Brexit Arms: the discussion continues....

[XingMing]

I'm not promising to be the resident landlady, and I can't even hope to moderate the discussion or offer up great memes etc because I don't know how, but here's opening the next iteration....

First drink is on the house.

And were the Tories trying to rig it in 2017?

Tbf Labour and the Tories seem to be equally condemning Plymouth CC incompetence.

Dear leader Jezbollah, just quoted the “great poet” Pablo Neruda during his speech.

Here is a short wiki Bio of Pablo Neruda.

“Born in Parral, Chile, on July 12, 1904, poet Pablo Neruda stirred controversy with his affiliation with the Communist Party and his outspoken support of Joseph Stalin, Fulgencio Batista and Fidel Castro. His poetic mastery was never in doubt, and for it he was awarded the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1971.”

The quote.

“You can cut all the flowers, but you can’t stop spring coming”.

Sounds lovely, if you don’t care or know that the poet was a Stalin supporter and an exiled communist doesn’t it.

I’m not saying we shouldn’t laud great literary works, and grudgingly accept that sometimes historically these people may have dubious pasts. But this is becoming somewhat of a habit for the dear leader and his cronies isn’t it?

Ah, poetry that speaks to him. The private-school-then-Oxbridge Labour candidate standing in our constituency (yet again, God loves a tryer) is on record as saying, "Stalin was a diamond geezer who [...] improved working conditions for the masses". He probably has the same books on his bookshelf as Dear Leader.

Lib Dems aren't even on my radar

they want to raise basic rate, blimey.

lovely cats.

recent visit to GP, she said the issue was how resources are allocated, so basically she feels the NHS senior bods are putting money in things that aren't necessary and ignoring areas that need it.

Every day that passes, I die a little more inside from the fear of these people gaining power. I fully accept that Boris is a tit and given the choice, I would prefer he was not the tit steering this ship. But right now, he is the only tit that can prevent this terrifying momentum disease taking hold of all of our futures.

twitter.com/telegraph/status/1197108963944390663?s=21

Please tell me someone has some positive poll news to hand, I really need some reassurance right now...

Where on earth are Labour getting the cash from to pay for all their promises?
They are definitely trying to stoke a class war, it's terrifying that people are falling for it.

😂Epic, just one tit between us and disaster. There's a meme there, but MN rules probably wouldn't allow it.

DH is terrified that Jezbollah will get in. He keeps asking about countries that would have us if it came to pass, and he's a Brit through-and-through.

I have great faith in the common sense of the British people. We do not like extremism of any kind. I've read some truly heartening articles about the visceral loathing of Dear Leader in the scarlet-red areas of West Bromwich East (Tom Watson's former fiefdom) and Dudley North. I'm just sorry that the Labour Party has lost sight of the people it was meant to advocate for.

In my idler moments, I do sometimes muse about where the Labour Party might be now if David Miliband had won the leadership election and not Miliband Minor. I thought him arrogant in RL but he was more switched on than Ed and was politically closer to the now-mythical centre ground. It was Ed's kneejerk attempts to deal with the fallout from the Falkirk fiasco that opened the door to Momentum by changing the membership criteria. I doubt very much that the Falkirk mess would have happened on David Miliband's watch. I think he would have spotted it and acted sooner. However, we'll never know now.

thegirl

Amazon innit.

“DH is terrified that Jezbollah will get in. He keeps asking about countries that would have us if it came to pass, and he's a Brit through-and-through.”

We are renewing our passports this weekend. It has crossed my mind too.

Autumn this is George Osborne on the LibDem renaissance. He is a bit of a fanboy, perhaps because he and DC actually are and always were LibDems.

Boris is not my ideal candidate but much prefer a proper Tory to a LibDem masquerading as a Tory or a LibDem or a self-serving Independent.

www.spectator.co.uk/2019/11/george-osborne-the-temptation-of-voting-lib-dem/

Anything is an improvement on George.

SNP are apparently still beyond reproach despite NHS Glasgow and Edinburgh in shambles and Salmond in the Dock. That's depressing.

thanks, howabout, I will read that later.

this is the only place I can say it, hopefully, so I'll say it.

I HATE HATE HATE how international politics is.

Electoral fraud is still ridiculously easy to perpetrate, I think there are plans to insist on voters bringing along some ID, which would at least be a start. No idea how postal vote fraud can be stopped though, households with fictitious inhabitants and those where all the postal vote forms are filled in by one person

Excerpts from The Times about West Brom East about the anger locally after the Labour Party parachuted in one of Jezbollah's pals from Lambeth:

"Labour has been accused of another stitch-up after choosing a controversial kebab tycoon and personal friend of Jeremy Corbyn to replace Tom Watson in his West Midlands seat.
Ibrahim Dogus, a restaurateur and lobbyist who founded the British Kebab Awards, was selected as the party’s candidate despite speculation that Watson had agreed to go quietly in return for seeing a member of his team take his place in West Bromwich East."
"In 2013 he gave £1,250 to the Tories and has been accused of paying his restaurant staff “poverty wages” of less than £4 an hour."

"When challenged on the wages in his restaurants, Dogus has said in the past that he was working towards paying the living wage at all his establishments."

"“All the internal scraps will look silly suddenly if we’re distracted in seats like this,” said one [Labour] MP. “Corbyn’s won control of the party. When the left isn’t at war with the right, it’s at war with itself.” "

Local people already have plenty of reason not to vote Labour in this non-marginal (but now very possibly winnable) Labour seat. It voted 68% Leave. George Galloway is also standing as an Independent. If WBE turns blue, it will be game over. Hang on in there, Epic!

SingingLily West Bromwich & Dudley aren't too far away from me, and you're right, there's no love for Corbyn there. Last night I was out with some friends and was amazed to hear that a couple of the dyed-in-the-wool Labour voters (public-sector union members) are going LibDem this time.

Epic 100% agree that Boris is a tit, although I do think he's as sharp as nails under the lovable buffoon act.

I’m hanging in there! Doing my best! Lol.

The trouble is, I totally understand ex labour not wanting to go tory, but, these split, meaningless votes for the lib dems and bxp etc... don’t necessarily help to keep jezza’s lot at bay. They may just make it happen by default, I’m certainly not expecting labour to gain a majority, but what scares me is them forcing a minority government or scrappy coalition by the back door. Non Tory votes merely facilitate that. What a mess!

I totally and utterly sympathise with the never Tory, Corbyn haters, it must be an awful dilemma, but if Corbyn terrifies them half as much as he seemingly does so many people, then it may be the only realistic option for some of them to help keep him away from power.

Ugh. Bad times for all.

Back to Pablo Neruda.

On Stalin (1953)

“To be men! That is the Stalinist law! . . .
We must learn from Stalin
his sincere intensity
his concrete clarity. . . .
Stalin is the noon,
the maturity of man and the peoples.
Stalinists, Let us bear this title with pride. . . .
Stalinist workers, clerks, women take care of this day!
The light has not vanished.
The fire has not disappeared,
There is only the growth of
Light, bread, fire and hope
In Stalin’s invincible time! . . .
In recent years the dove,
Peace, the wandering persecuted rose,
Found herself on his shoulders
And Stalin, the giant,
Carried her at the heights of his forehead. . . .
A wave beats against the stones of the shore.
But Malenkov will continue his work.”

“Epic 100% agree that Boris is a tit, although I do think he's as sharp as nails under the lovable buffoon act.”

Totally agree, but he is just so unpalatable for so many sadly. And right now, that’s the last thing this country needs. Every time he speaks I am quietly willing him to drop the stupid soundbites and be more dynamic and sincere, we urgently need that from him right now. My vote will stay with him, as the alternative seriously horrifies me, but he needs to get his house in order fast, and sort this country out otherwise we will be right back here again in 5 years time.

Singing George was my MP when I was a student. I would vote for him if I lived in WBE. The seat looks like a true test of principle over party loyalty for Labour voters on Left/Right and pro/anti Brexit so will be fascinating where it lands.

From previous elections if 68% Leave then it looks like at least 30% of TW's 58% last time round were pro Brexit. If Tories stay where they are and the old LibDem 2010 vote defects away from Labour (10%) then even if Labour Brexiters split Tory / Brexit / GG / Labour in equal measure the Tories will take the seat (38% +)

Very true Epic - my fear is that there'll be yet another election far sooner than 2024. I just want Boris to be able to take charge this time with a decent majority. Heaven help us if there's another hung parliament.

I don't get why Boris annoys people. Jo and Rachel annoy me but Stanley is great fun on gogglebox. David Milliband sets my teeth on edge and comes across as insincere, self serving and sanctimonious. I like Ed. I liked Douglas Alexander even better but I couldn't stand his sister. I also like Ed Balls but being married to Yvette reflects badly on him.

That's what I'm hoping, howabout. I've got a list of about a dozen constituencies I'll be keeping a beady eye on, on election night. WBE is one of them.

but he needs to get his house in order fast, and sort this country out otherwise we will be right back here again in 5 years time.

They are all unpalatable, Epic, but for different reasons and in differing degrees: a bit like the Trump-or-Hilary conundrum Americans faced in 2015. What keeps me going, though, is that Boris has a razor-sharp team around him - plenty from his Mayoral team, Vote Leave and the Taxpayers Alliance - and if there is one thing he is good at, it's picking the right people and giving them the time and space to get on with it. The very opposite of Mrs May who was Mrs Micro Manager.

If I'm reading his team right, they've already got the first 100 days planned, and beyond. All the heavy lifting will be done in the first 100 days because that sets the tone and the culture.

Plus, there's Lindsay Hoyle (please God, let him be confirmed as Speaker). Finally having a grown-up in charge of HoC proceedings is an immediate change of tone and culture.