Westministenders: Boris Johnson Broke The Law

[RedToothBrush]

ITS OFFICIAL
The Highest Court in the Land has ruled that Boris Johnson has broken the law.

Parliament is Sovereign.

Despite the calls for his resignation it is highly unlikely he will under the current political climate.

It must be stressed that the judgement was UNAMINOUS and went further than most expected, and took the hardest possible line again the government

The power now lies with the Speakers of the Lords and Commons to decide when Parliament reopens.

It also means that all the bills which were ended by proroguation are now back in play.

Expect a full backlash from the hard right attacking the courts are going full on 'enemies of the people'. This will be NASTY

The strength of this ruling does pretty much rule out another proroguation as the courts are liable to throw it out immediately if they try it on again.

Johnson is in New York. He needs to get on a plane very quickly.

Happy birthday to all the westminstenders celebrating today. It's also DSs birthday. And would have been Jim Henson's were he still alive - a sad day for the Muppets both of film and government

RedToothBrush
I'm reminded of the words of Tony Hancock
"Did Magna Carta mean nothing to you?
Did she die in vain?

I'm for GNU now.
Trump will dump Boris.
Tump doesn't like losers.

Interesting. I hadn't thought about that.

Spend some time on the Brexit Arms thread. Remainer partisan judges, apparently. This may get ugly ...er.

it's ridiculous. I did vote Remain in the referendum but I am totally and utterly frustrated by parliament's inability to do anything. I was actually pleased when he prorogued it as we didn't have to hear them not agree on everything for the 100th time.

so they come back and what? the Tory conference next week. Boris has to ask the EU for an extension (as he is bound to). We have to wait and see what the EU says and we are bound by their decision.

So yet again, we are bound by what Europe says. And in Brussels today, they announced that no matter what, the UK must pay £17bn even after a no deal brexit (presumably they can't make us pay!).

tbh I can see why leavers want to leave!

I am not rewriting history. The sheer complexity of Brexit from a legal standpoint wasn’t fully appreciated.

By whom ? As a Remainer, I was well aware it was a task of mammoth proportions - and that if anything the Remain advocates were understating the case as was. Nothing in the past 3 years has made me think I underestimated the difficulty.

I'm well aware that there have been some attempts by some to pretend they weren't told, no-one was told, if we'd been told, etc etc. Especially about the complicated situation in NI. But all of that was foretold and predicted before the referendum, and it irks me slightly when people try to pretend otherwise.

I had no idea that two successive Tory governments would make quite such a horlicks of it, admittedly. I hold my hands up to not seeing that in 2016 ....

JC speech this afternoon now and it's possible they might just scrap the rest of the conference (its a shitshow anyway)

Awaiting first sight of BJ on NYC, will he fly back? Possible VONC tomorrow if he does?

This silence from No10 is deafening

Nevertheless, the judgment has surprised me because there is no legal benchmark regarding the length of prorogation, so no law was broken.

There is precedent for being able to conclude that the length of the prorogation was unreasonable for a Queen’s Speech without having to state what a reasonable period of time would be.

It was part of Pannick’s argument I think (but can’t remember which case he quoted).

And again - the ruling was unlawful, not illegal, so it doesn’t have to specifically break a law.

"my rusty undergraduate understanding of public law"

The Supreme Court were educated way beyond undergraduate law and have practised law at the top level for decades

I'd be a lot more confident they got it right than that you did

They did their duty as judges to interpret and apply the law,
despite knowing the fury they would face from Brexiters who no longer seem to respect either the UK Parliament or UK law

Politically, it has stirred up a hornet's nest,
but if judges blink and politics is allowed to override law - especially if the PM becomes above the law -
then our democracy would be over
and it would be mob rule

Parliament sitting again tomorrow, but no PMQ

Will we ever find a way out and unite as a country? The whole thing is such a mess, what an earth can we do to find a solution

Michael Rosen
@MichaelRosenYes
·
7m
Dear Jacob
Technically speaking you’ll know that in actual fact it wasn’t me in person who actually went to see the Queen. You’ll remember that technically speaking in actual fact it was in fact you.
Non mea culpa
Boris

PMK!

At least the pound has recovered

This silence from No10 is deafening

Tory whips are telling all their MPs to stay schtum.

"the UK must pay £17bn even after a no deal brexit (presumably they can't make us pay!)."

it is a legally binding debt under international law, which the EU could go to the World Court at the Hague to sue for

That 17bn was spent as part of the EU's 7-year budget that the govt at the time signed up to

It also includes pensions for Farage & co, as well as all the Uk civil servants, Commissioners etc who worked there over the last 45 years

so they come back and what?

They get on with committee work and resurrect work on Bills which were lost part way through and would have had to be restarted from the beginning. Restarting Parliament doesn't bring back the time wasted.

Yes where is BJ. Does he not have to comment publicly?

Still unclear as to exactly which law he broke.

All the MPs I've seen interviewed so far are looking to get back to parliament and question Boris, still nothing about Brexit.

Time for a general election, but everybody seems to be too scared that the Tories will win.

So democracy now seems to be a court decision rather than the people.

Im guessing this could end up in a confidence motion?

Red or BCF would you agree?

Honestly?

No. Because no one wants to trigger a GE just yet.

My eyes are on what Tory moderates will do and just how uncomfortable some are feeling and whether Graham Brady's mailbox might be a little warm.

There are rumours that there are some VERY unhappy Tory MPs.

Even then though, I don't think that will happen...

I SUSPECT what will happen is they might threaten that, and they might then apply pressure to use this as an opportunity to remove Cummings.

Whether that will happen I'm not sure.

There is also likely to be a post mortem in Cabinet about how they were excluded from seeing the legal advice on this (eyes particularly on Robert Buckland the attorney general here too). I suspect they will be more demanding on Johnson and will scruntise HIM more rather than let him act as such a loose canon, as they have collective responsibility.

So things will get tougher for Johnson. He will try and style it out.

Cummings is liable to try and lie low for at least a few days. (I think he'll also survive tbh).

But expect lots of 'unnamed sources' and 'enemies of the people' crap from some quarters.

The Conservative Party conference (in Manchester - 2 and a half hours by train plus transit time from the Gmex to Piccadilly and from Euston to Westminister - its 3 and half hours MINIMUM unless you go by helicopter) is going to be bloody interesting as the House will be sitting and there will be NO recess now.

Johnson was SUPPOSED to be speaking at the Conservative Party conference BUT thats now looking fucked.

I think we will also hear a lot more about impeachment or misconduct in a public office. I also don't think this will go very far, but I think there will be lots of muttering about it.

No law was broken

I am surprised to see this comment coming from anyone with any education in our legal system. It might make sense in a codified civil law system where you have a book of laws and can either point to one (or not) to decide whether it has been broken. But not in a common-law jurisdiction with an unwritten constitution.

The judgment is very clear as to the basis for its finding of unlawfulness.

Pmk

BigChoc yes absolutely. This BBC series on Iplayer discusses how Germany went from a democracy to a dictatorship in six months. It’s really scary to see some of the modern parallels of themes or tactics, I would recommend everyone to watch it:

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/m00084td/rise-of-the-nazis

Lewis Goodall@lewis_goodall

There is no way that Boris Johnson can ignore the law now, if he ever could.

Can Boris Johnson use this court judgment as an excuse to extend
(blame the court and other institutions) as a means to get his election?

The way I see it, save for resignation, that is his only play.