Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westminstenders: Pah International Law. Who needs it?

978 replies

RedToothBrush · 12/09/2020 18:09

I mean its not as if trade deals and human rights are relevant is it?

(sorry eating my dinner so must be brief)

OP posts:
Thread gallery
69
titchy · 16/09/2020 09:08

Maybe they're confusing the word 'beta' for 'better'?

SabrinaThwaite · 16/09/2020 09:10

DH used to beta test specialist software. If the Smart Freight system is at the same level of development then it’s going to be interesting.

prettybird · 16/09/2020 09:12

@titchy

Maybe they're confusing the word 'beta' for 'better'?
Grin Nothing would surprise me Wink
ICouldHaveCheckedFirst · 16/09/2020 09:14

Alondra that's an excellent piece. Thanks for sharing. It deserves a wider audience.

SabrinaThwaite · 16/09/2020 09:16

Haha - just saw “truck and trace - it’s going to be world beating”.

ICouldHaveCheckedFirst · 16/09/2020 09:18

Sabrina that's alarming, if true (which it probably is Sad) . What's the source? Surely the logistics industry won't swallow that story?

prettybird · 16/09/2020 09:20

Poor BJ: PMQs and an appearance before the Liaison Committee today Wink

Who knew being PM would be such hard work? Grin

SabrinaThwaite · 16/09/2020 09:28

Source for the beta version gaslighting is the BBC:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-54172222

SabrinaThwaite · 16/09/2020 09:29

Keir Starmer still waiting on relative’s Covid test results.

Today is PMQs.

Are these related?

prettybird · 16/09/2020 09:29

True gaslighting Angry

RedToothBrush · 16/09/2020 09:47

My favourite story of the day so far:

Peter Thal Larson @peter_tl
Just one paragraph in a great deep dive into the UK company that claims to have invented a 20-second coronavirus test
Is the company with a 20-second coronavirus test for real by @AnnaSophieGross and @jemimajoanna^

Westminstenders: Pah International Law. Who needs it?
OP posts:
DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 10:09

Gaslighting ? You ain't seen nothing yet.

www.thenational.scot/news/18723127.tory-claims-brandon-lewis-answered-wrong-question-saying-brexit-deal-breaks-law/

Tory claims Brandon Lewis 'answered wrong question' in saying Brexit deal breaks law

NORTHERN Ireland Secretary Brandon Lewis “answered the wrong question” when he said a move to override key parts of the Brexit divorce deal would break international law, according the Tory Advocate General for Scotland.

The UK Internal Market Bill – which gives ministers the power to overwrite provisions in the Withdrawal Agreement relating to Northern Ireland – does not “constitute a breach of international law or of the rule of law”, Richard Keen told peers.

However, the Tory frontbencher’s claim led to cries of derision from the opposition benches in the House of Lords.

In unusually strong language for the upper chamber, he was accused of having talked “a load of rubbish” in arguing that it did not constitute a breach.

The spat came after Lewis sparked a backlash in admitting steps being taken by the Government in relation to the Withdrawal Agreement would break international law in a “specific and limited way”.

READ MORE: Brandon Lewis admits Boris Johnson's Brexit plan will break international law

Tackling the Government at Westminster, Tory peer Lord Lexden said: “Is it not difficult to retain confidence in the Lord Chancellor and the law officers of the Crown when they acquiesce in the Government’s declaration of a willingness to break international law.

“Are they not charged, these officers of the Crown, with responsibility for ensuring that ministers respect the rule of law – national and international – in all circumstances?

“A duty with which permitting threats to break it are hardly compatible.”

But Lord Keen said: “In my opinion, the present Bill does not of itself constitute a breach of international law or of the rule of law.”

Labour’s shadow attorney general Lord Falconer of Thoroton said: “The key characteristic for law officers is not brains – they can get all the advice they want from the English bar of lawyers – it is backbone.”

The Northern Ireland Secretary had confirmed the legislation going through Parliament was a breach of international law, while Lord Keen had “produced a load of rubbish” to peers to claim it was not, said the opposition frontbencher.

Lord Falconer said: “The party that changes its story on law as this Government does shows it lacks backbone.

“How does the Advocate General feel able consistent with personal honour and professional duty to remain as the Advocate General?”

However, responding Lord Keen said: “I have satisfied myself as to the correct legal position in this context.

“It is my view that the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland essentially answered the wrong question.”

His words sparked groans of dissent and Lord Falconer could be heard to cry in exasperation: “For goodness sake – he is a Cabinet minister.”

Lord Keen responded: “I hope he has not become unwell in view of the noises emanating from him. But if he has, I wish him well for the future.”

He added: “We are in a situation in which we have rights under an international treaty. Those rights include our response to any breach of obligations by the counter-party, be that a lack of good faith or such action as would fundamentally alter the obligations under the treaty giving rise to a position… where we could withhold our operation of the treaty.”

READ MORE: Alison Thewliss corrects Michael Gove on claim water and NHS not in power grab

Tory former solicitor general Lord Garnier said: “The Bill that we are considering disapplies sections of a treaty which we have freely entered into.”

He questioned “how does that fit” with the first duty of the law officer being to uphold the rule of law.

Lord Keen said: “As regards the present Bill, it is designed to provide for a contingency which will only operate in the event of us having to respond to a material breach or a fundamental change in obligations and then only by bringing forward regulations that will require the approval of this House.

“Unless and until that occurs, there is no breach of the treaty. There is simply a means by which the treaty obligations can be addressed in the event of a breach.”

It comes as Lord Keen was told to prove he is a man “of integrity and honour” and resign from Boris Johnson's “law-breaking administration”.

READ MORE: More pressure on Richard Keen to quit over illegal Internal Market Bill

In a savage editorial, Scottish Legal News, urges Lord Keen to disassociate himself from “the charlatans at No 10 Downing Street”.

The highly respected magazine, which is sent to just about every lawyer and solicitor in Scotland, says that failure to do so would “endorse reckless and lawless behaviour that will tarnish Britain’s reputation and ultimately that of those associated with it.”

DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 10:10

and ...

Westminstenders: Pah International Law. Who needs it?
DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 10:15

www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/congressmen-warn-boris-no-free-trade-deal-if-you-break-good-friday-agreement-for-brexit/16/09/

Senior US politicians have warned Boris Johnson that Washington will not support any free trade pact with the UK if Britain fails to uphold its commitments to Northern Ireland as part of Brexit.

The UK Internal Market Bill cleared its first Commons hurdle on Monday despite deep misgivings by some senior Tories, with amendments to the Northern Ireland provisions expected to emerge in the Commons next week.

Four US congressmen, led by chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee Eliot Engel, have written to Mr Johnson urging the Government to respect its open border and peace process with Northern Ireland.

(contd)

I notice it's slowly creeping upwards ... there is the potential for "What would you do about the GFA ?" to appear in questions to candidate. Something I don't think either side would thank Boris for.

hanahsaunt · 16/09/2020 10:24

My MP (tory sheep) wrote to me to say that yes he did vote for the oven-ready deal and he did vote for the internal market bill. Apparently it's all the EU's fault for not playing nicely and giving BoJo what he wants so he had no choice ...

DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 10:25

I'm guessing the vague reporting around the Wylfa Newydd project on Anglesey is because they haven't yet worked out what lie to tell, since it seems very suspicious timing that Hitachi bail after the much celebrated UK-Japan trade "deal"

This is where experts are needed (real ones) as I have no idea (which is still more than Johnson, Truss, Cummings, Raab and Patel combined) how Japanese regulation works.

Is it possible that Hitachis own compliance people pulled the plug ? Or did the Japanese government intervene ?

Given that it's guaranteed we all know this deal would have been "breaking news" and splashed over the state broadcaster in 30-point font for the next day if the situation were reversed, I think it's fair to pick over it with the same vigour.

DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 10:26

@hanahsaunt

My MP (tory sheep) wrote to me to say that yes he did vote for the oven-ready deal and he did vote for the internal market bill. Apparently it's all the EU's fault for not playing nicely and giving BoJo what he wants so he had no choice ...
Someone should break into his house and nick all his stuff. That's a jury I'd like to be on ....
DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 10:50

Makes sense - while the UK is looking elsewhere ...

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/16/barbados-revives-plan-to-remove-queen-as-head-of-state-and-become-a-republic

prettybird · 16/09/2020 10:51

That saliva test, with it being dropped into a black box which will give the result in 20 seconds, reminded me of this story....

The story of the fake bomb detectors
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-29459896

DrBlackbird · 16/09/2020 10:52

@ICouldHaveCheckedFirst

Alondra that's an excellent piece. Thanks for sharing. It deserves a wider audience.
Just wanted to say 'ditto' to thanks for sharing.

What is notable but not surprising is how measured and intelligent that piece of writing is in summing up the Brexit process in comparison to just about anything we read here in the UK. Depressing.

Reckless, megalomaniac, toddlers are in charge of this government and most of the press.

Except that, this is leading to massive transfers of wealth from all of us (one way or another) to a select few billionaires. They're having the last laugh all the way to their tropical islands complete with bunkers.

DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 11:15

It will be interesting to see if the provos have suffered the same loss of skills the British have in politics. My guess would be if so, less so, since they aren't the morons that led us here.

foreignpolicy.com/2020/09/14/brexit-ira-northern-ireland-militancy/

As Britain threatens to unilaterally ruin the border agreement in Northern Ireland, undermining the Good Friday deal that brought an end to the long nightmare of political violence, the threat of militant republicanism is growing again. The enduring threat of militant republicanism in Ireland was brought forcefully to public attention in August, after a massive crackdown on the paramilitary New Irish Republican Army (New IRA) led to nearly a dozen arrests on terrorism-related charges and serious rioting. If Brexit talks fail, worse is likely to follow, and the ranks of the New IRA and other groups may swell.

(contd)

DGRossetti · 16/09/2020 11:28

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/no-deal-brexit-could-trigger-22683709

A queue 7,000 lorries long could build up at Britain’s Channel ports in the event of a no-deal Brexit, according to a leaked government assessment.

The official estimate of the delays to cross into the EU comes amid warnings from trade unions and business that ports would be plunged into “chaos and confusion” in the New Year unless customs systems and lorry parks are completed.

(contd)

ICouldHaveCheckedFirst · 16/09/2020 11:49

DGR can students now use the defence if "I answered the wrong question" as the basis of exam appeals?

2+2=5

BigChocFrenzy · 16/09/2020 11:50

"'Beta service'

falls over laughing"

Confused 🤦🏻‍♀️ Sums it up

As does that article from Spain"

"But the message that the British Government is sending these days to the rest of the globe is that
no one will be able to close a deal with them with the peace of mind that the agreement will not blow up later.
*

OchonAgusOchonO · 16/09/2020 11:52

@DGRossetti

It will be interesting to see if the provos have suffered the same loss of skills the British have in politics. My guess would be if so, less so, since they aren't the morons that led us here.

foreignpolicy.com/2020/09/14/brexit-ira-northern-ireland-militancy/

As Britain threatens to unilaterally ruin the border agreement in Northern Ireland, undermining the Good Friday deal that brought an end to the long nightmare of political violence, the threat of militant republicanism is growing again. The enduring threat of militant republicanism in Ireland was brought forcefully to public attention in August, after a massive crackdown on the paramilitary New Irish Republican Army (New IRA) led to nearly a dozen arrests on terrorism-related charges and serious rioting. If Brexit talks fail, worse is likely to follow, and the ranks of the New IRA and other groups may swell.

(contd)

It's important not to forget the loyalist paramilitaries. The harder the brexit and the further the UK diverge from the EU, the wider the gap between NI and GB (that is of course assuming they actually comply with the WA) and the harder the border in the Irish Sea.

The loyalists have previously limited their activities to the island of Ireland. If they see the British selling them out, I wouldn't be too sure they wouldn't start up a campaign in Britain. These lads are not the ones benefitting from the SM and the CU so have no skin in that game.