Do you think Johnson and his mates even read his great Brexit deal that he campaigned and won an election on?

[Kendodd]

Because they all seem to think it's a shit deal now (it is).

Well the Fisheries Minister, Victoria Prentice didn't bother, because she was too busy organising a Nativity trail.

Unless the earth blows up there will be Christmas next year, but those fishermen's livelihoods are likely to be gone. Still they can always retrain in cyber security, or was it ballet dancing?

As for de Piffle and Frost, I assume that they thought it didn't matter what the agreements said because they weren't going to attempt to implement them anyway.

I am just watching Newsnight and feeling so sad to hear politicians from Ireland describing Britain as untrustworthy .

They just make it up and then try to bully people out of the way later.

Total mess. Brexit was the most stupid idea ever and we are going to be dealing with the fallout for decades at this rate.

When I say 'they' just make it up - I mean Johnson et al.

I'm starting to think it's deliberate. If they can shout about how unfair the EU are being (ignoring the fact its Johnsons deal and knowing nobody in the media will point this out) they get to drum up some hate. Hate is the only thing they've got and Leave voters will NEVER turn against brexit or Johnson. Even those fishing communities, if they could vote again, I have very little doubt they would STILL vote Leave and STILL believe Johnson.

Agree hate is all they have. Brexit was so negative and that negative energy is required to continue winning.

I agree, they are so fixated on We hate the EU, and we must pretend that we never contributed to a single law that the EU ever made, that they have completely thrown pragmatism out of the window. Withdrawing from Euratom for a starter. Or being adamant that they won't be in the Customs Union - that alone has done so much damage. Withdrawal from Erasmus - to reinvent some half cock scheme which will probably only benefit those privately educated children who aspire to Ivy League universities. I could go on.

Virus Johnson was foreign minister when TM was trying to get her deal through. He knew very clearly the terms of the NI issue/backstop? which TM rejected.
He got into the top job and won the election on 'getting brexit done', 'oven ready deal' etc which was TMs deal plus the difficult bits TM wouldn't accept (for the now quite clear reasons) for political expediency.
His aim was not what was best for the country but what was politically expedient for him and his party - issues were to be faced & ironed out later.

Interesting insider comments this morning on The Today programme, R4, but it was talked about and warned about at the time but falling on deaf ears.

He knew very well.

*Boris, not virus

Think Virus Johnson quite apt tbh

Virus Johnson works for me...

Every household in the UK had a leaflet encouraging vote to remain. I wonder why that didn't work? ( Genuine question)

The leaflet was widely rubbished and dismissed for its cost by the press before it was distributed. Didn't really read it myself. Did my own research.
The EU had been rubbished and blamed for all our ills for a very long time. A leaflet sent out by Cameron & Co would never dent that.

All the experts were also summarily dismissed.

Because the leaflet was rubbish and barely made the case for the EU. Cameron's problem was that he and Osborne had used the EU as a scapegoat for loads of problems which were caused by their Government. They could hardly made the case for it, without highlighting how rubbish their austerity had been. The money for the NHS - did no one question why it had been starved of funds? It was nothing to do with the EU but a Westminster choice.

I didn't read the leaflet either, or can't remember reading it if I did.

All the experts were also summarily dismissed.

I just went with what the vast majority of the experts said (Remain) and how it would affect the peace in Ireland. What does someone like me know about the complexity of our EU membership and why would I think for a minute that I somehow know better about global trade (for example) than the head of the WTO? I cringe for Leave voters sometimes when they think reading Daily Mail headlines makes them well informed. Anyway, Brexit was and always will be about feelings not facts, Aaron Banks and Dominic Cummings were right when they said they didn't need facts, Remain can keep the facts, they had feelings.

@Kendodd I could see no good reason for leaving. Still don’t. EU’s not perfect, but it seemed to do us as a country and individually, rather a lot of good.
Can’t really say that for the Tories! - well, not this bunch of Pseudo ‘Kippers anyway.

Can’t really say that for the Tories! - well, not this bunch of Pseudo ‘Kippers anyway.

The public love them though.

I read the leaflet. It said “this government believes we should remain in the EU” which was their big mistake. Cameron a) politicised Brexit, so if you did not want to support the Tories you voted Leave. And Gove & Johnson were in the government but fronted the Leave campaign which contradicted what the leaflet said. Cameron ran an appalling campaign and all this shit is firmly piled up against his door.

The public love them though.

Some of the public love them. The local elections in the south east told a slightly different story.

If anyone ever thought that Boris was genuine and that there was an oven ready deal in 2019 clearly didn’t do enough research.

@Peregrina And my area of Cambridgeshire!!

@Iggly - it was ‘oven-ready’, but thoughtlessly cobbled together. ‘Get Brexit Done’, but don’t ask too much about the details.

It wasn’t oven ready because after the election, there were and still are loads of things to sort out…..

It was even ready in the same way as a poor quality ready meal full of dodgy ingredients.

Virus Johnson could be catching.

From what I can see from inside the EU, it honestly looks like they did nothing to prepare anyone for any of it!
Post is hit and miss and often takes weeks, tons of companies no longer deliver to the uk from Europe or deliver from the uk to Europe and mainly because they don’t seem to know what charges they should be paying themselves or passing on to the customer.
M&S food stores have been mostly empty since January and still continue to be half full 6 months in. Nobody knows what driving licence is valid, nobody knows if visitors need you to fill in a form at the town hall before they arrive. It is an absolute mess. And that’s just ground level, we can all see what’s going on trade wise with the fish and sausages.
Whether MP’s wanted brexit or not, they really should have got the basics sorted out before it happened. I don’t know what the hell they were doing all that time they had leading up to it.

I used to be a teacher and they remind me of students who would mess about in lessons, not do homework, disrupt other people's learning, do anything to get a laugh, turn up late (you get the picture) and then when they did badly in the exams (which everyone had warned would happen) they blamed everyone but themselves.