Westministenders: Slow News Fake News

[RedToothBrush]

Things have been slow whilst we are in proroguation, ahead of next weeks Queen's Speech and the EU summit.

We've been in full spin mode, from the likes of the far right and an unnamed source at No.10.

People seem to be waking up to the reality that its highly unlikely we will get a deal now, unless something significant. And No.10 has worked out the NI problem. FINALLY.

Anyway, if you have a little time this week and you are interested in the history of where technology change and fake news meet and how where we are now is merely things repeating themselves, Ian Hislop's Fake News: A True History, is essential viewing.
www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m00095hv/ian-hislops-fake-news-a-true-history

I really feel strongly this is stuff that should be being taught in schools somehow as its what protects us from extremism.

(DD recently turned 18)
A PASScard has photo & only costs £15. It never expires.
I humbly submit that most people could afford that.

The 3.5 million was in the article linked

lljkk
Do you remember the fuss when Bliar tried to bring in ID cards
.... OK he massively over egged it, but it was the gammons who decried it as a European plotat the time

Most people could, not everyone

Also, v few people would pay 15 quid to vote, if they get along without the ID otherwise

Indeed the Electoral Roll officer already has been screwed, if she wanted Remain.

It's a cautionary tale for economically right-wing Remainers who thought it didn't matter who they crapped on, their numbers said the Tories would still get in... Didn't see the referendum or Leave coming, did you?

Come to that, it's a cautionary tale in general. Don't shit on the people below you. You may need them to fight on the beaches for you one day.

And yes, it's definitely ID cards by stealth. Very Theresa May (though she's not the only one): don't make a law that it's compulsory to have an ID card.

Just make lots of laws that it's nigh-on compulsory to show ID cards for much of daily life.

Tony Connelly (RTE)

twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1183450493248364545?s=09

Long thread, starts with

Here's the latest on the Brexit negotiations:

1/ EU officials and diplomats are playing down prospects for a breakthrough in the coming days, with one senior figure saying a deal at the summit would be "ambitious"

You know what, I'm not convinced my mum or dad have photo ID anymore. They've not been abroad since 2011 at the very latest due to mum's anxiety / depression. Dad doesn't drive and mum hasn't moved since 1989, so has never triggered the need for a photo licence. They could, however, afford to get it, but it would be a massive hassle for them what with all their other health issues.

I hadn't actually considered ID cards via the back food, MShip. I think you're probably right.

Is a PASScard valid ID for voting? And there are huge numbers who couldn't afford £15 per adult. Look at food bank usage increasing all the time. Those people couldn't afford it.

DWP are valid ID too.

DWP letters that is.

After the "Breakthrough" it was 99% likely that any resulting WA would need an extension

Now it's 99.9% likely

Similar tone, more detail on the UK's proposal from Mehreen Khn at FT.

twitter.com/MehreenKhn/status/1183445933020930055?s=09

🔔New: UK this weekend presented a customs plan to EU that keeps NI in the UK's customs area and will involve tracking all goods entering NI. Differential customs treatment is applied on goods from 3rd countries depending on final destination (into SM or not)

The idea sticks to UK red lines on NI not leaving UK customs territory. All entering goods initially have EU and UK status. But Barnier warned that without concrete details about how to make this plan legally operable, the EU is opening itself up to mass fraud in single market.

EU's main problems are about near impossibility of tracking final destination of goods given complexity of modern supply chains. Barnier gave example of sugar imports into NI from a 3rd country (via UK) which then end up in soft drinks that eventually enter Ireland and the SM.

UK answering q's will be thrust of negotiations on Mon. But in grand scheme, a complex dual customs system is unlikely to be nailed down by Weds. It needs weeks, even months. To seal a deal next week, Barnier is pushing the NI-only backstop as per Feb 2018 (UK has ruled it out)

Next key day is Weds - eve of summit - when EU27 ambassadors are briefed on outcome of talks and gear up for what kind of extension UK might need at the summit. A short technical one would help get any final text over ratification line. But if still big gaps, longer is needed

On other outstanding issues, UK has dropped demand for 4-year rolling consent for Stormont but negotiators haven't worked out what kind of NI approval both sides can live with. Ambassadors have also questioned what mandate Barnier has to agree any kind of consent mechanism

Brits also demanding the political declaration on future relations removes references to "robust level playing field" as agreed by Theresa May. EU has said the scope of any future trade deal will be limited without this

To sum up: sounds like we are heading to a Brexit extension, come what may.

Foodbank users would be one of the target groups
Anyone really skint is much less likely to vote Tory

Latest from the ever well-informed Tony Connelly from RTE

Here's the latest on the Brexit negotiations:

1/ EU officials and diplomats are playing down prospects for a breakthrough in the coming days, with one senior figure saying a deal at the summit would be "ambitious"

2/ Following two days of intensive talks the two sides are still far apart on customs. The EU side continues to have grave concerns about the UK proposals to keep NI in the UK customs territory, with Theresa May's old Customs Partnership idea being recycled and adapted for NI

3/ The idea, as far as we can see is that NI is in the UK customs territory, but operating the EU's rules and procedures on tariffs and quotas. If goods are going from GB to NI-only they pay the EU tariff and importers get a rebate on the difference between that and the UK tariff

4/ If the goods go on to cross the border south then the EU tariff is the correct one

5/ Following a briefing by Michel Barnier to EU27 ambassadors, the main problems are:

• the sytem of rebates is very complex
• the plans won't be ready by the end of the transition
• it's not clear how you ensure goods that are destined to remain in NI stay in NI

6/ Another EU reservation is around rules of origin: sugar might be sent from GB to NI, but what if that sugar ends up in fizzy drinks that are they traded over the border? The same applies to a product like steel

7/ Overall the EU have reservations that the idea may not be workable and would give rise to fraud. Overall the EU believe that the more we get back to the Febuary 2018 NI-only backstop the simpler and the more legally operable the solution would be

8/ It's too early to speculate on possible scenarios and options, there are too many alternatives, says one EU source

9/ Another source says technical talks are continuing tomorrow. "The EU is continuing to work on this." But over all the EU have concerns about the UK's conceptual approach, that it's a mish mash of options, while the NI-only backstop is more simply, legally operable etc

10/ A further source says a deal at the summit would be "very difficult, but not impossible"

Trump is at it too with the voter ID.

That quote is from his rally on Friday.

It’s almost like they have the same advisors.

There's not going to be a deal to vote on next Sat. Other than May's WA.

I'm going to keep stashing.

I did idly wonder if DWP letters saying "We're being lying cunts again, fuck off and starve," will do for ID?

Or just the sort that say, "The courts forced us to restore your benefits so we'll get round to it some time – but meanwhile have another form to fill in, because".

Electoral Reform Society: Petition against voter ID

https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/campaigns/upgrading-our-democracy/voter-id/^

Here in the UK, 3.5 million citizenss_ do not have access to photo ID
and 11 million citizenss_ do not have a passport or driving licence
– in 2013/14 1.7 million lack even a bank accountt_.

That makes mandatory voter ID – with no free provision – a barrier to many people exercising their right to vote.

Allowing the use of non-photographic (and easily-forgeable) utility bills would mean the change could actually do more harm than good – making it harder to vote for honest voters, while not tackling any of the alleged problems.

Even if the government decide to pay for a free national electoral ID card, forcing people to bring it to exercise their right to vote will lead to inevitable mistakes and accidents.

With no evidence of widespread fraud,
even a handful of people not voting as they left their ID at home would have a far bigger impact on election results than alleged fraud.

It’s almost like they have the same advisors.
Um, they do
who do you think is funding Cummings - follow the money - the Mercer family
the Koch family
and other old white carbon producers

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3716831-Westminstenders-Showdown?watched=1

Voter ID proposal is electioneering and trying to provoke a Queen's Speech crisis.

Why is everyone missing the point that its unlikely to have numbers to pass (in this parliament at least).

I'm completing my stash this next week even though I think we are going to have to get an extension. Barnier has said he won't block one so that's positive. I'm sick of the can kicking but don't see how we can avoid no deal otherwise. I still think we need two years to sort this out and that it will take 10 to be fully sorted. Of course revoke is my ideal but I'll take not fucking anyone over (except the Tories) as an alternative.

red I've already posted that this QS almost certainly won't pass

However, if the Tories win the next GE ....
One of the things we will have to fight

Its a MAHOOSIVE IF
because the Tories are not in control of the date of the next election

because the Tories are not in control of the date of the next election

Which they absolutely fucking hate. You can guarantee that if they get a majority in the next GE, that'll be repealed quicker than you can say BoZo is a twat.