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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

5:2 Diet Thread! 7 is our lucky number...

991 replies

GreenEggsAndNichts · 19/11/2012 12:57

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- we won't bite. Well, maybe on a fast day. Wink

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one etc!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

Here is where I would link to the aforementioned Horizon programme, but it appears as if the BBC have finally noticed it on YouTube and have taken it down. If you have another link for this episode, please PM me with it, or post it to the thread and we'll put it up for the next thread.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. We tend to favour lots of hot drinks during the day (count your milk if you use it!)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Good Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

We mentioned BMR and TDEE often. Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE) quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
ToffeeChops · 01/12/2012 10:44

Fantastic news Cyclistist - what an encouragement to all of us who want an improvement in our health.

I have to remind myself sometimes that while I REALLY want to lose weight with the WOE (and am, after years of dieting failure) the main motivation for MM was health, of which a good BMI is just a part. Keeping this in mind helps me to stay committed to 5:2 for the long run. Hopefully it will also help those on this thread who don't see huge changes on the scales, but hope / believe / trust it is benefitting them in other, less easily monitored, ways.

Happy fasting / feasting to all this weekend!

ceebeegeebies · 01/12/2012 10:47

Cyclist wow, those results are great Smile It must give you such a boost to realise that what you are doing comes with such positive results.

I am now in week 2 of 5:2 but I didn't weigh myself (we have no scales at home) so I have no idea if I lost any weight last week. I do think my trousers feel a bit looser but that could just be my imagination Grin

However, I have had a massive breakthrough thanks to this diet. Before, I would not leave the house without a stock of food/snacks in my bag. However, after 2 fast days, I have completely broken that habit and can easily go from breakfast to lunchtime without eating anything. In fact yesterday (a non-fasting day), I had breakfast (bowl of shreddies) at 7am and didn't manage to get any lunch until nearly 2pm due to meetings going on etc (I did have an apple at 10ish) and it was absolutely fine - didn't panic/scoff chocolate biscuits in desperation as I would have done previously, was able to mostly ignore the hunger pangs and when I did eventually get my lunch, it tasted great.

I am still struggling with the fast days as am finding it really difficult to fit 2 in each week around gym/social life as I am still unsure about exercising in the evening of a fast day (cannot exercise in the mornings due to work). However, I am quite confident that if I just stop snacking on normal days which I am now able to do, even if I only manage 1 fast day a week, my calorie intake will still be reduced to enable me to lose weight Smile

Just wanted to say a big thank you to everyone on this thread as I read your inspiring stories and it really has given me tremendous willpower and I have managed to break the bad snacking habit that I have had for at least 10 years Smile

myjoy · 01/12/2012 12:04

Thanks for the curried wedge recipe, Breadandwine. Made them for brunch this morning and they were delish!

TalkinPeace2 · 01/12/2012 13:25

ceebeegeebies I would say exercise perfectly normally on fast days - I do.
Athletes who eat a lot when exercising do so because the have no fat reserves.
Even as slim as I am now, I've got enough calories on my hips to run a couple of marathons ..... and exercising on an empty stomach will force your body to dip into fat stores.
And well done on breaking the snack habit.

TheCyclistist · 01/12/2012 15:18

Afternoon Skippy , I think the tests were done on a Friday the first week I'd gone 5:2 rather than 4:3 so it would have been; Normal day Sunday, Fast Monday, normal Tuesday, normal Wednesday, Fast on Thursday day before the test.

Thanks Toffeechops and hopefully there'll be more good news from others soon to keep us motivated, I know that I'm certainly finding the Fast days no easy going at the moment but focusing on the positives rather than the deprevation always helps. Something I think Aftereights said about the unpleasentness of being too full also helps, as when things are getting tough on a Fast day I remind myself how cr@p I feel when I'm too full and reason that feeling hungry is no worse.

Good luck Ceebeegeebies , fasting ain't easy but it's do-able and the alternatives either, being unhealthy and overweight, or long term low-cal, or short term loss - long term gain diets aren't any more attractive Grin

TalkinPeace2 · 01/12/2012 17:32

Weird side effects of 5:2.
Am going to have to buy DH an extra - smaller - wedding ring as his fingers have shrunk and his flew off at work on Thursday (he did the same for me when I lost lots of weight ten years ago)
And he very kindly reduced the size of my watch strap so it fits again.

skippyscuffleton · 01/12/2012 19:20

Lg thanks for posting that BMj link, you are really on the ball with knowledge like that. My post fasting cholesterol blood results tie in with what the article said.

Iwearblack · 01/12/2012 21:19

Great cholesterol results thecyclist well done!
How are those people doing who were not losing?
mintyy did your thyroid results show anything untoward?
My weight pretty much plateaued for 3 weeks but then started shifting and now am feeling the benefits. thank you for all the advice - kept me going...
I used to plan my lo-cal days like a military campaign with lots of 'backup' ie fruit, in case I couldn't handle the hunger and needed supplies. After 3 months I realise I can do it and have started to relax about having snacks to hand ... I have become a chewing gum queen though (for the bus ride home before evening meal).
One question - have stopped having brekkie on lo days; do other people have brekkie on feeding days or go without then too? I am a bit ambivalent about breakfast now after years of loving it!

Iwearblack · 01/12/2012 21:21

Sorry got your name wrong TheCyclistist!

TalkinPeace2 · 01/12/2012 21:24

Iwearblack
I was never a big breakfast person since my teens
but have now taken to having splendid brunches at weekends
DH - who quivers without breakfast - still has his yogurt and meusli, but in a smaller bowl

is mintyy still lurking (I hope) as recent medical research may point to the fact that she's not doing anything wrong, but has a different endocrine system from the 'losers' www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0049919

Thegirlinbrighton · 01/12/2012 21:35

Hello fasting people,
I have been following the threads on here since I discovered it in late September - I started the diet itself in August after watching the programme. I've found it really inspiring. I've struggled with my weight all my life and this way of eating has changed everything for me. There's also a lot of breast cancer in my family - I qualify for mammograms early because of it - and we're a type II diabetes disaster zone. I felt out of control and really unable to do anything.

I love this lifestyle, and have lost 16lbs and am now a healthy weight again. I haven't participated here only because I always feel a fraud on Mumsnet because I'm not a mum!

But I did decide to post tonight because I've seen a few posts where people are negative about the idea of a 5:2 book and I just wanted to post the alternative POV. Not everyone writes as a get rich quick scheme...

I know when I started the diet immediately after the show, there seemed to be a dearth of reliable information. I spent a lot of time reading around the subject and when I'd done that, decided to write the ebook/guide I?d looked for and couldn?t find. Forums are terrific but some people do simply prefer a guide in book form. So I thought I'd write one based on practical experiences and the basics of the science - I did try to contact Dr Mosley but when he didn't reply I decided I'd try it anyway. I only learned from this forum that he's writing a book too but I am sure it'll be great.

The diet is the simplest I've ever done but as the Horizon isn't available any more - which I think is down to BBC international copyright issues rather than Dr Mosley taking it down - I wanted to bring the info together. I also had lots of body image and other issues that have been improved by fasting. Dr Mosley, as a confident male presenter, didn?t talk about it on the show ? and so I?ve written about that too.

I don't want anyone to think I am advertising etc so won't mention the book but it was certainly a huge labour of love. I think everyone should try 5:2 (including my own parents but that's not going to happen...)

I've also made sure that the free preview of the book I've written contains everything you'd need to do it, so no one actually has to buy it if they don't want to. Am also going to do some free downloadable guides - plus I've chosen to make the ebook available at a lower price than anything else. Yes, it'd be nice to cover my time if people buy it as I've worked to make it as good as I can, including surveying 40+ dieters, testing recipes and meal plans. But I've also pointed people to the numerous free resources, including this forum - though rest assured I've absolutely not quoted anyone from here or other forums.

I hope I don't sound too defensive - I've just spent two months working really hard on it with the best intentions so it's close to my heart. I think that we're on the cusp of a revolution here and however people hear about it, we're talking about cost savings both for ourselves and for the health service. One of my lovely interviewees also said she'd donated her (unused) lunch money the other day when a homeless young woman asked for some change and it made her think about how fortunate we are to have a choice about what and when we eat. It struck me as a fantastic idea - turning that gratefulness into something positive.

Right, enough blathering. I hope no one minds my posting an alternative POV.

TGIB Smile

TalkinPeace2 · 01/12/2012 21:51

TGIB
welcome, and MoB, Cyc and B&W are not mums either - being men as they are
Mumsnet host this thread, it is not just for mums.

Your book : have you had it printed? I get DH's book printed with these people
www.fast-print.net/ - we send them a file, they turn it into a book that we sell on his website ..... and actually something 'tangible' for us to give to the doubters that has NOT been written by a newpaper parasite might be a good thing :-)

Breadandwine · 02/12/2012 00:06

Hi TGIB and welcome to the thread.

Nice to know you're referencing this forum in your publication - but, as you yourself have demonstrated, not everyone feels comfortable about coming onto Mumsnet - so we do need other avenues.

As far as I'm concerned, the more people that get to know about this WOL, the better - and if your ebook can help get the message out, then great.

I agree with your point about savings for the health service - but there's also a huge looming crisis in care for the elderly which could be mitigated by a wide take-up of this WOL.

I think you'll agree there's more information available now than there was 4 months ago - much of it referenced on the Tips and Links thread. It's being added to all the time, so keep an eye on it.

Best wishes, B&W

vix89 · 02/12/2012 00:09

Sorry, didn't see that old thread was closed, so will post it again here :D

New person here! Had my first fast day yesterday, went slightly over at 600 cals. Wasn't too much torture, hunger pains are easily taken care of by a cup of hot green tea! Feast day today, going to enjoy this!

Starting weight: 10 stone (height 5,4)
Target weight : 9 stone

Good luck everyone! Currently muching on a bowl of strawberry yoghurt mixed with oats and a dash of Special K, very tasty!

pip895 · 02/12/2012 08:36

ceebeegeebies - just thought I woud share - first few weeks there is no way could/would have tried exercising on a fast day, but after that it got much easier and most fast days now I can exercise fine. Smile

pip895 · 02/12/2012 08:48

Sorry above is full of typos Blush - sticky keyboard!

Another thought - Anyone else having issues with going down to only one meal on a fast day? I have (since September) had 3 small meals a day on a fast day - but decided to go to one evening meal only (because of more health benefits). I nearly keeled over at about 2pm and had to eat something. Don?t know whether to try again, or go part way - eating a latish lunch would still be ~ 20hrs of fasting

TellMeLater · 02/12/2012 09:26

Pip why don't you try going down to 2 meals for a while - let you body get used to that first. I do sometimes feel a bit light headed on fast days in the afternoon but it passes in minutes - make sure you are drinking enough fluids.

TellMeLater · 02/12/2012 09:32

Ceebeegees try giving exercise a go in the evenings - apparently your body will get used to whatever you throw at it, so it may be more challenging to begin with but your body will adjust, so just take it easy to begin with if you need to, sometimes all that is standing in our way is the psychological rather than the physical.

Skinnyeye · 02/12/2012 10:46

Morning all fast day Sunday for me Grin had planned on going for a cycle today but its -4 and very icy in Glasgow. Will go skating this afternoon (indoor) and try out my new skates instead.

As others have said Pip build up to 1 meal per day and it will become much easier to manage. I was on 2 meals for ages then weight loss stalled then went to one meal. Your body will adapt to this WOE so i find it useful to mix it up a bit when I reach a plateau.

Good luck to all the new fasters and it hoestly does get easier

GreenEggsAndNichts · 02/12/2012 10:55

TGIB I appreciate there is (was) a lack of information on this WOE available, and I can understand how you would decide to write a book about it.

I do think that, if people were interested, they could do a quick bit of research themselves and figure out how to try this. I might admin all the links in the OP, but I've yet to actually watch the entire Horizon special. Blush Grin I have, however, read reviews and more importantly, quotes from the specialists which were consulted for the programme. I've read research papers I found online. I've read several overviews from various newspapers and fitness blogs. All I needed to know to do this properly, though, I learnt from the very first article I read.

The problem is that I (and others, but I don't speak for them) know how dead simple this is, so the idea of someone out there feeling they need to purchase a book to tell them how to do it is akin to someone feeling the need to purchase a book to tell them how to inhale and exhale. What, only eat 500 calories twice a week? What, once I inhale, I should exhale again? The creating of meal plans and recipes, aimed at telling people how to do this, is the start of complicating things. Again, just my opinion.

I appreciate that there is an audience out there ready for a book. However, I think a lot of them are people who feel they need to purchase something or they won't actually lose weight, and that is really where my frustration lies.

Anyway, good luck with your book. :) I'm sure you won't need it- I think there's definitely a market out there for it right now. Even better if you can get it out there in time for New Years resolutions.

OP posts:
GreenEggsAndNichts · 02/12/2012 11:02

Fast day for me today! I've got a trip to Leicester tomorrow as I need follow-up blood tests, so thought I'd kill two birds with one stone. I was going to have to eat low-fat today anyway, and well, if I'm in the city tomorrow I might decide to have lunch while I'm out. :)

Blood tests aren't related to this, though. They're following up on the blood clot I had (first tests indicate I have a blood gene mutation which makes me susceptible to clots, so no it wasn't down to lack of movement!) They will be testing liver functions etc, but I won't have earlier tests to compare them to, unfortunately.

Welcome to the thread, vix! :)

OP posts:
franklyidontgiveadamn · 02/12/2012 11:15

Shock to fasting on a Sunday, that's hardcore! I give the whole weekend (including Friday) a wide berth and have decided on Tues and Thurs as my days. I wasn't sure whether a gap of only one day would have any adverse effect on the method but when I looked at the article I saw those were the days MM had chosen and also, apparently, Muhammed so I'm in good company!

Was quite amazed at myself for managing my first second fast day (IYSWIM) last week - I've done a few fast days in the past but never two in a week and never with any long-term goal in mind. I don't eat at all on my fast days but I drink quite a lot of tea with milk in.

Just to backtrack slightly to the discussion about healthy eating on non-fast days I feel that as a newbie the thing that will help me to stick to fast days and get the routine of this WOE embedded is the knowledge that I can eat as normal on the other days. Of course, it is eating 'as normal' that has got me into the state I'm in (posted last thurs) but I know if I make big changes early on the whole thing will just fall apart like every other diet I've done in the last 10 years. I feel sure over time the fasting will promote a greater awareness of exactly what I am eating and a reduced tolerance for high sugar/fat/salt etc

I am also pretty sure that with time there will be a mental effect of the fasting in training my mind not to react to every feeling of 'hunger' by immediately finding something to eat.

pip895 · 02/12/2012 11:46

franklyidontgiveadamn - I agree about eating day restrictions - I have never dieted before and a big plus on this WOE for me was eating normally on non fasting days.

I guess it is likely to work better for people whose weight is relatively stable before hand (it took me 12 years without dieting to put on the 3stone I would now like to lose) If someone had been yoyo dieting for years then I imagine it might be more problematic.

franklyidontgiveadamn · 02/12/2012 12:24

I've got three stone to lose as well pip and have decided this WOE is my best bet for years as long as I can accept losing it slowly. I have decided just to use the next three weeks to get used to the fast days and then going to have to accept xmas week will be no-go for fasting. In New Year I am going to start adding in some light exercise.

Thegirlinbrighton · 02/12/2012 13:52

TalkinPeace2, thanks for the welcome, and the suggestion. So far, I've only put it up as an ebook but I would consider doing a printed version - I think the alternative is CreateSpace, which is via Amazon, as I've put the ebook up via Kindle. We shall see...

B&W, yes, you're totally right about elderly care costs too and all the evidence I've read says that it's those of us who are middle-aged and older see the bigger benefits - one of the studies, the Spanish research that was ignored for so long due to translation errors, was so interesting with regards to people living longer and better even though they only started intermittent fasting very late in life.

Greeneggs, thanks for the thoughtful response. Re: recipes, I am totally one of those who sees fast days as a great reason to stay out of the kitchen, except for heating up half a bowl of Skinny soup or microwaving some baked beans, but friends who I spoke to were quite sniffy about the idea of 'ready made' meals which is why I put in a few really simple recipes. And the meal plans were just examples to show what different people eat.

I agree that on one level that it's as natural as breathing and certainly, people on this forum have more than enough info. But when I started in August, I was so jaded and fed up with trying endless diets that I was very sceptical about how effective it might be and maybe a guide might have reassured me. Plus of course I'm not telling people to buy it, it's just there on amazon if people are looking for it, and one of the things I say right up front, in the part that's free to download is 'If it?s that simple, why do I need a book about it? Well, maybe you don?t - if you stick to 500 calories a day (if you?re a woman) or 600 (if you?re a man) on your ?fast? days, then you?ll almost certainly benefit.'

Might have shot myself in the food there, but hey ho. I did manage to get the ebook finished on Friday - I reckon I wrote it so quickly because my brain was working on overdrive due to the fasting.

In the meantime, it's a fast day today after a massive Christmas lunch with friends in London yesterday. Just had some asparagus and a poached egg in a cafe - with, gulp, a small amount of hollandaise and half a halved muffin. Suspect that's going to be my only meal today by the time I've calorie counted the sauce... but it was worth it!