What are you most looking forward to POST-Brexit?

[Pumperthepumper]

I was a remain voter, and voted tactically against the Tories. I lost.

But onwards and upwards! We’re getting Brexit in January, like it or not, so I was just wondering what everyone was looking forward to the most?

I asked on a different pro-Brexit thread but nobody gave me an answer.

For me it’s the 350 million to the NHS with no trade deals with Trump. Or the continuing Peace in NI with no messing around with the GFA. Or the trade deals we’ve been promised without any reduction in standards.

I’m so ready to be convinced of how brilliant Brexit will be! Let me hear your positives, please

@Clavinova

Have you been watching re-runs of Brookside???

Long standing family joke that gets trotted out frequently as we’re old enough to have seen it first time round.

Although have just checked and it’s from 1993, so now I’m feeling particularly old.

Erasmus mainly benefits the English middle classes, IME of dealing with outgoing students from the UK and ROI over the past 15 years. That is less true of the students from universities in Scotland and ROI. I can't speak for Wales.

This has changed very visibly since the introduction of university fees and attendant financial selection.

In response to a much earlier remark, possibly a c&p, it is true that the student body in the UK has changed in the past decade or so and there are more non-UK students at UK universities and therefore on Erasmus exchanges from those universities. They do perhaps participate more in Erasmus exchanges proportionally than UK students, a phenomenon I'd ascribe to their prior experience of mobility to the UK, which gives them the confidence to do it again.

Since the UK isn't v hot on vocational training compared to some other EU states, the full range of advantages offered by Erasmus is not taken up by non-middle class members of UK society, whereas Erasmus internships are quite common elsewhere.

From posts on here, it seems there is also an information deficit that means some people are unaware of the opportunity available to them.

In the last 5 years or so, it has become very obvious that an increasing number of students from the UK and, although less so, Ireland have MH issues such as stress or anxiety that make mobility difficult and sometimes cause them to cut short their exchange.

Potentially getting a Scottish passport...

Clavinova Why do you hate the Erasmus + scheme?

I don't hate Erasmus + - I have no objections if we continue to pay in to the scheme - perhaps with a bit more transparency.

I suspect that Erasmus does mainly benefit the UK middle class
This.

Although I was a bit surprised when I saw the Erasmus stats for 2008/09 (from the parliamentary report 2012) - 1,300 non-UK students (resident in the UK) were counted as 'British' 'outgoing' students involved in Erasmus - 14% of the total - although non-British students only represented 7.6% of the student population in 2008/09. I would like to see the current stats for transparency - it would be a bit disappointing if it turns out that 25% of the 'British' students/teachers/lecturers sent to Europe through Erasmus were actually non-British.

What positives are you personally looking forward to on 1st February ?
The government getting on with their domestic agenda mainly.

Auld
there are more non-UK students at UK universities and therefore on Erasmus exchanges from those universities.
Que?
Only Erasmus eligible students can do it ....
Chinese students at EU Unis cannot do Erasmus
where is this forriner racism coming in about Erasmus ????
nasty, nasty, sad

Cross post with AuldAlliance.

And ListeningQuietly!

Is there a correlation between the introduction of fees and loans and the increasing levels of MH issues?

Although I was a bit surprised when I saw the Erasmus stats for 2008/09 (from the parliamentary report 2012)
I shall remain outraged about something that happened 12 years ago

The government getting on with their domestic agenda mainly.
Which bits of that will benefit you directly ?
that could not have been done over the last few years

I shall remain outraged about something that happened 12 years ago

Later stats (available to the public) don't appear to have the relevant data - could well be 20/25% 12 years later.

Clavinova
Which pieces of domestic legislation are you awaiting after Brexit?

Which bits of that will benefit you directly?

Here's hoping!

Of course Erasmus opportunities are also limited by courses and availability. Although there are many universities that offer courses in English in the EU (Bocconi, UvA, Rotterdam, I.E to name a few) you are more likely to get a place whilst an mfl student (hence higher numbers of girls going as they are higher in number on mfl courses).

Clavinova
here's hoping
oh bless
I can list off multiple pieces of legislation that have been held up by the Brexit logjam
I know none that cannot happen until Brexit is done

please, oh queen of the internet link , show us the legislation that cannot happen till Brexit is done
ideally that will make your, or any, life better

malylis
Interesting, the vast bulk of the Erasmus students who get drunk in my house are STEM students from the whole of Europe and the many many countries (Aus, Canad, NZ, Israel etc) who pay into the scheme

ListeningQuietly: there are lots of students currently at UK universities who were born elsewhere in the EU and they may then take part in Erasmus mobility from the UK to other EU countries.
I don't know why you seem to be suggesting that I'm racist for noting this.

It's also not totally impossible for a student from a non-EU country who is duly registered at a participating EU university to take part in Erasmus, as long as they can get a visa. It happens occasionally.

Continuity, I don't think there is necessarily a correlation between fees and the MH issues we've been seeing and I wasn't suggesting that, although I suppose that they may add to stress as they raise the stakes and add a burden of debt for some students. Friends working in HE in the UK put the rise in stress/anxiety down to the constant strain UK school pupils are under to perform and sit endless tests over an extended period before arriving in HE.
I just wondered whether the MH issues might not discourage those students from taking part in Erasmus. If they are already struggling in a familiar environment, they may be hesitant about going abroad.

show us the legislation that cannot happen till Brexit is done

I think it's generally accepted that our MPs have been too busy arguing among themselves to get much of anything done - that should change for a start.

Auld
there are lots of students currently at UK universities who were born elsewhere in the EU and they may then take part in Erasmus mobility from the UK to other EU countries.
Ah OK, so you are talking about EU FOM students
-like German born squaddie kids
studying all over
everybody in the EU has the right to study everywhere
and as the UK has the highest fees in Europe, Erasmus is purely a gain not a loss to UK kids
so why the angst?

Clavinova
I think it's generally accepted that our MPs have been too busy arguing among themselves to get much of anything done - that should change for a start.
WHAT
WHICH PIECES OF LEGISLATION
You have the links at your fingertips........

What are your top three ?
I have mine, but all can (and should) be done within the EU.
What are your three that cannot be done in the EU?

I'm really looking forward to the leavers apologising for ruining our lives...

AuldAlliance I think the MH issues could correlate with the amount of testing that English school children are put under, coupled with the additional stress of loans for HE.

My eldest DC went right through the Scottish system (first cohort of CfE) and it seemed less stressful - no SATS, much less ongoing testing, uni offers based on Highers already gained.

Youngest is now at an English school, much more emphasis on continual testing and knowing what the examiners are asking for and how to answer appropriately, rather than (IMO) demonstrating a proper understanding of the subject. It is much more pushy / competitive than I am used to (and eldest DC was in a good Scottish school that still manipulated students to keep its stats up), and I find that a bit depressing.

Listening, I'm talking about students who are Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Slovak, Polish, etc. by birth and are enrolled in UK universities as undergraduates. Their number has increased in the last decade or so. Since I have no reason to quiz them on their life, I don't know whether they moved to the UK to study or whether they were already living there before they went to university.

I have no angst. (I am upset for our students here, many of whom come from very underprivileged backgrounds and have been facing uncertainty over the last 3 years as to whether they will still be able to go on Erasmus exchanges to the UK and get the language skills and international experience they need to compete for jobs. Many had been saving for several years to supplement the Erasmus grant and felt they had to pull out because they weren't sure whether they'd be able to access healthcare etc. if the UK crashed out of the EU while they were there.)

I'm just describing the changes I've witnessed from this perspective over the last decade and a half. Aspects of it might go some way to explaining why there is this very weird attitude amongst some in the UK (which BJ and his like may exploit) that Erasmus is a scheme for over-privileged middle class kids to have some time off pissing around in the EU and therefore it won't matter if Brexit puts an end to it. And other aspects may explain the data Clavinova was bandying around that seemed to suggest there was a bias in the system and that non-UK students were disproportionately benefiting from Erasmus while enrolled in UK universities.

But I'm v tired so probably wasn't making any of that very clear.

Auld
I think there is a MASSIVE cross purposes

a lad who arrived in the UK from Poland in 2012 is a UK student
and thus eligible to do Erasmus elsewhere
BUT
an Italian starting a degree in the UK cannot Erasmus back to Italy - they can go anywhere else
the fact that Europeans move around to study and pay tax is a GOOD THING

I'm still unsure why anybody would be against it

Continuity that would make sense and was what I was wondering, without being sure of it.
I've also noticed that the students from English universities are less accustomed to thinking about the subject under study than before, and more inclined to presume lecturers are looking for The One Right Answer. I presume, perhaps wrongly, this is a result of the rise in teaching to the test.

Oi Clavinova
stilll waiting for your links to blocked legislation ....