Westminstenders: Drain The Swamp

[RedToothBrush]

Johnson lost his first vote by 27.

The Commons take control again, and Johnson is now, with his majority gone, is seeking an election.

Whilst the feeling might be one of victory there is a definite sting in the tail.

Johnson has purged the party of 'trouble makers', meaning any replacements after an election are hard liners. And they will be in safe seats. Possibly many of which will be careerists parachuted in.

The party has split. The civil war is over.

Parliament has just lost some of its very best minds in the process. That bodes ill for us all in the long term. The polarisation has just jacked up a level. The centre has fallen even more.

There are no more moderates.

Polling suggests that Johnson won't be blamed for any of this and that's significant.

Take note of this tweet

Douglas Carswell @Douglascarswell
Boris Vs the political Parasites. Guess who wins across suburban Britain?

The optics are not about what you or I are seeing. Nor about what any of the politicial pundits are seeing.

The Democrats and the Media failed to see Trump coming... And this is what now concerns me. His optics are not bad with his core and targets.

Will Johnson be able to have his election?

If yes, I fear the polls look good for Johnson. People want 'Brexit over with' and don't want another extension. They may or may not understand the ramifications of that.

If no, then what? Johnson can do anything with his numbers. Does that mean potentially two governments and the Queen stuck in the middle? Or does he limp on, with no intention of doing anything but take us over the cliff by counting down the clock?

Or something else?

The Brexit Party and Conservatives now seem to have formally united one way or another. They have aligned with current politics alike the divided Opposition parties.

Tonight the penny might have dropped with a few Labour MPs too. They want May's deal to return. Its the only deal there is, in the absence of a Johnson plan and a Labour / Opposition plan. Too little too late...

This isn't going away as an issue either. Stoking up anger against the rebel alliance is a long term project for the fascist right.

Is tonight’s result a victory? Yes, but my fear is its potential to be a Pyrrhic Victory.

The battle today may have been won, but Johnson still looks set to win...

!!!!

MPs agree amendment to Benn bill to put cross-party version of May's deal back on table
MPs started voting on Stephen Kinnock’s amendment 6. But then, a few minutes into voting, Lindsay Hoyle, announced that the division had been called off because the amendment had been passed - because MPs opposed to it did not put up tellers.

Here is the explanation of what the Kinnock amendment does.

This amendment would set out as the purpose of seeking an extension under article 50(3) TEU the passage of a withdrawal agreement bill based on the outcome of the inter-party talks which concluded in May 2019 – see NC1 for contents of the Bill and Amendment XX for text of the request letter to the European Council.

This means that, if the PM needs to request an article 50 extension (because he has not negotiated a new deal, and MPs have not voted to approve a no-deal Brexit), then getting an extension to pass a version of the Theresa May deal becomes government policy.

Effectively, that means that any Brexit delay would not be a blind delay; it would be a delay to enable a version of the Theresa May going through.

It is not clear whether this has passed by accident - or as a result of some cunning plot.

Bloody hell. Gary Gibbon on C4 saying the Government have pulled a fast one and killed the Bill by accidentally on purpose letting the Kinnock amendment go through.

Ooh have they purposely nor put any tellers up for some reason?

I think yesterday's phrase of 'Da Fuq?' comes back into play!

Another vote on the WA...yes, we are going back in time.
Predicted but without the BlowjobCum rebranding we suspected. Maybe this is the only way Tories can save face?

Not forgetting that even if the rebel alliance were to do that, at some point in the near future we have a GE. And if the Tories win the opportunity to sabotage large chucks of close alignment is possible and likely. Indeed I suspect Johnson would go full on trump as the chances are a Tory win means a majority for the tories / brexit party.

As I said some time ago, I fear that ship has sailed.

The fanatical side of Brexiteers means than even if we remain this issue isn't going away either. It will be at every election for the next couple of decades.

Leaving now is about close alignment with the US and politics that go hand in hand with that.
RTB

It has always been about an elite allying with US vulture capitalists to carve up the UK for profit and remake society and the economy in a (profitable) libertarian image. They want full on economic slash and burn. The reality of a negotiated leaving agreement is that is forms the basis of further trade talks. No deal means no basis for further negotiation. It means taking years to establish basic groundwork on which trade talks can be developed. Along with their American friends, they seek not friendly trade with the EU but its destruction.

I suspect there will be a realignment within English politics - a Tory/Brexit libertarian party, a conservative (small c) party consisting of LibDems and people like Hammond, and Labour.

Scotland and NI will of course have their own political dynamic, and if Wales wakes up then Wales will too.

NI currently has the closest reflection of American political stances on the popular level (i.e. broadly fundamentalist/libertarian vs right of spectrum 'Christian Democrat') naturally enough, since the links between the two strands of politics in NI are literally in the DNA of America - the Ulster Scot immigrants' descendants in the South and Appalachia and the Rust Belt (where they migrated for jobs during WW2 and the post war period) tend to be Trump's Christian fundamentalist supporters. The causes dear to the heart of US fundamentalists tend to be espoused by the DUP - creationism, etc. There are strong links on the level of organised religion between fundamentalist Christians in NI and in the US.

I agree with you, RTB, that Brexit will dominate British politics for generations even if - perhaps especially if the UK manages to remain either in the EU - merely closely aligned with the EU. So will the issues being used to keep voters angry enough to vote for it.

As a result, English politics may well come to feature some of the overtly religious preoccupation of NI, but at the moment other hot buttons are being waved in front of the populace by a capitalist elite seeking appreciation and acceptance from the Fat Cat Club across the water.

The opening engagements of a culture war have already occurred but they are the smoke and mirrors element of the real war that will be fought in terms of tariffs and gunboat diplomacy when needed.

I think the Kinnock amendment automatically passed because there were no ‘No’ tellers (ie no one came forward to defend against it?)

Exactly what the Kinnock amendment is though I’m less clear on, even having had the debates on in the background all day

Finally found you!

So the WA is in theory back on the table?

Given that it's one of three viable options, I think that's a good thing.

Parly @parlyapp
It appears there were no ‘no’ tellers in place for the Kinnock amendment and therefore it passed.

oubliette , I used to be in Bedford, moved just outside to Burtland and now live next to Kempston but in Dorrieswood.

?

Tbf I think that binds BlowJob as much as it stymies the bill here. The WA will need to be signed if we escape no deal anyway. The cross party element stops blowjob ripping it up. It's not a total win or loss for either.

I'm lost. 🍷

Cross posted with everyone, thanks to Mship for explanation

So - now the stop-no-Brexit Bill has becomes the stop-no-Brexit-and-pass-a-deal bill - so will the remain/revokers still support it??

Ian Dunt@iandunt
Lot's of confusions atm. Not clear if Kinnock amendment definitely passed, although it seems so. Not clear if it was an accident, or a govt trick. Either way, this is bad.

The Kinnock amendment does not stop the extension provision in the bill, it simply says that the extension must be to give MPs another chance to vote on May's deal.

Govt. dirty tricks lets young Kinnock's amendment pass.

Having previously 'accidentally' ratted on a pairing deal with a pregnant Jo Swinson, you wouldn't put it past this lot to accidentally miscount a vote.

...The Ayes to the right, 320
The Nos to the left, four million and nine...

oubliette, I ran out of my house to accost Mayor Dave a few weeks ago about planning!!

Cwenthryth thanks, I should've credited the guardian live blog.

Sam Coates Sky @samcoatessky
Rebel alliance clearly dismayed by passing of Kinnock amendment. Nobody sure how binding it is. Everyone urgently trying to work out how serious this is for their plan.

Chris Jones @ chrisjones_1
Lords can get rid of it

Sam Coates Sky @samcoatessky
Yes potentially but that needs more stages in the Commons too and time is tight

Suspect it's a government ploy and this is to do with it. Timing means they need to get things through otherwise whole bill screwed.

"any extension has to be used to bring back a Brexit deal, ie not to hold a second referendum or to repeal Brexit. That’ll annoy Labour MPs"

It might help unite the Lexiters within Labour, who certainly don't want a PV or Remain

Labour's objections to the WA always seemed just party political to me, not genuine
e.g. Corbyn certainly supports a reunited Ireland