The Silence is Deafening

[Crankley]

For the last however long, I have read threads and posts by Remainers stating confidently that the Prime Minister wanted a No Deal, would get a No Deal. Here are just a few quotes. Some Remainers may recognise their own predictions:

'He is going to give us No Deal and then fuck off into the sunset with millons in bungs from his crooked mates,'

'I'm pretty certain on no deal...'

'I fully expect a No Deal Brexit.'

'Bojo will 'deliver' no deal and then F off into the sunset'

'Boris Johnson and your disingenuous divs - How dare you try and spin a NoDeal'

'He was elected to not get a deal and to make his supporters feel good about the fact the had stuck it to the man (or something).'

There are lots more if you want them.

Now he has obtained a deal, where are all the threads by remainers? Do any have the the guts to hold up their hand up and say 'I was wrong'?

[quote Peregrina]^>> So the UK gets just 2.32% more fish after Brexit

No, there are many Jewish E.European immigrants for a start. Indeed many of the U.K. Jewish community’s ancestors came originally from E.Europe, quite apart from newer arrivals.

And of course there are the Muslim majority countries in E.Europe, not yet in the EU.

There are quite a lot of Bosnians, Albanians, Bulgarians in the U.K., all of which have large Muslim populations (Albania 70%) along with parts of Russia.

You clearly have a particular xenophobic issue with E.Europeans. Trying to pass that off as due to their being white and Christian is not even remotely convincing.

Windrush was a dreadful and really stupid thing to cock up

Which is why the U.K. govt designed the settled status scheme to make sure that it brewed another Windrush style scandal.

Johnson has now come out and said he will deregulate.

I think that he might find that under the terms of the agreement he's just signed with the EU, that he can't without penalties.Who will he blame?

We've had plenty of deregulation - zero hours contracts, Tory MPs voting against legislation to make rented homes fit for habitation, and of course Grenfell. How does this help the 'levelling up' agenda?

Apparently he's doing it to help the levelling up agenda .

An acquaintance who is a landlord voted for Brexit for precisely this reason.

It should be measurable then, shouldn't it? Will it be? What will be the excuse in 3 1/2 years time when the next election rolls round? We couldn't do it because... Covid will be trotted out for one....

So no more EHIC from the 1/1/21 (despite what we thought) and the new GHIC (if or when it ever appears) will be for very serious medical conditions that would otherwise have made health insurance too expensive.

Another win, win for the UK.

I thought EHIC was supposed to last until your current card expired. Have they (UK) gone back on that already?

The problem is I think the rhetoric will be its too early to tell yet for quite a while. If Labour get in next time they will be blamed for not making a success of brexit. Which in my view will be impossible to do and yes I know others disagree.
The dilemma is - keep the Tories in and let them own their mess but risk whatever awful thing they'll do next or vote for something different knowing it will be almost impossible to make a silk purse.

@Peregrina

I thought EHIC was supposed to last until your current card expired. Have they (UK) gone back on that already?

Yes i thought that too, i even posted it!!

But it appears Gove says different, EHIC is for uk citizens already in the EU and for everyone else, its "take out comprehensive medical insurance"

The dilemma is - keep the Tories in and let them own their mess but risk whatever awful thing they'll do next or vote for something different knowing it will be almost impossible to make a silk purse

No dilemma here! vote tory and get more deregulation, lower taxes for the wealthy and an even looser relationship with the EU or vote Labour & have a closer relationship....

Has Gove actually read the agreement?

But it would be very very typical for them to trumpet it as a win, a concession made by the EU and then we find that no, it's yet another example of their lack of negotiating abilities.

EHIC: from the BBC, dated 26 Dec.

The deal on the future relationship between the EU and the UK was announced on 24 December. It says that all EHIC cards issued before the end of 2020 will be valid until their expiry date.

The actual EHIC (NHS) site is less clear.

Ours expire April 2021, and I can't see us going abroad before it expires

It won't really matter what the NHS website says. What will matter will be whether the health care provider in Spain/Greece/France..... takes one look at it and shakes their head.

DS lost his EHIC card and the replacement one didn’t turn up. Guess there’s no point in trying to replace it now, looking at the NHS website. I think rest of ours all expire early 2021 anyway (although I’ve always taken out full fat travel insurance for Europe on the basis that you don’t want to find out what EHIC doesn’t cover when you’re sat in A&E).

The point is we want the UK's immigration policy to be more inclusive of everyone to give people in other countries a chance to come here, be it for fruit picking or as professionals

You sound very nice and well meaning. I strongly suspect that you will be ulimately disappointed by the outcome if your aim for voting Brexit had been to open up the UK's immigration policy and be more 'inclusive'.

The points based system used in Australia or Canada has done nothing to open up their immigration channels. Rather, the points based systems makes it incredibly hard for people to immigrate to those countries. The UK's new system has every appearance of creating the same incredibly high hurdles to immigrate though that doesn't sound like what you wanted.

Just to add that many of those that I know who voted to Leave also regret it now that they know more about what it actually means, the economic impacts and mostly the opportunities that they've denied their children.

One was persuaded by a flyer that came through her door with dire warnings of the hordes of Turkish immigrants that would flood British public services if she didn't vote to Leave....

TatianaBis - you seem to find racism and xenophobia in everything I say! I really don't understand why you are determined to paint me like that. I have Polish relations who have married into my family and came to this country under FOM and love them to bits. The fact that people have immigrated to the UK from different parts of Europe in the past is well documented but we are talking about FOM. Many leavers felt this has skewed the influx of immigrants in different parts of the country and changed the way many companies recruit. Many people felt that businesses were getting ready trained trades people from Europe rather than bothering to train up and offer apprenticeships for local school leavers. Many people felt that some large online sales companies depended on paying minimum wage with minimum rights to immigrant workers as part of their business model. Some people saw many local homes turned into multi occupancy residences for the above workers making it almost impossible for a local family to afford the rent on such a home.

We need to change this and ensure that everybody is given a far whack at finding a trade, finding a reasonably priced home and that companies do not exploit workers from where ever they are from.
Mistigri - Your full of conspiracy theories aren't you! Obviously you think the Government want to have scandals like Windrush why would they? I really can't see the benefit. Settled status is far from perfect, I have a friend who became a single mother and had to stay home to look after her young family after a divorce, she now can't prove at the moment that she has 10 years employment to gain settled status so women are definitely penalised in this way which is daft.

To give her her credit, Corcory has said that about immigration since the very beginning.

It's obviously a completely stupid argument, and diametrically opposite to the reason most Leavers voted, but she has been consistent.

DrBlackbird, I haven't changed my mind and I don't know anyone else who has. I'm very pleased with the likes of the new Agricultural subsidies policy and it has removed the bias on large land owners and is now based on Environmental improvements to the land and it's use. Until I've seen the other new policies in detail I can't comment.

I don't doubt Corcory's sincerity for one moment. But things like training up our own staff has been a problem long before we were in the EEC/EU. Will we suddenly find employers start offering a rash of apprenticeships, or will we find that we can't find a plumber/electrician for love nor money? Or that hospitals now have an increased problem recruiting staff?

We did have the option to limit the amount of East Europeans from the newer entrants to the EU. The UK Government chose not to take up the option.

We do have laws about houses of multiple occupation - so the local authority agencies who could enforce these laws are starved of cash to do the job. Bear in mind that many Tory MP landlords were quite happy to vote against making rented properties fit for human habitation, which doesn't give the impression that they care too much about how fellow human beings live.

You may be able to see why I am a little cynical and see the current Tory administration start to develop a social conscience any time soon.

I have Polish relations who have married into my family and came to this country under FOM and love them to bits

And so they’re ok because they’re now your family but you want to stop other people having the same opportunity. Potentially other members of their families who might like to come too. You love them to bits and yet you voted Leave nonetheless. Hmmm.

Polish relations - who have a very good chance of being white Christians, given that many Poles are practicing Catholics.

@HannibalHayes

To give her her credit, Corcory has said that about immigration since the very beginning.

It's obviously a completely stupid argument, and diametrically opposite to the reason most Leavers voted, but she has been consistent.

Consistent bollocks is bollocks nonetheless.