Westminstenders: Silly Season

[RedToothBrush]

It's that time of year again when politicians seem to completely lose their marbles in order to impress the faithful. And it is beginning to feel like conference season is increasingly an exercise in religious ferver to the party rather than considering what's in the best interests of the whole country.

Labour have got off to a good start before their conference opens, by almost starting complete melt down.

The Tories have promised to break from convention and try and over shadow the others, so that's something to look forward to.

And early this week we have the supreme Court ruling which could, regardless of which direction it swings, have massive ramifications for our democracy.

Big week ahead.

Last one, I won't continue to post them but this is another local result with a huge swing to LDs

And despite knowing there are all these English-speaking countries round the world, and all these Indian names on war memorials in the UK. And despite the fact that most UK families have, in my experience, at least one family member in a Commonwealth country...

I am perfectly happy to accept that plucky little Britain was never in it on its own.

But mentioning people with family members in a Commonwealth country - I have a nephew who left the UK as a child, and has lived abroad ever since, apart from the one year of the Referendum. So he got to vote, voted Leave and promptly buzzed off back to the Commonwealth country. Now that does annoy me, when EU citizens who have lived and worked here for substantial parts of their lives and made a commitment to this country, got no say, and he did.

So Labour's policy to effectively ban private schools has been passed.

They would be forced to integrate into the state school system and sell off land and buildings apparently?

Not sure how I feel about this one...

...and seems bullet two suggests a kind of reverse quota so universities only accept 7% privately educated.

Erm...I feel pretty uncomfortable about that TBH.

Ditto mojo

I have no issues whatsoever with removing their charitable status and making them pay full business rates. But this seems a step too far.

And I say that as someone who is fundamentally opposed to private education (and grammar/selective schools for that matter) and would never use it. (Scotland has been fully comprehensive since the mid 70s).

I'm sorry, my posts above are snappy and they needn't have been.

As you can tell, the "We'll stand alone again" crap really does annoy me quite a lot.

They would be forced to integrate into the state school system and sell off land and buildings apparently?

Why is this a good idea?

If those who can afford it opt out of the state system surely that is a good thing?

@Bearbehind, didn't work out so well with all those Old Etonians running the country now, but what do I know...

PerkingFaintly, that's my own sensitivities then smelling a potential insult. Thanks for the clarification & sorry. "Little Englanders" may have had no choice for generations but to be in one little place. I seem to be reminded of the advantage of having an inter-regional family just lately. @Songsofexperience thanks for restoring my faith in the Cymru.

BearBehind, having the richest opt out into private ensures the creation and maintenance of a separate and separatist elite, whereas if we want a 'One Nation' identity and mentality we need people to mix.

having the richest opt out into private ensures the creation and maintenance of a separate and separatist elite, whereas if we want a 'One Nation' identity and mentality we need people to mix.

But economically that doesn’t work

Social mixing requires bussing. Plenty of data on that from across the pond.

Private schools are not charities. They should charge VAT, employ qualified staff, be subject to the same inspection regime and National Curriculum as state schools, and a quota for them at all universities of their proportion of A-Level candidates plus x% would be a good idea.

Beyond that, no problem with them.

Labour are clearly too busy shooting themselves in the feet to care about being the opposition
so so stupid

But economically that doesn’t work

?? You'll have to explain that. And even then, if 'economically' it does not work - given that socially, creating isolated groups each with their own identity works even less, we'd have to make a choice or come to a compromise-that-pleases-no-one.

dark name one country that has a ‘one nation’ philosophy, that you’d aspire to be like?

More questions for BJ to avoid over public money awared to "Close Friend":

TRIGGER WARNING: BLONDE WITH BIG TITS ALERT

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/22/boris-johnson-urged-to-justify-awarding-public-funds-to-close-friend-jennifer-arcuri

I'm not sure that other nations have a 'one nation' philosophy as such, I picked up the phrase from here. However there are plenty of EU countries that are less unequal than ours. Why not explain what you mean by 'economically does not work'?

How can it ever be sustainable to for everyone to use state education for example?

Where does the money to fund it come from?

Because if you force all those who are better off to give it all up, they won’t bother working for it and then what?

There are other countries that do not have private education. Everyone does use state education. Finland comes to mind.

This is why other EU countries don't need a 'one nation' philosophy - because they just are one nation. The inequality isn't there to overcome.

If you have a nation governed by class system, where it is obvious to those of us born with less advantage that there is no point in even trying to work for it, what then?

But how do you actually overcome the inequality?

It’s very idealistic but it doesn’t actually work in practice without reforming our entire tax system.

Simply banning state schools is just ridiculous,

There are other countries that do not have private education. Everyone does use state education. Finland comes to mind.
Um no, the rich send their kids to private schools all around the world
particularly the UK !

The inequality isn't there to overcome.
Yeah right

where it is obvious to those of us born with less advantage that there is no point in even trying to work for it, what then?

Well the answer certainly isn’t making those who are more advantaged feel the same otherwise no one is working.

Finland is equal .... except its not ....
www.helsinkitimes.fi/finland/finland-news/domestic/15590-richest-10-hold-almost-50-of-wealth-in-finland.html

Oh dear, more politicians putting ideology ahead of reality to fuck up our education system. How are they going to implement that in this area? It isn’t all like Eton. Many private schools provide options to parents whose children have needs other than social exclusivity. In this area 30% of children are privately educated and it isn’t entirely accounted for by affluence, or a wish for social exclusivity or even special educational needs, though that is a factor too. Indeed if the number of children going to private schools was actually the average for areas of equivalent affluence then it would require two more 5 form entry secondary schools, let alone how many new state schools would be needed if they emptied out the private ones. The reasons for such high numbers going private are that there are a high proportion of exclusive faith places that 90% of the families cannot access (two fifths in some areas), that the LEA have long had a strategy of maximising budgetary efficiency by having less places than applicants so that they can guarantee every school is at capacity (and has been censored for it by the audit office) so that black holes of provision have emerged which means parents have to move or go private to get a school place and because two state schools were given to an overseas sponsor with a bizarre experimental educational s approach (strangely endorsed by OFSTED until it became blatantly obvious exam results were through the floor). I do agree that private schools should lose charitable status and be required to do a lot more to contribute to the state sector but then many private schools in this area actually do have including as many pupils from poorer backgrounds as possible written into their traditions and ethos, and share resources and run joint programmes such as revision, sixth formers mentoring GCSE students etc. Handing it all back to an LEA who local parents have no faith in. I don’t much like the Free School programme but it was only through parents setting up a free school locally that we were saved from a situation where hundreds of pupils for whom private education was not an option would have had no school place.

Are they also going to force the Catholic and other exclusive faith schools to sell off their buildings and integrate into the inclusive state system? The Catholic Schools in this area are so exclusive that they actively market themselves as quasi private schools with admissions criteria that effectively exclude anyone without the resources to plan to meet them from conception (though at least now they have been stopped from requiring you to clean the silver ) . Some of them manage to have only 1% of their pupils on Free School meals (average nationally is 10%) and a proportion of BME pupils way below that in the surrounding area (whilst the private schools actually have a greater proportion of BME pupils than the surrounding area as a result of families being more prepared to make the sacrifices necessary)

Finland has a state education system which respects its teachers and gives them autonomy to tailor education to the needs of the child. No tests or exams until 16 when pupils get selected for two equally respected streams of education, vocational and academic. It is a system that parents can have faith in to meet their child’s needs and realise their potential wherever that lies.