5:2 Diet Thread! 7 is our lucky number...

[GreenEggsAndNichts]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- we won't bite. Well, maybe on a fast day.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one etc!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

Here is where I would link to the aforementioned Horizon programme, but it appears as if the BBC have finally noticed it on YouTube and have taken it down. If you have another link for this episode, please PM me with it, or post it to the thread and we'll put it up for the next thread.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. We tend to favour lots of hot drinks during the day (count your milk if you use it!)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Good Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

We mentioned BMR and TDEE often. Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE) quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

Whereas I'm eating LOADS more eggs - mainly cos DH is an expert at poaching them

Hmmmm...... Brussels sprouts, eggs.........
Anyone guess what I'm thinking?!

Brussels sprouts and eggs??

I have no idea. Though whatever it is, I'm not sure I want to be downwind of it!

fruitscone congratulations! :) And welcome to the thread!

LG You're right. We posted more about the veg in earlier incarnations of this thread, and it's fallen by the wayside. I tend to only eat veg on my fast days, with the exception of the day or two where I decided to push the boat out and have some eggs. :) This is because I was initially following the Genesis diet, which is a version of IDF also aimed at preventing cancer.

I'm not a vegetarian, but I do limit the amount of meat I eat, for various reasons I don't need to go into here. Eating more veg can only be a good thing.

LG - (sorry diddnt mean to come over all offended) I just didn?t remember that bit of the program at all - despite watching it twice

I am also very attached to my bacon sarnies and MM did get health gains whilst still eating protein.

Mind you, I too have upped the amount of veg I eat, both fast & feast days- this is the first diet I have ever attempted (in > 50 years!!) - it was a real eye opener just how many calories there are in so many processed foods.

I didn't read the original post as a discussion about vegetarianism vs meat eating, just a reference to the programme we are all following in which one of the 4 scientists definitely said that it is healthier to eat a plant based diet. if we are following their other suggestions, why ignore that one?

Blimey some of you type fast! Ignore my post, it had become redundant in the time it took me to write it!

Well LG - not sure how to put it daintily, but I said I'm eating lots of sprouts, TP2 said she's eating lots of eggs, and in my house both those things have rather, er, unwelcome side effects

Let's hope no one suggests a great recipe that combines the two!

Sprout omlette anyone???

dh has woken me up by knocking at the door, after a night at the pub. He has returned with a bag of chips and was most perturbed that I wouldn't eat them. He knows I've fasted all day!

The b word! Tell him to eat them in the garden! Boo hiss no more Scottish smileys

Evening all.

Well as I said earlier got the blood test results back this afternoon and I'm sad enough to sit down and share them with the greater research project that is this Thread approaching the midnight hour.

A bit of background first. Up till two years ago I basically had a quite an issue with alcohol, namely a bottle of a half of Merlot in front of the Telly after work every day of the week. This had no real effect on my health until about 3 or 4 years ago when basically that and my increasing weight led to me starting to fall apart physically (no need to go into too many details). Anyway the docs start sending me for blood tests every 6 months or so to see how the 'markers' in my blood were doing.

Initially although my cholesterol was always fairly good, never really above 5.2 most of the other markers weren't great. My liver enzyme test coming out at about 130 when the upper limit should be 40.

I stopped drinking 2 years ago but put on a little more weight till a year ago I was 18 stone (but naturally big boned ). Although I hadn't drunk for a year the Liver enzyme test was still in the 60's this January. I lost a few stone between last November and early July when I had my last test and the Liver enyme test had dropped to 46, nearly the upper range of healthy.

So below are the results from July a couple of weeks before I started this WOE, initially 4:3 then more recently 5:2. As it said in the programme I have had 600 cals on Fasting days and eaten anything on none fasting days including chocolate, pizza, curry, crisps and anything up to 3,500 cals although my TDEE is around 3,300 because of my build,sex and activity levels. I keep my protein levels down, I'm not a great meat eater but do eat meat, I have no concerns at all whether something has carbohydrates in it but avoid most of the time very high GI foods but not all of the time. I eat a diet high in oats, fibre and veg as well as other 'less wholesome' foods and the only supplements I take are ALIMAX garlic tablets and Boots own label Omega 3 supplement.

The first column was the score in the July blood test the second the score now and the 3rd the recommended normal range. The results on the whole are pretty amazing.......

Cholesterol overall 4.1 / 3.4 / 3.0-5.0
HDL good Cholesterol 1.35 / 1.5 / 1.0-3.5
LDL bad cholesterol 2.3 / 1.6 / 1.0-3.00
A very good cholesterol reading and a huge improvement in the good to bad cholesterol ratio, espeially considering my unrestricted diet on feed days

Trig levels .88 / .71 / 0.5-2.3
Although Triglyceride levels were good in July they were over 15% better a few months later, this is also a sgn of a liver working healthily

Liver Function Tests
ALT/SGPT Serum 46 / 30 / 0.00-40.00
Serum Protein level 71 / 69 / 60-80
Serum albumin 44 / 45 / 35-50
Serum globulin 27 / 24 / 18-36
All markers basically going in the right direction with the main marker being within the healthy range for the first time in a decade

Kidney Function
Serum urea level 5.4 / 3.9 / 2.5-7.8
Serum creatine level 93 / 87 / 74-110
Serum Potasium 4.3 / 4.1 / 3.5-5.3
All fairly healthy with slight improvements. The drop in the urea marker probably down to my low protein diet showing up

Fasting Blood Glucose Level
4.5 / 4.7 / 3.5-6.0
Up slightly and I think it was in July from the previous one so will watch this.

Serum TSH Thyroid function / 1.67 / .35-5.5
This wasn't done last time

I post these results because people have asked to see whether this WOE has health benefits as well as weight loss benefits so I hope they don't look like I'm saying 'look at me aren't I great'. So overall in a matter of 4 months this WOE has has marked positive effects on some major body functions. Of course there may be other areas not tested that are going in the wrong direction only time and more evidnece from others will tell.
However all I can say is I feel better than I did 4 months ago, my Liver and Kidneys are working better and my cholesterol levels are markedly improved despite me eating basically anything I wanted...be it every other day .

It made the curry tonight taste all the sweeter....washed down by a cool pepsi with loads of ice of course

[And I'm sad enough to check this thread at well after midnight! ]

Hi Cyclist

That's a nice birthday present! Congratulations on those results - the evidence continues to stack up that this WOL is the way to go. Combined with the report upthread (which I've put over on the Links thread) from the Daily Mail reporter about her IGF1 before and after results, they're the first indications that we're all following a healthy path.

Thanks for reporting back - it's certainly very encouraging!

[Since this report of yours will soon get lost in the middle of this thread, do you want to copy it over on the other thread?]

Cyclistist - You pulled a fast one there, didn't you? You said you are 'sad' to share the test results and my heart was in my mouth as I read the test values! But you've improved on all counts - so well done, you!

A question about this link posted in the last page: www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2240003/Its-hell-feast-famine-diet-help-drop-dress-size--live-longer.html
Do you measure your waist where Anna is holding the tape or at your navel? Makes a difference - a big difference!

I, too, was thrown off by "sad enough" and only reluctantly read on.

Congratulations, Cyclist, and thank you so much for sharing your splendid results. This is fantastic news, which I'm sure will encourage all of us. I had a particularly challenging fast this week (I'm doing one 36-hour food- and calorie-free fast a week, while trying not to lose weight) that had me thinking "you know, this is optional". Keeping your improved markers in the forefront of my mental file will certainly help with the next challenges.

Bravo! Birthday presents don't get much better than this. Lifting my cup of green tea in toast to you and wishing you many more healthy celebrations.

cyclist that is very good news, when I started reading your post I was oh no then I was go go go.

On a selfish note I've fasted 3 days this week changing my usual Friday to Thursday as I was going out for dinner. I've hardly been able to sleep the food feels as if its like a brick in my stomach, worse I realise I used to feel like this most nights. So even though I didn't go over my tdee I still feel dreadful & I think it's because the food is richer than I've been having on my non fast days, so maybe the way my body reacts to food is changing.

Thanks guys

Have cut and pasted it across B&W and added some other results that I didn't put on the original post basically because I was knackered and there were no comparable tests last time.

Have a great day all be you fasting, feeding or Christmas shopping

Well done cyclist it's great to see positive health results as we're all really stumbling around in the dark. This and the Daily Mail article just re-inforce my belief that for the long-term, after the excess weight is gone, I will be doing the best I can to keep healthy. If anyone else has any blood work done please let us know.

Still here all...

Great results thecyclist! Well done you!

I made my target last week, and have lost nearly another 1lb this week, so slowly, slowly I hope to see below 11stone before Christmas.

Aftereights, I used to feel like that every night too. Last night, we 'gorged' on chocolate for the first time in months. Felt ugh this morning, and looking forward to going to the gym shortly. That will be the last chocolate until Christmas I think.

B&W I love the idea of the curried wedges i often have a dry potato curry to fill me up.
I used to be a veggie but these days i do eat a little chicken and sometimes the odd fish finger. I still mainly eat veggie because my OH is still a veggie and when family come over they are all veggie too, apart from my 4 Grandchildren . They are being left to make their own choices when they are old enough to make that decision. I find protien does fill you up for longer and i know from doing atkins it helps speed up ketosis but i couldnt eat much meat theses days and if i could eat macaroni cheese and fresh bread and butter every day without getting fat i could happily live on that.

Cyclist that is so great , i admire your openess and for many reasons i thank you for sharing.

Cyclistist Well done and thanks for posting your results. It's great to see solid proof that IF is doing you good.
Out of interest, how long have you been IFing and when did you have the blood test? Was it after fasting for 24hrs+ or on a monday morning after some hard core weekend feeding? I often wonder how the results would differ between those two times.