Westministenders: The Truth Isn't A Made Up Concept

[RedToothBrush]

“In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”

Not George Orwell but often attributed to him. But a powerful statement with resonance nonetheless

I've a friend born in the early 80s. Canadian but her childhood was lived mostly in Missouri. When she moved back to Canada for college she was horrified. The quality of the news media in Canada gave her a huge realisation of her own ignorance due to the narrow world view inflicted on her in the States. She worked pretty hard to rectify it, and continues to live in CA now.

Dh (Glaswegian) worked in the States in the 80s before I knew him

He loves to tell the stories of how he'd get asked, "Are there McDonalds in Scotland?" or "Do you get Paisley pattern in Scotland?" ....but also how he still regrets not thinking of the answer that one of his work colleagues' wives gave when she was over, "Yes, and we have inside toilets too!"

In the 70's in New York there were Noraid fundraiser posters on many lamp posts

It was the accepted thing to look through black people.
Black staff either had a surname or a first name but never both

Its only since 2000 that stores in the US had to accept out of state checks

Its a different world

About 30 years ago I was friends with an American woman. She was well educated, worked in a senior non-medical role at a hospital.

Her ignorance of the world was astounding. Despite living only 20 miles from the Canada-US border, she thought that Canada was east of the US. She once asked me if London was near England.

She was under the impression that in WWII, the US was fighting alone against Russia and the Nazis, and... Germany was ... well, a sort of bystander.

In some ways, this is understandable. In general, you either learn something formally, or you pick it up through reading and the culture you live in. As far as I gather, the in-school teaching of history and geography is totally US-oriented. I was born in England, and history at school was England-oriented. If you asked me about Italian history, or Turkish history, I'd be pretty lost.

I also have the impression that for most Americans that non-Americans are are irrelevant to the point of almost being non-existent.

By the way, for context, two of my grandchildren are Americans.

My best American idiot anecdote is on a trick to see a friend in San Francisco. My friend was working and so I sat in the car whilst he made some visits outside the city. We were not out in the stick by any means.

Anyway we stopped at a record shop at one point and we got talking to a few people at the counter. My friend still had parts of his strong Manc accent but it had faded. My accent is northern but certainly not strong at all. Anyway several of them couldn't understand what I was saying. They asked me what country I was from. So I said. They asked me what my first language was (yes this was a genuine question)! I said "er English. I only speak English" Which completely baffled them. They thought everyone from the UK spoke in RP English. They had never heard a regional accent before. At first we thought they were on the wind up. Even my friend was surprised.

We then had the usual conversation about London, and not being from there. So we tried to work out where they did know. We got as far as saying Liverpool were there Beatles were from. Then we started to talk about Wales. Omg. Trying to explain that most people spoke English but they also spoke Welsh was something else. They thought we were making it up and that Wales was in India.

I've met some very worldly Americans but the contrast to that has to experienced to really fully grasped. A record shop just outside San Francisco isn't where I'd expect to find it either - with cultural influences from around the world.

I've met some very worldly Americans but the contrast to that has to experienced to really fully grasped. A record shop just outside San Francisco isn't where I'd expect to find it either - with cultural influences from around the world.

There's a whole genre of YouTube channels with Americans commenting on their visits to the UK and the things they really struggle with.

My friends first job was in Louisiana - Houma (about 60m from New Orleans). One weekend he bought some postcards and his boss said "Oh, just give them to "whoever" in the post room.". My friend did, and she was ... startled at some of the Mardi Gras images on them. Turned out she'd never left Houma, let alone Louisiana. She'd only heard about New Orleans.

This was 1990.

In the same trip, my friend was chatting with some colleagues in his first week, and they said there were bars in Houma. My friend confusedly said he'd counted more. That confused them, until he told them where he'd seen them. They didn't count because they were n*** bars.

This was 1990.

Mind you, a year earlier I was after hours getting to a pub in Westcliffe (for a wedding next day) and the landlord declared it was "OK to serve you, you're not black.".

Sometimes you simply can't respond to racism because it takes your breath away.

My favourite anecdote took place in the late 80s/early 90s, when I overheard two American tourists in Princes Street Gardens gazing at and discussing Edinburgh Castle, which they agreed was fairly impressive.
They were a bit surprised that it had been built so close to the railway line, though.

"Are there McDonalds in Scotland?"

A family-run cafe of that name in Scotland received a cease and desist letter from the US Corporation, and got the head of the Clan McDonald to write back threatening to sue the US Corporation in turn.

They were a bit surprised that Edinburgh Castle had been built so close to the railway line....

Nancy Reagan allegedly asked why they built Windsor Castle so close to the airport.

There was also the London Olympics opening ceremony, featuring Tim Berners-Lee recreating the moment when he turned on the World Wide Web. NBC were baffled and went to a commercial break.

when I overheard two American tourists in Princes Street Gardens gazing at and discussing Edinburgh Castle, which they agreed was fairly impressive.

Eddie Izzard about EuroDisney ...

you'll have to make it a bit bigger. They've got real castles over there...

It's understandable that people don't know about the history of every country in the world. I think that schoolchildren should at least be taught something about 1 other country's history. Eg at GCSE they can learn about 20th century Russia, America or China. It teaches them that other countries exist / co-exist!

Why don't those people understand English?
Because they are Spanish
But Hispanics at home speak English

Ah, the joy of Americans visiting Europe for the first time

I think that schoolchildren should at least be taught something about 1 other country's history.

As long as it's the "right" sort of history, of course.

To be fair I've heard my fair share of stupidity from Brits.
My favorite being when we were on a flooded lead mine tour and a English passenger in the boat asked when the tunnels had been discovered.

That said the USA isn't the most outward looking country.
Upon discovering I came from Scotland a couple of years ago to the USA a social worker in court making pleasant chitchat as we waited to go into court on a joint case asked me if I had learned English on arrival to the USA.
I was slightly taken aback by this and said no Scots used English.

I think a US Court ruled that Spanish people from Spain are not Hispanic for the purposes of affirmative action.

I remember being asked in Vail whether Scotland was close to England

But to give the other side of the story, on the same holiday (which coincided with Operation Desert Storm in 1991) I remember nearly falling off the chair lift when the American who was on it with me (the way the US does ski lines means that you often get on with random people rather than your friends) turned and asked me, "So what do you think of Margaret Thatcher's approach to the ERM?"

midwestsummer
Back in 1990 I was complimented by my doctor's receptionist on how well my English was coming on. I smiled modestly and said, 'Thank you. I practice'.

prettybird I think there is a small (but imo growing) group of Americans who are very well informed, and a group who are aware of the existence of other countries and know a little about them mainly thanks to movies or looking up where their ancestors came from, and then a huge group consisting of The Rest whose assumptions will knock you flat every time.

Mind you, I have come across some real corkers here when it comes to Brits' opinions of America.

Nancy Reagan allegedly asked why they built Windsor Castle so close to the airport.

And it's all coming back to me now. On that visit in 1984, she also wanted 'orphans,' as in Oliver Twist which she assumed was a contemporary documentary. A bit awkward. We were fresh out. Orphans were off. So they put the call out to Italia Conti and Sylvia Young to send their students to play the part on a trip to London Zoo, where they posed with the First Lady.

Some of them are very well known and sucessful today.

Nancy Reagan allegedly asked why they built Windsor Castle so close to the airport.

Her madge should have said it was on advice of the Court Astrologer.