day relying on the ADs to get me through.

jabberwocky · 04/10/2005 10:19

How long were you on ADs then? I've been on them about 20 months. I'm really nervous about getting off, but would like to at some point. Early on, I tried weaning myself off a couple of times with poor results. I'm hoping this new round of therapy will help.

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Fangache · 04/10/2005 10:21

Jabberwocky - I may have mentioned this before so forgive me for being repetative! But my GP recommended the homeopathic remedy Sepia instead of AD's. She said its also useful for helping people wean off AD's when they are ready.

jabberwocky · 04/10/2005 10:27

Oh, I don't believe you mentioned that. I will definitely look into it.

ghosty and allboysclub, I am going to CAT you re: our dh's getting in touch. I don't know if dh will follow up on it or not, but we had another big discussion last night with the end result of me in a flood of tears over everything and him saying he needed a vacation (alone ) because the strain of the last two years had been so much.

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jabberwocky · 04/10/2005 10:32

allboysclub, have tried to CAT you but the message said your profile didn't accept them. I wonder if you could CAT me and I could forward dh's email address to you?

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allboysclub · 04/10/2005 11:08

Um...not sure what CAT'ing is, but I will tey and figure it out. will get back to you soon.

jabberwocky · 04/10/2005 11:09

It is Contact Another Talker. Go to your profile page and you should be able to enable it.

Thanks!

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Fangache · 04/10/2005 11:09

AllBoysClub - Contact Another Talker. Hit the link at the top on the page.

allboysclub · 04/10/2005 11:17

Yep, found it, thanks. I have been too good at the acronyms. Jabberwocky, you should be getting a message through from me shortly, so it said.

jabberwocky · 04/10/2005 11:26

Thanks so much. Will forward to dh and keep my fingers crossed. After last night, not sure what to expect

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ghosty · 04/10/2005 20:18

Jabbawocky ... got your CAT
DH is away tonight and tomorrow but I will talk to him and get him to send an email to your DH over the weekend.
He isn't the greatest talker in the world but he really does sympathise with other blokes whose partners have/had PND ...
He says that I was abducted by aliens for a couple of years but I did come back eventually, a little scarred but almost as good as the original ... I reckon I am much better than the original personally
In answer to your earlier qu. I went on ADs when DS was 8 weeks ... had an early diagnoses as I was such a wreck and couldn't even pretend to 'cope'. Started to wean off them at 14 months and was off them completely by the time DS was 20 months. It was scary to finish the last pill ... I kept waiting to do something silly but I didn't and I was fine.
The healing process was I began to get a few good days in between the bad days. Then I had more good days than bad days. Then I would maybe get a bad day a week. Eventually, but I didn't realise until I was off them completely, I realised that I had not had a bad day for a month or so ... and then by the time DS was 2 I had not had a bad day for about 3 months.

PrettyCandles · 04/10/2005 20:50

My HV used to say to me "You don't have to be a perfect mother, just a good enough mum" but I couldn't see it. Not until I came out the other side of PND and compared my mothering of dd with how I had been with ds at the same age. You always want to feel that you have done your best for your child, but when things were at their worst, I would feed, clean and clothe ds, put him somewhere safe - eg playpen or cot - and go to bed and cry. If he needed me I would go to him, feed or clean or give him a toy or whatever, then go back to bed to cry some more. And so the day went on. Then, at about 4pm I would get washed and dressed to try and deceive dh that I was OK and we had had a 'normal' day. Hardly good mothering. And utterly different to what our days were like when dd was tiny.

Yes, I too felt very guilty over my apparent lack of mothering of ds. But you know what? He is a healthy, intelligent, resourceful boy. He is fine. And what I realised was that I had to forgive myself for my behaviour. You cannot live the past all the time, you have to take what you can learn from the past, and approach everything with fresh hope and an expectation of the best.

In dd's first year or so, while I didn't have PND I was certainly exhausted and perpetually at the end of my tether, and I was forever losing it with ds and shrieking at him. Again, I thought I would never forgive myself, when, later, I saw that he was scared of me, and didn't really trust himself or me. This time, I realised that it wouldn't be enough just to forgive myself, I had to repare the damage.

I went back to something I had learnt in counselling during PND - concentrating on what I wanted to happen, rather than what I didn't want, and finding the steps to take to get it to happen. I also read a lot of parenting books to try and find better strategies for dealing with the situations that made me lose my rag. Thirdly, I dedicated time to ds alone. I organised ds and dd's nursery days so that one mornign a week he was alone with me, and those mornings were never used for housekeeping stuff.

It worked so well! Our relationship blossomed. Ds learned again to trust me, and to feel comfortable with me. His self-confidence grew, as did his general happiness. And his behaviour with his sister improved as well.

And I finally forgave myself for my bad behaviour with ds when he started Reception 3 wks ago and settled in immediately - happy, confident, proud of himself, making friends easily - all the things I worried that he wouldn't succeed at.

I think you need to give yourselves credit for being good mothers despite having PND, and forgive yourselves for having had it. After all, you wouldn't feel guilty for having had a broken leg and therefore having been unable to dance with your children - you might feel bad about it for a while, but eventually you'd rationalise it and it wouldn't bother you. PND is just like that - only much much bigger.

jabberwocky · 05/10/2005 02:39

What an absolutely lovely post, prettycandles. Thank you so much! I had my first session with my new therapist today. It went really well. I had realized recently that I have been grieving over my lost time with ds and we are going to focus on that first. Who knows? This time next year things may be completely different.

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Fangache · 05/10/2005 08:50

Fab news Jabberwocky! Absolutely right, there is no point beating yourself up about the fact you have been ill for a while. But you're making a difference now!! And that is very very important.

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