Westminstenders: Silly Season

[RedToothBrush]

It's that time of year again when politicians seem to completely lose their marbles in order to impress the faithful. And it is beginning to feel like conference season is increasingly an exercise in religious ferver to the party rather than considering what's in the best interests of the whole country.

Labour have got off to a good start before their conference opens, by almost starting complete melt down.

The Tories have promised to break from convention and try and over shadow the others, so that's something to look forward to.

And early this week we have the supreme Court ruling which could, regardless of which direction it swings, have massive ramifications for our democracy.

Big week ahead.

Sorry forgot map.

Funny yellow bit where you might not expect based on ref result.

We were yellow until the last election. I'd think we'd go back that way next time.

And were remain.

Hannah Al-Othman @hannahalothman
This leaflet showing a laser weapon destroying @JewishLabour was distributed inside the conference centre at #Lab19.

I'm looking forward to this year's Tory leaflets though are always a treat too.

I too remember the Cabinets of ministers who had served in WW2; some like Ted Heath had even volunteered to fight fascism in Spain, years before then

One of the most unpleasant things I've seen politically was in the run up to the first leg of the Gulf war, on a QT special. Ted Heath and Tony Benn were putting the case for anything but war together, and a younger lady (30s) stood up and called them cowards and traitors. Dimbleby had to point out that they had both served in WW2 - with distinction - and whilst they might be many things they weren't cowards. Sadly he did not go on to point out that she had never served, was was never going to (there is a lower limit on intelligence in all the UK armed forces, after all) and since by her own admission she wasn't a mother, neither would her sons serve either.

But I thought it anyway.

I was doing the dishes and listening to this week old podcast www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0008ght
But had to give up when (around 20’ in) S Barkley started making excuses about the lies of BJ and the fact that Turks were NOT at the gates ready to flood our hospital wards was not quite important, because...truth or not truth, that discussion was 3 years ago
Bastard
Superbastard
I can’t stand his voice and his accent on a normal day, but now I really have a blood pressure spike....

Yes, DG Those who served in WW2 seemed mostly far less enthusiastic about starting new wars than those who had never heard a shot fired

Noticeably less keen even than those who had served in NI or the US "Wars against Terror"

• imo, a big difference to those who fought in WW2 continuously for several years with only short breaks, while the Uk was bleeding centuries of accumulated wealth and several 100,000s of casualties in a desperate struggle not to be conquered

Quite different to "peacekeeping missions", or wanting to conquer someone else, however good the intentions
and with orders of magnitude fewer firefights and deaths

Tony Benn was too young to serve in WW2. He joined the RAF in 1945.

Ted Heath was a tank commander who pulled his crew-member from the destroyed vehicle and won the military cross. Willie Whitelaw was also a tankie and also won an MC.

Denis Healy was a beach-master during the Anzio Landings. James Callaghan served on aircraft carriers in the Pacific after fight the ealrier refusal to let him join the Navy on the grounds that his role as a trade union official was a reserved occupation.

Tony Benn was too young to serve in WW2. He joined the RAF in 1945.

No he wasn’t - he was born in 1925 and joined the RAF in July 1943, becoming a pilot in March 1945.

I suspect WW2 being such a total war for the whole country (empire) made a huge difference. The US had Vietnam, but a lot of the privileged avoided the draft, and it didn't threaten the US homeland.

Benn was in the Home Guard. He enlisted in the RAF and trained as a pilot. He did not see active service until after VE Day.

I was being a bit flippant but the Booths car parks that I am familiar with are filled with large 4 by 4s driven by the wealthy families and the retired who have moved to the country in search of the Farrow and Ball lifestyle, and they are always busy. I suspect the market they should expand to are the Thirsks Helmsleys and Richmond’s. The area the estate agents call “the golden triangle”. On polling day for the last local elections I was in that area and I was held up by huge 4 by 4s blocking the road outside the polling stations, I was surprised to see they were driven by baby boomers wearing the check shirts and red trousers of the stereotype more associated with Chipping Norton. I think the demographic in Booths may be different around Manchester. However my main point is that the stereotypes around the North / South divide that the media like to promulgate do not apply. The demographics are far more complicated than that.

I was quite amused to see that Julian Smith was one of the MPs the Guardian regarded as most likely to jump ship since his constituency, Skipton and Ripon is right in the middle of that territory. Finding themselves with a libdem MP would really cause some heart attacks. (Skipton did used to return a Libdem way back but boundary changes have wiped out their vote)

And by the way I love Booths too, and my deep attraction to their cheese counter probably puts me in the demographic you describe Red

It's certainly true that there are wealthy middle classes in the north, who are often lacking in self awareness (or awareness of comparisons) and quite prejudiced with it. We are dealing with a country of 65 million people, and the media pushes far too many simplicities for comfort. There is such a thing as general trends, but they need to be labelled as such and used carefully.

The impact of the Wars cannot be understated and all went towards greater awareness of each other I think. I've been thinking about the reduction of geographical mobility in recent years - War involved people from many different regions moving all over the place and coming in to contact. Britain is still astonishingly regional [PMK].

Benn was in the Home Guard

At age 16 he was. At age 18 (in 1943) he joined the RAF as an aircraftman. He was posted to Southern Africa and then to the Middle East. Qualified as a pilot in March 1945 and transferred to the Fleet Air Arm but didn’t see active service as a pilot before VJ Day.

Two years war time service counts, doesn’t it?

Another big swing in local by elections for Lib Dem's. About the 5th in a row now I think with 20-35% gains.

PMK

Met a ranty bloke from Croydon today who has joined the LibDems as they are the only party who will stop Brexit.
Not what I expected him to say

The RAF set up pilot training schools in the then British colony of Rhodesia (now Zimbabwe), so that might be why Benn was in southern Africa.

zimfieldguide.com/harare/rhodesia-air-training-group-ratg-1940-–-1945-and-statistics-fatalities-commonwealth-war

The Rhodesia Air Training Group created a legacy of pilots who returned to Rhodesia/Zim to settle after WWII, and of unexpectedly good small airfields and flying schools there.

Just another of those things known to those of us closely connected to former Empire countries, and largely unknown to the little Englanders.

...which of course you mention in the spirit of awareness of their disadvantage, rather than any feeling of superiority by virtue of your advantages.

Perking think Benn qualified as a Spitfire pilot?

Yeah, for every knutsford there’s a skipton or Richmond- a place where the wealthy retire to. Lots of them lovely people but only if you’re the right sort of person. The people who swing the vote for our awful ERG MP are not living in the deprived areas of our constituency but in the semi-rural outskirts. All the beautiful old stone houses on the hill (that go for £1000,000+) have big conservative signs outside come election time. Ditto the local sheep farmers (who contrary to Gods own country which was bollocks are doing alright for themselves).

Was that at me? Not sure I follow?

I mention it in the spirit of your own statement of, "The impact of the Wars cannot be understated and all went towards greater awareness of each other I think." With which I completely agree.

It annoys the crap out of me that so many people dedicatedly ignore the evidence right in front of them of the (now) Commonwealth involvement in the World Wars, despite merrily watching Gallipoli, or Tenko or African Queen. And despite knowing there are all these English-speaking countries round the world, and all these Indian names on war memorials in the UK. And despite the fact that most UK families have, in my experience, at least one family member in a Commonwealth country... but the penny still doesn't drop with them that these countries contributed to the UK war effort.

I don't feel superior. Why would I? I don't even understand that. I feel pissed off at people who bury their head in the naice rich English loam and blithely make claims of "the UK standing alone."

I mean "Little Englander" as a state of mind: people who see in front of them UK involvement in other countries... but choose to ignore it.

Just spotted this, another proof that brexit really is exclusively an English project:

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/sep/22/english-people-wales-brexit-research