Westminstenders: Penny dropping time

[RedToothBrush]

Johnson already seems to be hinting at protections for workers rights and the environment that he promised are to be dropped.

Along with enshrining Brexit in law to the end of Dec 2020 thus creating another Brexit no deal date. This time without any safety net in parliament.

"won't Johnson be more liberal than he suggested" they cry

About that...

That's why I never read cends posts - too many obvious errors

"might doesn't mean right"

That's a moral statement, not a legal one

Of course, any state has the power to use force to impose its will on the people, ultimately even to kill
That's might

Sovereignty is only absolute when it can be defended absolutely
The leaders of any state - except maybe the USA, China & Russia - can expect to be convicted in the International criminal Court if they break certain international laws

For their minions, "I was only following orders" was shown many decades ago not to be a defence in law

For international trade law, non-criminal, again the US probably has the might to ignore it all
The UK can't - and would face trade sanctions, tariffs, fines in international court

One of our many problems is that some Brexiters / Tories think that the UK can ignore laws like the US sometimes does
and force other countries to concede our trade demands

We did all this as a world superpower.
We aren't and can't know

know now

Seeing "Might is Right" or variants thereof reminds me of The Once and Future King by T.H. White. And the circumstances in which it was written. (It was the basis for Disneys "The Sword in the Stone" which managed to eviscerate any hint of the originals thrust).

Hic iacet and all that.

"A lot of us centrist/slightly left could live with genuine one nation conservatism."

As a centrist casting a worried eye at likely global recession, I would be positively happy with traditional One Nation Conservatism carefully minding the shop
under a MacMillan, Major, Heath

BUT
not with an unscrupulous demagogue in charge

That really does matter

BJ is every bit as sociopathic and unscrupulous as Orbán & Putin

He is held back only by our much stronger & longer democratic traditions:
our constitution and independent judiciary & police
our bolshy public that can put a million on the streets
our civil service and public institutions - no wonder thee being weakened

Tony's right on all three fronts. Brexit is a disaster. BJ is not to be trusted. Corbyn and his foolish cult should be kicked into touch. Where are the decent/serious politicians in the HoC?

"traditional One Nation Conservatism carefully minding the shop"

That cautious strategy was their great strength in dangerous times
(even if they weren't always able to carry it out properly !)

However, no One Nation Conservative would be so reckless as to risk crashing the economy and breaking up the UK,
all for ideology, profit or - in the case of the Bullingdon Boys & Cummings - quite possibly for nihilistic fun

"Where are the decent/serious politicians in the HoC?"

Elsewhere, earning much higher salaries and avoiding the toxic atmosphere of threats, especially towards women

Hopefully each party can find someone decent from the 2nd or 3rd eleven before the next GE

Matt Dathan@matt_dathan

Corbyn will be replaced by a new leader within 8-10 weeks,
John McDonnell tells the Andrew Marr Show

< can they finish a contest in that time, with 9 candidates that 600,000 members must whittle down ? >

BBC Politics@BBCPolitics

“If anyone’s to blame, it is me”
< blimey, a politician admitted he fucked up - must be retiring >

Shadow Chancellor John McDonnell apologises on #Marrr^ for Labour’s election campaign “disaster”
< video >

mobile.twitter.com/BBCPolitics/status/1206147015006019584

Elsewhere, earning much higher salaries and avoiding the toxic atmosphere of threats, especially towards women
Sadly I think you're right. Labour people don't vote Rebecca Long Bailey as leader.

Anyone fancy contacting Katie Hopkins to hear her having a "special moment" over this ?

Boris Johnson’s record on racism has left some Black Brits so afraid for their safety that they are considering leaving the UK should the Conservatives claim victory in Thursday’s election. Racist comments written or signed off by the prime minister include an article published in The Spectator while he was editor, written by columnist Taki Theodoracopulos, that claimed black people have lower IQs. Elsewhere, he penned a column for the Daily Telegraph referring to “watermelon smiles” and “piccaninnies”.

I personally disagree strongly with some people on here, including RTB whose recent posts have IMO (and I know I'm going to get flak for this) come over as a bit denialist about the role of racism in Brexit.

I do think racism played a role in it, but I also think it's over stated in areas too.

I think it's important to look at things from both angles to fully appreciate what's motivating tensions.

I live in a pretty much totally white area and there is still resentment of English white new comers (of a different higher social class) moving into the area at the expense of the working class community.

It is important this is talked about as much as the race element. There is a willingness to talk about race issues but not so much class issues atm. The two are important.

If you've understood me to be being a racism apologist you are off the mark.

We have had a number of scandals where social class prejudices have cropped up and I think that will happen even more going forward.

What do you think the 'deserving' and 'undeserving' poor idea is about?

We shouldn't be blind to any issue because it might 'diminish the legitimacy' of another. Just because x is true doesn't mean y is also true.

I think the reasons for Brexit are complex and wide ranging.

I don't think trying to over simplify that is helpful.

Have you guys seen this?
Sorry I can't keep up at the moment- but this popped up

twitter.com/RussInCheshire/status/1207071942601248772

All parties have two choices, to a degree. They either move towards the most voters, which is generally the centre, or, by power of conviction, oration, personality, leadership, they move the voters to them. From what I see of proposed labour likely candidates, they have no intention of doing the former, and have not the talented personnel for the latter. As a labour leaning voter, this is pants.

meanwhile, could this be Trumps impeachment day ?

Whatever else you think of Blair, his communication skills are spot on. The football analogy being an example.

Guy Verhofstadt
@guyverhofstadt
·
3h
Everyone presumes the
@Europarl_EN
will give automatically its consent to the Withdrawal Agreement. But we first need to solve the outstanding problems with the citizens' rights. Citizens can never become the victims of #Brexit.

Tony's right on all three fronts. Brexit is a disaster.

Some commentator, I don't remember who, said that often a Prime Minister's authority drains away suddenly, not to be recaptured. This I believe is the case with Tony Blair. Once he went to war in Iraq, he lost it. He talks sense now, but he's not getting the attention he deserves.

He talks sense now

Its called confirmation bias

Well said Guy Verhofstadt. But of course, it gives Johnson the ideal, "It wasn't my fault, the EU wouldn't let me excuse.

However, this excuse wont help him magic up the 50,000 nurses which his new constituents will be looking for.

This used to be where I'd come for knowledgable posts, reasoned debate, shared concerns, shared hope, and to find out what's happening

Yes I'm not sure what's going on. This isn't AIBU people, you know where it is!

After hearing Blair I’m not convinced the main competition isn’t in Labour itself with two sides rather than the Cons.

...

@mrslaughan that's brilliant.. thanks for posting. ...and then some idiot trawls through his posts to try to discredit him. So apt for the twittersphere/callout culture

@MarshaBradyo - agree!! Maybe the momentum-ers should split off and form their own hard left party and leave labour to get on with it?