Westministenders: Can you tell your Rs from Elbows?

[RedToothBrush]

This week Mark Sedwill has resigned (or was he pushed?) and David Frost (chief brexit lead) was appointed National Security Adviser in a move that enraged Theresa May. The former prime minister felt that his appointment was unprofessional and that was a political appointment not an independent one and that he lacked experience. Of course in terms of national security we still haven't had that report on Russia and I don't believe The Intelligence and Security Committee has yet been named (not sat since Johnson was appointed as PM).

We have passed the deadline for extending transition and we have now apparently said that negotiations on the end of transition will finish at the end of September.

The bill ending Free movement of people has been signed, amongst much fanfare by the Conservatives saying they have delivered on the Referendum promise. However we might have up to 3million Hong Kongers who we are willing to allow into the country which might not go down too well with those who were unhappy with 'unrestricted EU immigration'.

We also have the demonstration of utter incompetence, outsourcing and lack of coordination and communication from central government and local government in the covid-19 crisis. A national scandal that isn't being properly reported by the press and leave you with the very large question of who is this government serving? If its contract with Deloittes over testing didn't require them to report positive tests to Public Health England, what was the point in the testing? How can this be consistent with 'The Government’s new approach to biosecurity will bring together the UK’s world-leading epidemiological expertise and fuse it with the best analytical capability from across Government in an integrated approach.' and will provide real time analysis and assessment of infection outbreaks at a community level, to enable rapid intervention before outbreaks grow.?

The growing feeling that Brexit is being exploited by this government for personal interests and those of big business at the expense of the general public is one which was feared and grows harder to argue against by the day.

Here's a poll for Cendrillion

www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/11/competent-likeable-decisive-keir-starmer-beating-boris-johnson-on-all-counts

www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v42/n14/pankaj-mishra/flailing-states

The chimera of Anglo-American 'democracy'/ the dustbin of history.

Long and very interesting essay on the very sorry state of the US and UK and all things Anglo-American, hubris, national narcissism, and dead end narratives.

I'm shocked that in that Observer Poll, there is still a net 4% of respondents who think that BJ has the nation's best interests at heart

Excellent article mathanxiety - it covers almost all the topics that ds rants about to us has been pointing out to us, as well as tying in to a lot of the economic disquiet I have felt ever since completing my Economics degree in the early 80s at the growth of Friedman's monetarist/neoliberal economics at the expense of Keynesian economics.

Jason118
Thanks Clavinova for the extracts from the express, I needed a laugh.

That's OK - I confess I was laughing myself as I was typing ( mischievous laughter linking to the Express) - although I genuinely believe that the UK is in a much better negotiating position than before - and also that negotiations will continue right up until the last minute.

HoneysuckIejasmine
Here's a poll for Cendrillion

Are you mixing me up with another poster?

From your link;

"The main downside for Labour, however, is that Starmer and his shadow chancellor Anneliese Dodds are still well behind the Tory leadership team of Johnson and the chancellor, Rishi Sunak, when it comes to economic competence and people’s faith in Labour’s ability to run the economy: 42% said they favoured Johnson and Sunak against 26% for Starmer and Dodds."

"Laura Parker, the former national coordinator of Momentum, the grassroots group set up to support Corbyn’s leadership, said that while there had been aspects of Starmer’s early leadership with which some party members had been very unhappy, including his response to the Black Lives Matter movement and the sacking of Rebecca Long-Bailey, there was now a willingness across the party to work with him.That would continue, she said, unless he backed away from the radical manifesto on which he fought the leadership election."

"The EU has realised the "negotiating leverage has dramatically shifted" and the UK is no longer a "soft touch", according to Brexit Party chairman Richard Tice."

I love this - those who do know what is happening, i.e. the Government, have now suddenly started panic buying up a vacant piece of land (any old piece of land nearby served) to build the Customs sheds they should have started building 4 years ago. This is strange behaviour for something which has shifted the Brexiters' way. We hold all the cards, remember, easiest deals in history, done in an afternoon over a cup of tea?

We hold all the cards

To be fair, I think Michael Gove's quote relates directly to the triggering of Article 50 - it was in the UK's power when to trigger Article 50.

the Government, have now suddenly started panic buying up a vacant piece of land (any old piece of land nearby served)

I'm still not sure why Ashford was such a surprise - Damian Green here September 2019;

www.kentonline.co.uk/ashford/news/junction-wont-open-until-after-brexit-212576/
www.kentonline.co.uk/ashford/news/lorry-plan-will-delay-m20-junction-213377/

I would imagine though, that even at the very last minute, it would still be possible to extend the Transition period.

Lots of things are possible that will never happen. The UK needs to go cold turkey. No more "just one last drink ..." for this addict.

Luckily we have Farage as the conscience of Brexit, ever ready to return - like Arthur of legend - if his country needs him.

*I would imagine though, that even at the very last minute, it would still be possible to extend the Transition period.
*
Unfortunately this is practically and legally almost impossible.

It's clear that the penny has finally dropped. I said on here about 3.5 years ago that the government buying up land near Dover would be a sign that they were serious about Brexit. I was wrong in some ways (I thought that the govt not starting customs projects was a sign that they were quietly planning a soft Brexit), but right in the sense that buying up land is a sign that they have finally been forced to get serious.

It is very late in the day though and there is no chance of this project being delivered by July 2021.

People on twitter are calling it the Farage Garage btw.

Quotes

I don't see any specifying that it was only A50 being triggered in Gove's quote. I really do think they thought that they could carry on whining and whining for special deals and pay less and less and cold reality is now beginning to dawn upon them. The German car industry hasn't yet come to their rescue which they thought it would.

Unfortunately this is practically and legally almost impossible.

Many things are possible if the political will is there. At the moment, the political will is most certainly not there. We have to remember that Johnson wants to be popular.

We will see how Kent being turned into a giant traffic jam plays out. I don't know how long "Corbyn would have been worse" will hold as an excuse. Less so I would have thought in areas which always return Tory MPs.

May I propose a Westminstenders version of Godwins law ?

Any poster that relies on a statement from Boris Johnson - a man who has been sacked twice for lying, has been caught many times lying to cameras present and is a proven cheat - is rightly ignored ?

That's it really ?

There's simply no value in repeated a single word he says, apart from to waste comprehension time ... even in the preceding few posts about pesticides and food standards it's easy to forget Boris promise about no paperwork in Northern Ireland.

With a level of bullshit like that behind him, the only use for "Boris" is as a novel sort of punctuation device to separate one lie from another.

Those in favour: ? (aye )

Aye.

I don't see any specifying that it was only A50 being triggered in Gove's quote.

"The day after we vote to leave we hold all the cards and we can choose the path we want." ...

"when Britain votes to leave nothing in itself changes overnight, so the process and pace of change is in our hands.There is no arbitrary deadline which we must meet to secure our future - and indeed no arbitrary existing “model” which we have to accept in order to prosper" ....

Andrew Duff - Lib Dem politician/MEP -

"Mr Gove asserted that the UK will not have to trigger Article 50 of the Treaty on European Union, the secession clause, in the event of a Leave vote.“The process of change is in our hands”, he says. “It has been argued that the moment Britain votes to leave a process known as ‘Article 50’ is triggered whereby the clock starts ticking and every aspect of any new arrangement with the EU must be concluded within 2 years of that vote being recorded–or else…"

"He continues: “But there is no requirement for that to occur–quite the opposite. Logically, in the days after a Vote to Leave the Prime Minister would discuss the way ahead with the Cabinet and consult Parliament before taking any significant step. Preliminary, informal, conversations would take place with the EU to explore how best to proceed. It would not be in any nation’s interest artificially to accelerate the process and no responsible government would hit the start button on a two-year legal process without preparing appropriately....We can set the pace.”

"Well, Prime Minister David Cameron has said that he will immediately trigger the Article 50 process if the referendum votes to leave. So one assumes that Mr Gove and his colleagues already have plans to hustle Mr Cameron out of Downing Street as soon as their victory (and his disgrace) is declared.What will happen next?"

andrewduff.blogactiv.eu/2016/04/19/michael-gove-article-50-and-the-pigeons/

I must confess when Gove wittered about 'We hold all the cards' I thought he meant that the world would come beating a path to our door. I didn't think he meant 'We are holding a gun to our head, and will decided when to pull the trigger.'

Silly me.

Aye

I'm still not sure why Ashford was such a surprise - Damian Green here September 2019;

Presumably because this is at a different site and larger in scope.

Peregrina
I didn't think he meant 'We are holding a gun to our head, and will decide when to pull the trigger.'

This won't cheer you up (from HoneysuckIejasmine's poll ) - LibDems down 2%;

Opinium/Observer latest voting intention:

CON: 42% (+1)
LAB: 38% (+1)
LDM: 6% (-2)
SNP: 6% (+1)
GRN: 4% (=)

8-9 July
(Changes with 1 July)

No, Clavinova, I am not mixing you up for Cendrillion. That's why I said "here's a poll for Cendrillion". It's not always about you, you know.

As far as I am concerned anything which shows that Johnson and Cummings are doing their best to wreck the Tory party is good news.

From the same link, curious that you didn't copy and paste the next bit...

Labour now stands four points behind the Conservatives overall, with the Tories on 42%, Labour on 38% and the Liberal Democrats on 6%. But this represents a remarkable turnaround from the end of March, just after Johnson announced a full lockdown and days before Starmer took charge, when the Tories were on 54%, 26 points ahead of Labour on 28%

So, Tories down 12% and Labour up 10%, since late March?

Prime ministers invariably grow paranoid about any cabinet colleague who is talked up as an heir apparent

but BJ has not yet recovered whatever drive he once had and needs Rishi

• who has looked a classy act from his first appearance.

V good self-marketing by Rishi, but he has the advantage of standing out as the only Cabinet mInister with the talent to do his job well

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jul/12/rishi-sunak-is-an-unwelcome-reminder-to-boris-johnson-of-his-political-mortality

Sitting on the Commons frontbench while the golden boy had his latest day in the sun,
the prime minister’s leg jiggled uncontrollably as he chuntered “absolutely right”.

He has to live with it for the moment because Rishi Sunak is the one senior minister whom Tory MPs regard as unsackable.
The chancellor is the only member of an otherwise floundering government who is widely judged to have had a good coronavirus crisis.

curious that you didn't copy and paste the next bit

Curious that the Guardian's headline is;

"Keir Starmer beating Boris Johnson on all counts."

But not this count;
"Starmer and his shadow chancellor Anneliese Dodds are still well behind the Tory leadership team of Johnson and the chancellor, Rishi Sunak, when it comes to economic competence and people’s faith in Labour’s ability to run the economy: 42% said they favoured Johnson and Sunak against 26% for Starmer and Dodds."

Or this count;
"Two weeks ago, Opinium found more people cited Starmer as their preferred choice as prime minister (37%) than Boris Johnson (35%)."

Two weeks ago?? The same question this week;

Boris Johnson 36%, Keir Starmer 33%;

Data tables here;
www.opinium.com/resource-center/public-opinion-on-coronavirus-9th-july/

Opinium on Twitter;
"While on the whole Starmer is being perceived in a positive light, only 36% of the public believe Labour is ready for government. Labour’s old Red Wall remains an issue. 60% of Red Wall voters think the Party is not ready to go back into government."