Westminstenders: What the winds bring

[RedToothBrush]

The next few weeks are crucial. Eu talks, covid handling, the US election and any other unexpected events (its nearly November, lets face it will probably be the weather).

It feels a little like the car crash in slow motion is about to hit the wall of reality. I guess that just means all there is left to do is to brace for impact.

@OchonAgusOchonO

I'm in Ireland and I'm currently going through my cupboards to see what comes from GB. My plan is to source EU alternatives if possible or to stockpile if I can't. People were a bit at me stockpiling last time but more people seem to be doing it this time round.

Even the "buy local" fanbois would struggle to have cupboards full of UK only provisions. Which is a shame.

The problem is once a supply chain has been disrupted, it won't be a days work to put right. It could take months.

I'm not saying that most city centres will start to resemble the end if "Downfall". But if the makers of that film were planning a sequel, they could save a lot of money on sets and locations.

My only comfort @OchonAgusOchonO is that Ireland is more self sufficient for food than the UK. I don't blame you checking your cupboards and I'm sorry it's come to this.

@bellinisurge

My only comfort *@OchonAgusOchonO* is that Ireland is more self sufficient for food than the UK. I don't blame you checking your cupboards and I'm sorry it's come to this.

Also Ireland has the EU27 - the resources of a continent - to aid it, should it be needed.

@bellinisurge

My only comfort *@OchonAgusOchonO* is that Ireland is more self sufficient for food than the UK. I don't blame you checking your cupboards and I'm sorry it's come to this.

Thank you. Although we'll be a lot better off than those of you in the UK. The remain/non-tory voters have my sympathy.

@DGRossetti - Also Ireland has the EU27 - the resources of a continent - to aid it, should it be needed.

Absolutely. And I expect we will also get aid to help with reunification.

With my many dealings with work in the EU, most conversations these days have to begin with an apology - oh how far we have fallen in the eyes of the world. One of the many reasons @BigChocFrenzy posts often rung a bell; her perspective from Germany was enlightening.

All my colleagues here in France, particularly those who deal with Erasmus exchanges, are filled with intense sympathy for me, mingled with a kind of fascinated horror, as they observe what the UK is doing to itself.
(As well as to our students...)

Yes, I get the fascinated horror from my EU colleagues, with equal amounts of pity. Feeling particularly melancholy today, perhaps it's my age

@DGRossetti

Being a software hack, the lack of integration jumps out at me. Applying for permits really needs to be baked into whatever order and scheduling system hauliers are using so that it's handled automagically.

Where are the specs ? Up Boris Johnsons arse would be as good a reply as any.

You've missed an important point DGR. The permits are issued for a year and can only be used by one vehicle at a time.

The driver has to carry the actual paper permit and a handwritten log-book of his journeys with him.

The permits are issued for a year and can only be used by one vehicle at a time.
The driver has to carry the actual paper permit and a handwritten log-book of his journeys with him.
How will that work with drivers who mix and match which trailers they are pulling?
The whole point of articulated lorries
is that the tractor unit takes one route
and the trailers chop and change

You've missed an important point DGR. The permits are issued for a year and can only be used by one vehicle at a time.

The driver has to carry the actual paper permit and a handwritten log-book of his journeys with him.

I don't think I missed as much as HMG ...

Someone needs to point out the protocols for a lost/missing log book. Maybe it's an age thing, but I couldn't find it. While I doubt there would be the political or indeed physical will to seize non compliant vehicles and drivers, there is a lack of rebuttal that it might happen.

Also agencies will need to work out who pays for any extra time needed to clear checks. After all if I were a driver and I spent an extra day on a job because the office had fucked up the paperwork, then I'd want an extra days pay.

Thank you, Redtoothbrush especially, but to all the regular posters on this thread too. I was shocked to see that BigChoc had several deletions on a covid thread and assumed she had maybe made a mistake an asked for her posts to be deleted. It was very disappointing to hear that she has left the club.

I don't know if I can stand the awful suspense of the next fortnight: Jim Naughty reckons it might take a week to get the result of the American election as the postal vote is so large. And I think the current round of brexit negotiations is scheduled to finish tomorrow?

Regarding frozen food stockpiling I'm prioritising fruit and veg. In normal times I'd have a few bits of bought stuff and a lot of leftovers, especially soup and curries. But it's struck me that to maximise the amount of frozen hard-to-get food it makes more sense not to freeze things like soup that have a lot of added water! What a needlessly desperate situation.

PMK

[quote OchonAgusOchonO]**@DGRossetti* - Also Ireland has the EU27 - the resources of a continent - to aid it, should it be needed.*

Absolutely. And I expect we will also get aid to help with reunification.[/quote]

I think so too Ochon. I'm in the North and hope that we will be given some assistance when it is time for the reunification of our country. I hope all parts of Ireland aren't too badly hit. Frightening times.

Lets aspire to being China.

I suppose at least everyone on these threads could contribute to problems with shortages of transplant organs.

I don’t agree with that.
Yes China is a dictatorship. And yes that means that some measures (such as self isolation) can. Be put in place much more easily.
And yes China isn’t always transparent but the. WHO itself agrees that the numbers China provided are more or less reflecting the situation.

The reality is they’ve put measures into place and came down HARD right at the start. Now they have a system to follow any new cases to stop it into its track. Which you can do when you are not completely swamped under new cases.
And no it’s not just China. New Zealand, Singapore, Japan, South Korea and recently Victoria in Australia have done the same thing. They are not a dictatorship and Victoria has had many many cases the cost time round too.

We need to stop finding excuses as to why we can’t do as well as other countries.
Just doing as well as germany would be a start tbh.

An excellent explanation as to why leaving the EU will always be detrimental in an economic ont of view. I wish these people had been heard at the tI the referendum.

twitter.com/femi_sorry/status/1320721046358642689?s=21

And for those say that brexit hasn’t been an issue so far, have a look at his graph and in particular what happens around 2016 both for Britain and for the US.
The vote for brexit impacted on the U.K. economy straight away. And so did the election of Trump.... (Really Nice moving graph!)

twitter.com/th3j35t3r/status/1320578321562951680?s=21

Meuniere
I'd trust the WHO more if it would admit that Taiwan got it right better and quicker than China
and then admitted Taiwan

New Zealand was able to isolate itself from the world and has a population smaller than London.
Singapore and Japan had the experience of SARS and are more used to mask wearing.

Germany and France and Spain are more comparable to the UK
in connectivity, diversity and density
and all are now facing problems

The UK government have been shit
but you have to compare like with like

I’ve been reading that thread with interest regarding the north vs south divide with Covid
twitter.com/felly500/status/1320290057496965121?s=21

One thing I’m taking form that is the fact all the policies were planned around London and the lockdown was lifted too early for the north (but probably aAt the right time for the south). The fact that policies are often so london centric has affected decision again and at the detriment of the north.....

London had earlier peak (more concentrated pop, more connected city, travel related seeding) but had subsided to lower level of infection than rest of country (particularly north) by mid June

Argument was lockdown end was timed to epidemic curve in London

Plus of course issues with the social environment and the type of jobs (more people can work from home in London), issues with track and trace system in the north etc....

The UK government have been shit but you have to compare like with like

Well first off, you'd need to find somewhere as shit as the UK.

Anyway, these are the Brexit threads. Brexit logic is that any comparison is valid when it supports your argument while by the same token any comparison is also valid when it rubbishes your argument.

Did I say "logic" I meant "dogma". Damn this autocollect.

I think it’s too easy to say ‘but we are different!!!!’

The point is it is possible. Maybe we can’t go about doing that the same way. I’m not saying we should. I’m saying that we should change our attitude, the way we look at things and move in from ‘it’s so hard. No one else in Europe manages anyway so there is no way we will’ to a situation where we finally accept that actually we CAN control this virus if we put our acts together and take the right decisions.

FWIW atm I think that this virus will be endemic. I think we will somehow control it with vaccines the same way we do with the flu. With a bit of luck, mutations will make it less dangerous, like the Spanish flu became less dangerous.
But i think it’s time to
1- learn from our mistake and have system in place. If countries who have had to face SARS have learnt from that one epidemic, surely we should be bale to learn how to deal with that situation from the first wave and have things in place for the second and subsequent? waves??

2- have something that will allow us to control this virus but also any other virus that WILL come our way. I suspect that if it’s not Covid it will be another virus that will come and disturb our lifes again.

Lastly, imagine if China had taken the same attitude than our governments did. Imagine they had no control of the virus and it had spread all over China (fwiw I have no idea if muslims put in prison in China are in the Wuhan area. As a guess, seeing the size of the country, they’re not which makes them much less likely to have been infected. We need to be very careful about our assumptions and assertions there).
Imagine China had an uncontrolled virus in their country.

What would the reactions in the West be? I imagine very harsh comments about how China is putting all countries in dangers etc etc. How they don’t care. Can’t be bothered to do the minimum etc....
Why can’t we expect the same from ourselves than we would expect from China?

And as if by magic ...

www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-10-27/key-brexit-software-won-t-be-ready-on-time-developers-warn

Vital software needed to keep goods flowing after Brexit won’t be ready in time because the U.K. government has not given developers the information they need, according to a trade group.

(contd)

no amount of Agile or Scrummaster ceremonies can whistle up the information needed to make things work.

I'm idly wondering how many systems are so old, nobody knows how to modify them anymore ?

Sorry that was very long

Brexit used to annoy me. Now I think I’m quite immune to it.
But Covid and the incompetence, laissez faire and level of corruption is making me so ANGRY (yes I know, I’m shouting again....).

I must admit, one thing the internet has done, is revive the art of political cartoons ... Gillray would be proud.

DGR did anyone think said software would be ready???.

I’m wondering how companies and HMRC are supposed to deal with brexit if the software just doesn’t exist.....

Why can’t we expect the same from ourselves than we would expect from China?

Because they is foreign ?