The 5:2 Thread Number 24 - Summer's still here so skip the snack and share the meal!

[BetsyBell]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like, or approximately your TDEE (see explanation below). Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

ADF = Alternate-day Fasting, as it says on the tin, fasting every other day rather than 5:2.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check them out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- you'll find a lot of support here.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

All our previous threads can be found by browsing through our very own fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

bibbety if it's 5:2 then you need to consume no more than 500 cals in a 24 hour period. So eg:
Fast Day: lunch 250 cals & dinner 250 cals
or
Fast Day: no breakfast, no lunch then a 500 cal dinner
Non-fast day: as normal.

vieenrose - Wow Well done getting to your target weight fantastic!

crazy8 - I started in January I was 10st 3lbs, if not a bit more, and it has taken along time but I'm now down to 9st 6lb. It can get really disheartening when others have big losses but slow and steady is how some of us seem to go. I have found that my biggest losses have been on weeks when I am super busy at the allotment. It does get easier.

Well done everyone! I can't keep up with you all in these threads but hope you are all having a good summer.

So could I not just eat a proper meal at 7pm instead of 6 on that day, that way I have fasted 24 hours 6pm - 6pm. This is the part that is confusing me, other wise it's more like a 36+ hour fast isn't it??

Dotty
I'll have to do some serious unearthing for a before photo and I'm not sure I'll be able to do it before going off on my holidays. I avoided cameras like the plague! But I'll do my best in September

Dotty
I'll have to do some serious digging before I can unearth a before photo and I'm not sure I'll be able to do it before going off on my holidays. I avoided cameras like the plague! But I'll do my best in September

bibbety it is 500 cals for a calendar day so yes it ends up being 34-36 hours. You can do 24 hours if you like but your calorie deficit over a week will not be the same so you won't lose as much weight.

Meant to say well done vieenrose and maccapakka ( on a side note I have a guinnea pig called maccapakka - you are not small cute and furry are you?)

Thanks French fancy, wishful thinking on my part then!

From what I've read HiiT (interval training) goes very well with this WOL. Anyone got any advice, suggestions for a complete beginner? Think Jillian would probably be too hard for me :(

tomorrowweeat Jillian does an easy option for all her stuff - I posted up a youtube link to Shred upthread, there's no reason why you couldn't do it! Have a look and see (or just search for Jillian Shred on youtube and look at part 1).

vieenrose Just realised I didn't congratulate you on your wonderful achievement! Fabulous stuff! Have a great holiday and don't panic about over doing it - you know what to do :)

melodyangel those who have bigger losses had more to lose... you can't be far off target?

I might have to sneak in a fast day tomorrow, or at least 16:8. Today's been a bit excessive

In my defence I've been trying to clear out the fridge before we go on holiday... (I know, I know)

Well done vieenrose I remember that moment well - it's fab!

crazy8 I started at a similar point, aimed to lose about 16lbs at first. I logged ALL my food, tried to eat my calories and not drink them, and exercised regularly. I started in Feb and have now lost 26lbs altogether. It doesn't have to be slow if you feel like there's less to lose, but it takes more effort, I suspect, in terms of logging and checking up on yourself.

because of another thread I've just put bits of the last couple of days into MFP : I very rarely calorie count nowadays but I think I've set my profile so anybody can have a look - for those trying to get heads around low calorie life with wine

tomorrow I can't be sure as I've not done it, just seen clips, but Shred isn't HIIT per se. HIIT alternates 30-60 secs of flat out, maximum heart rate action with 30-60 secs of rest/easy action and alternates for around 10-15 minutes with 5 min warm up and cool down either end. The high intensity segments are anaerobic and you feel like your heart may burst out of your ribcage or may (sorry) vomit.

I'm a HIIT beginner (only been doing it a few months) and go to the gym so I use the treadmill to do my 20 mins HIIT session average 2 times a week (I do steady state cardio and weight training other days). 2 times a week is all I can manage often cause the session wipes me out and my legs especially ache.

Running is my thing so I alterate bursts of sprinting (superfast so I feel I might fall off the front of the treadmill!) with walking/gentle jogging. My steady state running speed has improved by doing HIIT running.

But you don't need access to a gym to do HIIT. You can use a skipping rope, or run on the spot, or do bodyweight exercises, or run outside. You just need to remember the 30-60 sec rest or easy / intense intervals.

tomorrow forgot to add... if you don't think your fitness levels are very good I'd start with lower intensity interval training or just normal steady state cardio to begin with. I did several months of "normal" exercise before I felt ready for HIIT - I started out with 30 mins powerwalking, then hill walking, then added in a few weight training sessions as I got fitter.

Bssh would you mind telling me what settings you do on the treadmill for your hiit? I've been alternating between 8mph and 4mph each min for 35 mins, but not sure if that's exactly hiit??

berri sure. My treadmill is in km per hour so you'll have to translate but they're pretty close to your speeds (I'm still new to HIIT):
Rest intervals 6 to 6.5 kph (so like your 4 mph)
HI intervals 13.5 kph (so around 8.5 mph)

I think if you're doing these speeds too and you can do it for 35 mins, you need to increase your HI interval speed! HIIT should wear you out after 15-20 mins. Perhaps you coud aim for 9-10 mph intensive?

Hi Everyone.

Time to de lurk. I've been doing 4:3 since the end of May. I lost 12lbs in 6 weeks in preparation for a three week visit to the UK to visit the folks, (I live in New Zealand). I managed to fast about 5 times over my holiday and a couple of fasts became 16:8 with a take away blowout in the evening! I got back last Friday, thrilled to find that I have not gained at all, despite all of the pasties and Ben & Jerry's ice cream. I am 5'7.5" and today weigh 9st 11.5 lbs. This is the lightest I have been since i got married in 2002. I don't know what my target is but as long as I am looking lean and not lanky I will continue this WOE. I am doing 5:2 now as I am happy to just see where I end up. I have thoroughly enjoyed following all of your progress, thank you for all of your inspirational posts

Hi all

I can't keep up! Did a fast on Sunday and another today. Sunday's was hard, today for the first time I just didn't eat all day even after a workout, and I feel fine although I was a bit woozy early evening. TOM arrived today so will see how things look on a couple of days. Welcome to all the newbies and congrats on all the impressive results, hope to join you before too long.

French- thank you! I'm definitely not small, I am a bit furry as I can never be arsed to shave and I'm more annoying than cute . I'm trying to imagine an 89kg Guinea Pig

Hello, I'm a newbie too - been lurking for a little while and did my first fast today. Slightly shocked to discover that it wasn't too bad! I skipped breakfast on the basis that if I had it, dinner time would feel like a lifetime away. Then thoroughly intended to have soup at mid-day but actually, by the time I got home with DS2 from the library and Sainsburys (killer, won't be doing that again on an FD) it was 3pm! The hunger isn't constant, it seems to come in waves... although I was reading DS a book about chips in the library and nearly licked the page.

Dinner was AMAZING though, I chucked tomato puree, mushrooms, courgettes, tomatoes, garlic, yellow pepper, chilli and soft goats cheese on a tortilla (I actually got a pair of scissors out and cut a bit off so it weighed 50g!) and stuck it in the oven for 12 mins...it was glorious. Hungry again now though! Total cals for the day have come in at about 420, should I eat that extra 80 cals or does it not really matter?

I've got about a stone to lose, I should have weighed and measured myself before I began but just sort of launched myself into the whole thing last night (been stalling for a couple of weeks.) Now I need to go back and work out my TDEE - snacking and grazing (particularly in the evenings when I work at my computer) are my downfall! How do you manage not to snack at night time? Also need to focus on building more exercise into my day. Sigh...there's no easy fix is there? Also I have a family event in 6 weeks...hoping against hope I'll have dropped half a stone by then.

Fingers crossed that posting here will inspire me to keep going!

MumofKiwi - Welcome ! And well done.
thalia - go for it ... they get easier

All prepped for tomorrows FD - very good for the org skills this woe!
In Awe reading of the HIIT on the treadmill bssh & berri. I did the slowest jog ever on mine this evening, but needed to get back into it one way or another. But was well happy and might go again in the morning if the energys there. Suffering dreadful from foot cramps over the last 24 hours, up half the night with it and hopping on/off the couch all night with them, driving me mental

Welcome to all the newcomers - some great stories since I last posted!

Skink my downfall was always finishing off whatever was leftover on the stove in the evening - but now I've instituted a No Evening Snacking rule, which seems to work.

Been doing it for about 6 weeks and I've only succumbed once (curried lentils and cabbage it was - my absolute favourite).

Once you've finished your evening meal - with pud if you wish - you declare the kitchen CLOSED! And that's it.

One more thing - bear in mind that a snack or nibble at any time of the day will not satisfy your hunger, it will strengthen it. So the answer is - don't have that first nibble!

Do all that and you'll lose that half a stone. Honest!

Welcome all newcomers :)

UnrequitedSkink I used to consume more than a meal's worth of calories from snacks alone, even whilst still losing weight. What a waste of calories when I could simply have bigger portions of my infinitely yummier main meals. That realisation was my main wake up call regarding snacking and grazing. What really helps me not snack and graze is simply make it a rule. No snacking between meals at all, all week (except weekends and special days eg birthdays). Just like 5:2 is a rule for me - Mondays, Thursdays no eating more than 500 cals in one sitting. It's all about self-discipline for me.

Well done vieenrose and postmanpatscat. You have given me food for thought today .
I was very down hearted this morning. Especially after really struggling with fasting yesterday. Am swapping my fast day from Wednesday to Thursday this week as have been invited to a friends for lunch tmrw. Am planning to cut out snacks. I really need to train my body not to graze throughout the day. Hopefully I'll have time for a walk/run tmrw.
Today I did a 30 min walk/run. I can't do gyms so instead have devised a workout using the hills near my house. I walk up a very steep hill and then run as fast as I can down another hill. It's probably not quite HIIT but hopefully it will make a small difference. It's better than not doing anything I suppose.