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Fasting / 5:2 diet

5:2 Diet Thread! Number sweet 16!

999 replies

GreenEggsAndNichts · 22/03/2013 20:05

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like, or approximately your TDEE (see explanation below). Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

ADF = Alternate-day Fasting, as it says on the tin, fasting every other day rather than 5:2.

Michael Mosley has recently unveiled a new website to accompany his new book on the subject. Please go check them out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- you'll find a lot of support here.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
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LaurieFairyCake · 23/03/2013 19:19

You might not lose much but why would you gain? You're only talking about adding in 2000 extra calories (roughly) a week with that extra eating. That will still mean a loss for you (and yes, it might be that your TDEE is off because of the breast feeding)

If you want to lose a pound a week then you need to lose (roughly) 3500 calories a week if you're using MFP.

Why is it stressful? Confused - you've not much weight to lose, it's clearly working weight wise if you're losing 4 pound a week - you just need to tweak it to be more emotionally satisfied and to lose less weight.

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LaurieFairyCake · 23/03/2013 19:24

I think in general everyone is trying to tweak it to work for them.

I'm finding my TDEE isn't enough this week - in fact I'm finding the eating days increasingly hard (and the fast days stupidly easy).

What I'm putting that down to is that according to the research people typically eat 15% more on non-fast days than usual - in sticking to my TDEE I'm not eating that 15% and even though my TDEE is high I'm less satiated.

So this week I've over eaten on my TDEE a couple of days while still (just) bringing my weekly calories in 3300 under - not quite that magic pound weight loss probably but still doable for me.

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BlackMaryJanes · 23/03/2013 19:30

Because a few weeks ago you weren't losing anything at all on 1800 cals on non-fast days.

If I stick to 1800 I lose 4lbs without fail. If I eat what I like on non-fast days (as per media suggestion) I lose nothing.

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BsshBossh · 23/03/2013 19:41

VP I agree and it's why I never respond anymore Wink.

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LaurieFairyCake · 23/03/2013 19:43

Then you've already learned that 5 days a week you can't 'eat what you like'.

But maybe YOU can eat what you like one or two days a week and still lose weight - instead of 4 pounds you might lose one or two.

I also can't eat what I like at the moment. It's fucking cold, I've not managed to get out in the garden, I've become very sedentary in the last couple of weeks.

All of those negatives are going to stop me eating what I like. Maybe in summer with lovely fresh salads and fresh veg it will be easier for me but frankly right now I've gone off winter veg and am craving spring and sunshine and better health.

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BsshBossh · 23/03/2013 19:46

SpiralSkies don't bow out just because of one or two posters. Simply don't respond to them. But please continue to share your experience of this WOE.

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GreenEggsAndNichts · 23/03/2013 19:46

BMJ are you suggesting that everything we read in the media... isn't true?!

Grin

They're going to make it sound as crazy/good/bad/whatever as they want to in order to sell papers or get clicks-through. The Telegraph article in my OP makes it sound like you can eat what you want, but it's clarified towards the end by MM's comments.

I haven't had a whole lot of time lately with the move and family visits to keep up with the newer articles on the subject. I can only imagine what they're saying now.

OP posts:
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catsrus · 23/03/2013 19:47

I eat what I like on non fast days and still lose weight - but what I like to eat has shifted. I have eaten biscuits, cake, roast potatoes, fish and chips, crisps ...you name it. I don't eat these things every day but I do eat them.

The re-setting of the appetite is one of the interesting (and welcome) side effects of this WOE for me - which is why it's sustainable for most of us.

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woahthere · 23/03/2013 19:51

Quick question. This week struggled with doing a fast day. Did my first one on Tuesday, then Thursday, dont know why but I just felt like I really needed fuel in the morning, so I thought I'd eat until 4 and then try and fast from then until the next day. Then I figured out that normally I would not be eating from 10pm at night until 4pm the next day, then have my 500 then nothing more until next morning..so by my calculations that meant I would not be able to eat until 2 in the morning on this occasion! Thought I would give it a go but failed miserably. I had nothing to eat from 4pm Thursday until Friday morning, then had 250 calories for breakfast, then nothing until 6pm when I caved because boyfriend offered carvery dinner and I was so hungry! I feel all confused now! How shall I get back on track...dont think I can bear to fast this weekend...think it may be due to have my period...maybe.

Also, what do people think to combining 5:2 with slimming world...pointless or boost weight loss?

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ErikNorseman · 23/03/2013 19:51

BMJ I think you are a bit...confused? I don't remember all your posts of course, but I have an overwhelming impression of contradiction. Your weight is fairly low, how can you have been losing 4lb a week without fail? That's pretty impossible. And if you were losing that much on 1800 a day why don't you carry on rather than messing with your head on this woe that isn't working for you?

You've got bigger fish to fry than losing a few lbs. you need to sort out your diet and start cooking! You will never have a sustainable diet if you flip between pizza and junk/diet crap and ready meals. You need a better balance of decent food in your life to fill you up and nourish you properly.

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BsshBossh · 23/03/2013 19:51

I too eat exactly what I like catsrus but my shrinking appetite means I generally eat less of it. My tastebuds have changed too though so, for example, tonight I've craved a huge bowl of broccoli!

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swallowedAfly · 23/03/2013 19:58

i totally get it spiralskies because i'm near driven to the same thing. it is driving me nuts and at least every few days i wonder whether to just stop posting on here or say what i think - thing is i don't think saying what you think matters at all because there's no empathy/consideration/whatever it is that makes you give a toss about others going on there.

and breathe.

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BsshBossh · 23/03/2013 20:04

SAF exactly. It's frustrating. But ignore! Your experiences are too valuable for the rest of us posters. Please keep posting (but ignore certain posts - you'd do that with RL irritants people wouldn't you).

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BlackMaryJanes · 23/03/2013 20:06

BMJ are you suggesting that everything we read in the media... isn't true?!

I'm suggesting that the media are being irresponsible with their framing of 5:2.

I'm also embarrassed, angry, and upset that I was taken in by it. Blush Sad

With all the fuss over 5:2 I thought: "It can't possibly just be another way of reaching a calorie deficit. That would make it just a bog-standard diet. Nothing special. Perhaps you really can eat what you like, and that is why this diet is so popular. I'll give it a whirl".

So I bought into the whole 'fast for 2 days, gorge for 5', and it was all bullshit.

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swallowedAfly · 23/03/2013 20:07

no because real life ones wouldn't keep turning up in the room and coming out with bs and negativity and demanding attention and magic wand solutions to their very obvious solution self created problems!

it's like an endless circle.

i went from tabloid journalist to eating disordered to just plain disordered to is this deliberate to i don't care anymore i just want it to stop.

i am a bad person no doubt but blimey!

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BlackMaryJanes · 23/03/2013 20:07

how can you have been losing 4lb a week without fail? That's pretty impossible.

When I stick to 1800 on non-fast days I loose 4lbs. But some weeks I haven't stuck to 1800 so haven't lost the 4lbs. Does that clear it up?

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MintyyAeroEgg · 23/03/2013 20:08

I have stopped posting on this thread because of one particular poster. Just thought I'd say.

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swallowedAfly · 23/03/2013 20:08

yep ok then bmj it's total bullshit so you obviously won't want to do it anymore or post on a support thread for those doing it. simples right?

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LaurieFairyCake · 23/03/2013 20:12

I'm sorry BMJ but I think a lot of people can eat what they like on this diet as they don't have massively disordered eating.

You DO have massively disordered eating - as a quick guesstimate that list you produced of what you WANT to eat is about 5000 calories.

The vast majority of the population don't want to eat that.

If you want this to work for you, you're going to have to tweak it to fit you.

You can't just eat what you like because frankly that list you provided would make anyone apart from an athlete, fat.

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MintyyAeroEgg · 23/03/2013 20:12

As I said to you on the thread you started about your "friend" who was thinking of trying 5:2, nowhere does anyone say you should gorge on non-fast days. Iirc I told you not to be so fucking stupid. I would say the same now.

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BlackMaryJanes · 23/03/2013 20:14

Okay I won't post, I'll just lurk. Sorry. I didn't mean to spoil the thread for everyone :(

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swallowedAfly · 23/03/2013 20:17

well it's not rocket science bmj is it? people are on a SUPPORT thread for a voluntary way of eating that is working for many of them. clearly constantly coming on going this is shit, this doesn't work, what a con, blah blah blah is not great social skills.

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LaurieFairyCake · 23/03/2013 20:18

I'm loving this WOL in general and finding the fasting days still easy - and I'm very happy with my 12 pound weight loss in 7 weeks.

However, as I posted earlier I am struggling with my TDEE on eating days because I've gone off winter veg - winter is too long for me now and I need the weather to change to stop me eating so much sugary and unsatisfying food.

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swallowedAfly · 23/03/2013 20:18

and i repeat everyone who writes about this woe points out again and again it is NOT suitable for people with eating disorders - full stop.

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swallowedAfly · 23/03/2013 20:22

winter is way too blumming long lauriefairycake.

i too have lost between 12 and 13lbs in 7 weeks which i'm pleased with because it's been easy to do and only one of the benefits i've seen from eating like this.

likewise what i want to eat on most of my non fast days has changed. i've had the odd day of eating 'crap' but it has mostly made me feel like crap quite rapidly which has put me off and/or i find i can't eat the quantity of it i used to.

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