Westministenders: The Beginning of Negotiations

[RedToothBrush]

Transition has a few hours left.

Then negotiations start and trade stops.

Far from being over, there are huge numbers of issues that lay unresolved.

And businesses both now in the UK and EU will cease to trade with each other just because the red tape is such a pain.

So whilst people will celebrate and think things are 'done' that just shows how much people are paying attention.

It will be interesting to see people gradually realising what has been lost...

Peregrina
Yes, Clavinova, I have read it

I did wonder - you quoted HannibalHayes and she missed out "because it could cause an exodus of highly trained workers to the UK..."

HannibalHayes
Anyway, who woke Claviknownothing up again?

It wasn't you pretending to be me yesterday was it?

Of course, the delay in signing this deal might be because the UK Government knows damn well that they will lose more doctors, nurses and midwives to Australia. Why not, they have abolished the nursing and midwifery bursaries, in favour of student loans, so why not go to a country where you can practice the job you trained for, without having the cuts in the NHS to contend with, and not pay back the fees? Bonus.

Looks like Mr Johnson is not very good with bridges of any sort.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/brexit-truckers-arrive-fresh-and-well-fed-after-first-rosslare-dunkirk-sailing-1.4449238?fbclid=IwAR1DycRPoWLsI2LmTiVH3wUecCzXLNMZoJgs1wHZww_Y--agIwImp5W2J8g

Who’s paying our share? Any ideas?

It’s a big number.

TerryHearn's shift has come on again. Another one whose job is done and should be enjoying the sunlit uplands. Still maybe he was a fisherman and found that Good Ole Boris has sold him out.

I'm sure they will all chip in, don't worry yourself about it. They've probably got some grown ups reconfiguring the budget, plus we will still be paying our dues under the WA for a few years yet. Don't let it get you down.

Different perspective when you look at it per capita.

Quite apart from the fact that the EU will, guess what?, adjust its budget to match its membership.

Of course, it's not just about the cost, but also the value of what you get from it. Ireland is proud now to be a net contributor after many years of being a beneficiary, as that demonstrates the value it has got out, and continues to get out, of membership

Let's also not mention that in 4.5 years Brexit has probably now cost the UK economy a similar amount to all its contributions over the last 48 years combined - and still no quantifiable benefits to be seen (and no, zero VAT on sanitary products doesn't count ).

Hey @TerryHearn you won, get over it. Now is not the time to gloat, you winner you.

There won’t be any balancing of budgets. Leopards don’t change their spots. If anything it is going up to deal with Covid. I’m sure the Dutch will agree to fund it. 90% of the bloc haven’t got a pot to piss in! Perhaps Scotland can come in and pay for it.

@TerryHearn

Who’s paying our share? Any ideas?

Erm, we are, for a while yet as per our deal?

See also, the amount we've spent on Brexit Vs the total cost of our membership.

Going back to Australians flocking here with the Trade deal that the Brexiters are keen to have, it did occur to me that many Australians I know had a British parent and found it quite convenient to have British citizenship and use it to travel round Europe for a couple of years after leaving university. No point now - same rules for British passport holders as for Australians. Another Brexit bonus - deter people from the (White) Commonwealth when I thought the Brexiters wanted to reforge the links.

Wrong. Some modest liabilities over a few years yes but nothing near the annual contribution we have been paying.

So who is going to pay it?

Why does this bother you Terry?

I thought they had just agreed the budget?

ec.europa.eu/info/strategy/eu-budget/long-term-eu-budget/eu-budget-2021-2027_en

Can't have missed us too much there

Strangely enough, all those "a place down under" programmes show that Australia pays nurses etc. more than the UK does. So I think I can guess which way the drain would go...

Pays more, more flexible working hours, more leave, but actually the real crunch is much better nurse to patient ratios. They feel they can do their job better and do not need to worry someone is going to die because they were spread too thinly. If you were a neo natal nurse who looked after 5 dangerously ill babies when you qualified and five years later it was 10 and you could move to a top paediatric hospital in a vibrant city where you cared for one do you not think that like many U.K. doctors and nurses you would jump at the chance? And end up taking Australian citizenship?

@notafanoftheman

An acquaintance of mine who is a Portuguese resident and translator was refused entry to Portugal today.

Denied entry on arrival or denied boarding?

FWIW as Peregrina says there's a bit of it around at the moment.

Some problems seem to be down to lack of understanding (at several airlines and at some frontiers) of the nationality/residency documents required, on other occasions travellers have fallen foul of (the fast changing) Covid requirements.

@TerryHearn

Wrong. Some modest liabilities over a few years yes but nothing near the annual contribution we have been paying.

So who is going to pay it?

Why are you bothered about it? Are you one of those unelected Eurocrats? I’m sure you’ll work it out. We of course have rainbows, unicorns and the sunlit uplands so don’t need to worry about you any more.

Why is the Weirdly Resentful And Angry Despite Winning So Much Sunlit Uplands cohort still campaigning for the Thing They Have Already Won on this thread? Shouldn't they all be sitting back, congratulating themselves, whilst the milk and honey just naturally flow in?

I hope the Brexiters on this thread are out there working to build a new country, etc. Or are they sitting back, expecting others to do it?

Denied boarding. TBF she was very clear it was the airline in the wrong.

@notafanoftheman

Denied boarding. TBF she was very clear it was the airline in the wrong.

OK thanks...I suspected that might be the case...it's a mess ATM and I know of at least two UK airlines have been having trouble with the "new" requirements (ID requirement and/or Covid testing protocols) into various EU countries.

I've heard of at least one instance of UK check-in/gate staff clarifying matters by telephoning the destination airport to clarify documentation requirements with Border control at the arrival end..but sadly that's not always been possible.

Another fish business finding that milk and honey are not a great environment for piscine life.

twitter.com/bbcmartynoates/status/1327958985614495744?s=20