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Brexit

Westministenders: Crisis, which crisis ?

982 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 29/02/2020 18:25

Main crises facing the government:

. Negotiating a Brexit deal with the EU
. Coronoavirus
. Floods
. Allegations of some ministers - and Cummings - bullying civil servants
. More trouble threatened from Turkey / Syria

Unfortunately with all these parallel crises, we have a workshy lying arse as PM
and the worst collection yet of incompetents in Cabinet
who seem to have decided on a strategy of bullying their civil servants to avoid hearing any facts that don't fit with current Tory party ideology

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24
Clavinova · 10/03/2020 13:12

Remember that suppressed Russian report before the GE

"Downing Street cleared the document after the election. It claims the final document contains little new information and is underwhelming–although others who have read it disagree."

Downing Street might be right - e.g. naming Adrian Flook as an employee of CTF Partners, "who was the MP for Taunton from 2001-2005 and served on theCulture, Media and Sport Select Committee" is certainly underwhelming.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 13:48

Coronavirus: ‘Terrified’ Trump fears journalists will deliberately get disease to pass it on to him, report claims

‘He’s just now waking up to the fact that this is bad, and he doesn’t know how to respond’

Donald Trump has reportedly been “melting down” over coronavirus and fears journalists might try to deliberately get the disease in order to pass it on to him.

The president has repeatedly tried to downplay concerns about Covid-19 in recent weeks as his administration has struggled to manage the US outbreak and its effect on global stock markets.

In public, his administration has insisted the virus is under control, with the president comparing it to seasonal flu outbreaks and dismissing alarming media reports.

However, Mr Trump is said to be privately terrified about getting the virus himself, according to sources who spoke to Vanity Fair.

One source told the magazine Mr Trump’s fears about the virus have led him to tell aides he is afraid journalists might try to contract coronavirus so they can infect him on Air Force One.

“He’s definitely melting down over this,” the source, who is said to be close to the administration, said.

Mr Trump, who is a self-described germaphobe, has also reportedly asked for anyone with a cough to be barred from White House grounds.

The White House has been approached for comment on the claims but has not yet responded.

On Friday, the president gave a typically optimistic assessment of the outbreak during a tour of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in Atlanta and boasted about his supposed “natural ability” for science.

“People are really surprised I understand this stuff,” he said.

“Every one of these doctors said: ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability.”

Mr Trump also compared the virus to flu on Monday in a tweet which appeared to criticise quarantine measures that have been taken in other countries to prevent further spreading of the disease.

“So last year 37,000 Americans died from the common Flu. It averages between 27,000 and 70,000 per year. Nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on,” he wrote on Twitter.

“At this moment there are 546 confirmed cases of CoronaVirus, with 22 deaths. Think about that!”

However, a source who said they spoke to the president over the weekend has argued that the scale of the challenge has now become clear to him.

“He’s just now waking up to the fact that this is bad, and he doesn’t know how to respond,” the source told Vanity Fair.

Late on Monday, the White House’s press secretary said Mr Trump had not yet been tested for coronavirus, despite the president having been in contact with a number of senior Republicans who have self-quarantined over the virus.

“The President has not received Covid-19 testing because he has neither had prolonged close contact with any known confirmed Covid-19 patients, nor does he have any symptoms,” Stephanie Grisham said.

“President Trump remains in excellent health, and his physician will continue to closely monitor him.”

Mr Trump shook hands with one congressman, Doug Collins, who has self-isolated over contact with a confirmed case, and rode on Air Force One with another, Matt Gaetz, on Monday.

The US has already reported more than 700 confirmed cases of coronavirus, with at least 26 deaths from the outbreak, as of Tuesday morning.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-coronavirus-us-cases-journalists-covid-19-white-house-a9389566.html

AuldAlliance · 10/03/2020 13:50

The UK's contribution to CEPI is a very good thing, as the organisation funds research into these types of disease and will be looking for a vaccine.

But a vaccine is a while away yet and in the meantime the UK has to face the epidemic without being part of strategic meetings like this afternoon's videoconference and with a depleted, exhausted domestic civil service which has other huge Brexit-related issues to manage, a severely ailing NHS and a PM whose skill set is clearly unsuited to handling a major disaster, let alone one likely to be worsened by his key electoral policy.

The Withdrawal Act makes no reference, however, to whether the UK wishes or not to remain part of the ECDC. Possibly part of the poker-style approach to negotiations the UK has adopted. Hopefully they'll whip the right card out at the right moment.

At the moment, the ECDC's briefings on COVID-19 refer to "EU/EEA member and the UK," but that is due to cease at the end of this year. It will either have to swallow its dislike of the first letter of the ECDC acronym and pay £6m to continue being a full member, like Norway does or, like Switzerland, pay less and only get partial access to data.

UK HCP's were polled in 2018 (a whole other era) about the ECDC:

"Respondents unanimously felt that it was very important (mean score 9.6/10) to retain a working relationship with ECDC post Brexit to be able to respond effectively to cross-border threats and for UK health security.
91.7% wanted that relationship to remain as is, with no significant change, whilst 8.3% wanted to create a new relationship with ECDC. When asked to rank the functions of ECDC in order of importance for UK health protection, EWRS was ranked the highest. Data collection and analysis, access to scientific evidence and guidance in management of cross-border threats were also seen as important. In terms of the UK’s contribution to ECDC, respondents unanimously identified the UK as playing a leadership role, particularly with regards to academia and innovation. However, despite the range of expertise within the respondent pool, many felt their ability to manage future outbreaks post-Brexit would be weakened if the UK were to move outside of ECDC, mainly due to the loss of EWRS and professional collaborative opportunities."
www.fph.org.uk/media/1778/brexit-booklet-digital-2.pdf

UK applicants won't be able to participate in projects like these, for instance.
There is also economic strength in numbers, as the EU's collective purchasing of medical supplies shows.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 14:15

But a vaccine is a while away yet

It may be, but I am sure the anti-vaxxers are already there ...

bluehighlighter · 10/03/2020 15:18

Assassination by coronovirus. That would be something.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 15:21

Assassination by coronovirus. That would be something.

well, proof of a paranoid mental condition, maybe.

BigChocFrenzy · 10/03/2020 16:04

Cooperation ?
Politics before the nation's health ....

No10 blocks UK medics fighting Coronavirus from continued access to EU-wide pandemic warning system

Downing Street is pulling the UK out of an EU pandemic early warning system against the wishes of health experts amid claims they fear it could harm the Government's post-Brexitt* trade strategy.

The Department of Health lobbied to remain a member of Brussels' Early Warning and Response System (EWRS), an online hub bringing to together medical and political authorities across the bloc.

But while Downing Street this afternoon insisted it was committed to working with Brussels to combat the spread of the coronavirus,
it would not agree to remain part of the programme after the transition period ends in December.

The Prime Minister's official spokesman told reporters:
'We have left the European Union.'

It came as Boris Johnson today warned that coronavirus is on the verge of 'significant' escalation in the UK

  • as he urged people to stay calm and keep washing their hands.

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/early-warning-and-response-system-after-brexit-1-6540034

"The Department of Health pitched for continued access to the EWRS to be an objective of the negotiations,
but it was blocked because they didn't want to be accused of seeking more than the basic Canada deal."

OP posts:
BigChocFrenzy · 10/03/2020 16:08

A vaccine is estimated to be 12-18 months away from general release, because of the need for development, testing
and
production of sufficient amounts
(could be mass civil disorder if not enough vaccine for everyone)

So we will also face next winter without a vaccine

OP posts:
BigChocFrenzy · 10/03/2020 16:10

"It claims the final document contains little new information and is underwhelming–although others who have read it disagree."

Well, if it were so underwhelming, it wouldn't have been pulled before the GE !

Maybe it will get released on a bad news day for Coronavirus

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DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 16:11

Politics before the nation's health ....

Business as usual then. I can see the FTSE rallying on that news ....

BigChocFrenzy · 10/03/2020 16:12

Trump sounds quite insane and living on Planet Trump:

"One source told the magazine Mr Trump’s fears about the virus have led him to tell aides he is afraid journalists might try to contract coronavirus so they can infect him on Air Force One."

"People are really surprised I understand this stuff.
Every one of these doctors said: ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability.”

OP posts:
Mockerswithnoknockers · 10/03/2020 16:16

His uncle was a scientist. That makes him a scientist too, he says.

BigChocFrenzy · 10/03/2020 16:17

Listening No measures can possibly cover everyone and everything
So public health authorities use the principle of piling holed cheese slices on top of each other !

In every aspect of life, not just fighting a pandemic,
is very difficult to include the very poorest in the community

They are socially excluded and generally suffer worse health outcomes, worst outcomes for everything Sad
Especially in countries with the biggest social / financial inequality and little "safety net"

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DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 16:27

So public health authorities use the principle of piling holed cheese slices on top of each other !

Presumably after watching the intellect-stretching RI Xmas lecture last year ?

ListeningQuietly · 10/03/2020 16:27

BigChoc
In the USA 33 states do not have sick pay for employees ...

And yes Trump is a known germophobe
I sneeze in your general direction

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 16:40

IDS on the wrong side of the Huawei vote - there's always something to make you smile, if you dig hard enough ...

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51806704

(I should have put a fiver on it Grin)

yolofish · 10/03/2020 16:41

That Trump thing is really fucking insane. I mean, I have pretty low expectations of world leaders, but that does actually take the famous MN Biscuit.

I don't even know where to begin with it tbh.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 16:45

That Trump thing is really fucking insane.

It has a ring of the medieval about it, doesn't it ? Imagine if he started saying he felt he was under threat from voodoo ?

yolofish · 10/03/2020 16:54

yes DGR those are not the words of a man of sound mind... I do hope someone has taken the nuclear red button away from him.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 17:02

those are not the words of a man of sound mind... I do hope someone has taken the nuclear red button away from him.

If he ever had them. I would like to think there are very subtle, but effective mechanisms in place in the US administration to deal with ... such eventualities. Bearing in mind Reagan was presenting symptoms of his alzheimers in office in the 80s ...

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/11506047/Ronald-Reagans-speeches-showed-the-beginnings-of-Alzheimers-before-diagnosis.html

(Pretty certain there was story a while back about a UK specialist who spotted it from TV appearances ... can't recall how that played out)

The problem with a la-la POTUS, is that the actual decision making becomes opaque and open to all sorts of mischief. Although there is only so much POTUS can do (which is something non USAians need to bear in mind ...)

Also - as with most democracies - the chain of command down does have some ability to go "You What ?!" if an unexpected, illegal or immoral order is given.

That said, one country that knows about mad monarchs is England. Twice in fact.

HenHarrier · 10/03/2020 17:16

His uncle was a scientist. That makes him a scientist too, he says

His uncle was indeed pretty smart. I think Donny must be the one balancing out the IQ bell curve.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 17:22

His uncle was a scientist. That makes him a scientist too, he says

He's not mixing up "scientist" and "scientologist" (again) is he ?

HenHarrier · 10/03/2020 17:36

Not unless MIT got brainwashed by L Ron.

DGRossetti · 10/03/2020 17:38

Not unless MIT got brainwashed by L Ron

I was think more of the Trumpster himself ....

HenHarrier · 10/03/2020 17:48

From Uncle Trump’s Physics Today obit:

He was remarkably even-tempered, with kindness and consideration to all, never threatening or arrogant in manner, even when under high stress. He was outwardly and in appearance the mildest of men, with a convincing persuasiveness, carefully marshalling all his facts.

So nothing like Donny then.

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