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Brexit

Westminstenders: Drain The Swamp

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 23:23

Johnson lost his first vote by 27.

The Commons take control again, and Johnson is now, with his majority gone, is seeking an election.

Whilst the feeling might be one of victory there is a definite sting in the tail.

Johnson has purged the party of 'trouble makers', meaning any replacements after an election are hard liners. And they will be in safe seats. Possibly many of which will be careerists parachuted in.

The party has split. The civil war is over.

Parliament has just lost some of its very best minds in the process. That bodes ill for us all in the long term. The polarisation has just jacked up a level. The centre has fallen even more.

There are no more moderates.

Polling suggests that Johnson won't be blamed for any of this and that's significant.

Take note of this tweet

Douglas Carswell @Douglascarswell
Boris Vs the political Parasites. Guess who wins across suburban Britain?

The optics are not about what you or I are seeing. Nor about what any of the politicial pundits are seeing.

The Democrats and the Media failed to see Trump coming... And this is what now concerns me. His optics are not bad with his core and targets.

Will Johnson be able to have his election?

If yes, I fear the polls look good for Johnson. People want 'Brexit over with' and don't want another extension. They may or may not understand the ramifications of that.

If no, then what? Johnson can do anything with his numbers. Does that mean potentially two governments and the Queen stuck in the middle? Or does he limp on, with no intention of doing anything but take us over the cliff by counting down the clock?

Or something else?

The Brexit Party and Conservatives now seem to have formally united one way or another. They have aligned with current politics alike the divided Opposition parties.

Tonight the penny might have dropped with a few Labour MPs too. They want May's deal to return. Its the only deal there is, in the absence of a Johnson plan and a Labour / Opposition plan. Too little too late...

This isn't going away as an issue either. Stoking up anger against the rebel alliance is a long term project for the fascist right.

Is tonight’s result a victory? Yes, but my fear is its potential to be a Pyrrhic Victory.

The battle today may have been won, but Johnson still looks set to win...

OP posts:
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27
Basilpots · 04/09/2019 16:13

@Cherrypi I’m currently being love bombed on YouTube Angry

AutumnCrow · 04/09/2019 16:15

The ship was lost for a ha'peth of Keir

prettybird · 04/09/2019 16:16

So how does one win against that?

You get out and pound the streets and talk to, not down, to people. Listen to their concerns. We don't take anyone for granted. (like Hilary did with the Rust Belt Sad) Hard work. Activists on the ground. Not just money on social media - which is going to be hard to counteract due to the lack of transparency Sad Sheer slog, shoe leather and sweat.

Dh has already told me that I'll need to get my walking shoes on! Grin

LyraParry · 04/09/2019 16:22

Any ideas what time the vote on this is expected? Sorry if it has already been mentioned - I've been at work and don't have a hope of catching up on the whole thread.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 04/09/2019 16:24

The first vote is due around 5pm.

AutumnNymph · 04/09/2019 16:27

OMG i just fell a little bit i love with Nicholas Soames.

MockersthefeMANist · 04/09/2019 16:27

Awww, Nick Soames

Like watching an old bull elephant stagger off into the forest to die.

AutumnCrow · 04/09/2019 16:28

Nicholas Soames looks so sad. What a shity way for Johnson to have ended his 37 year run in the House (whatever Party they are).

Myriade · 04/09/2019 16:31

To be fair, I have utmost respect for the MPs who have put their whole political career on the line when they voted against BJ.

They gave me a renewed respect for (some) politicians and the system overall. And a little bit of hope that not everything is lost.

prettybird · 04/09/2019 16:32

The Cherry (et al) case is interesting. I'm no lawyer, but my impression was that it was always a stretch: trying to prove the intent of the prorogation was for more than to prepare for the Queens Speech - even if we all know that the length of it was to frustrate effective opposition within Parliament. The messages from the Government were all too well rehearsed, with the consistent "only 4 more days than the Party Conference recess" and the deliberate obfuscation that all other Parliamentary business is also stopped - even if you overlook that the recess wasn't necessarily going to happen Hmm.

....now if they slipped up and put any of that planning in writing where it can be discovered then that is a different matter Grin

DGRossetti · 04/09/2019 16:35

Private Eye has some inside goss on the prorogation this issue. Seems like Her Madge advised Boris the best way to dress it up as "normal".

Make of that what you will.

MmeBufo · 04/09/2019 16:36

Are we expecting more Tory rebels today, as hinted at by Soames on newsnight? I've seen no suggestion of it on twitter

LonelyTiredandLow · 04/09/2019 16:38

Bit off topic but when JRM said in HoC that the day he heard of proroguing he "had to get a flight" and something about watching tennis (?) I thought - so he remembers that and that should be easy to find out about...journo's don't seem to be finding out more despite the leads.

YouGov survey was all about left leaning papers - FT, Guardian, Times (recently at least) etc. Red I think they are going to clamp down on the online and free source docs somehow. The q on Cummings made me understand who was asking Wink

prettybird · 04/09/2019 16:41

Of course, whether her Madge did or didn't give BlowJobCum any such advice can never be confirmed or denied. Since what is said is always in complete confidence. Confused

Seems that such "inside goss" serves BlowJob more than it does her Madge, as he wins either way Hmm

ListeningQuietly · 04/09/2019 16:46

It will be interesting to watch the votes tonight

from the other side of the world

sadly I have to watch it from within the affected country Sad Angry

merrymouse · 04/09/2019 16:47

Private Eye has some inside goss on the prorogation this issue. Seems like Her Madge advised Boris the best way to dress it up as "normal".

We'll find out in series 7 of the Crown.

Cwenthryth · 04/09/2019 16:47

The q on Cummings made me understand who was asking
Can you elaborate a bit - do you mean the female Tory (sorry can’t remember name) who quoted ?Thatcher ‘advisers advise, ministers decide’ referencing Cumming? Do you mean she was representing other specific interests when she asked that qu?

As a slight tangent, I thought that the purgees would be on the other benches now. Although then I see Frank Field still sits in the middle of the Labour benches. Is there any official rules on where MPs sit or is it all convention, which in these topsy turvy times is just out the window?

RedToothBrush · 04/09/2019 16:49

I'm watching BBC news.

They just talked about the Tory MP for North thanet being appalled at how Greg Clark in particular had been treated (but also the other Rebels). He has apparently said 'the government can't take his vote for granted'. Which is fighting talk.

There were comments that said he wasn't alone in this vote.

I think the way Nick Soames has been treated is particularly awful if you consider his close friendship with Johnson. It's the utter ruthlessness of the man - especially since Soames had already previously hinted he was unlikely to stand for reelection and his constituency had already been looking for his successor.

It was a show trial last night and I think many Tories realise this.

Indeed Stewart has said today, what's the point in parliament if you can't disagree in a party? Why have parliament at all?

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MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 04/09/2019 16:50

The rebels all seem to be gathered at the Speaker's end of the Tory benches - there's probably not room for them all on the other side Grin

It's interesting to watch the dynamic - there seems to be a strong sense of camaraderie among them today.

LyraParry · 04/09/2019 16:50

Thanks ohyoubadkitten. I have a meeting at 6pm so I'm glad this vote is before then. Then hopefully the next one will be after my meeting is finished!

BigChocFrenzy · 04/09/2019 16:56

I'm not sure if HoC seating can properly handle a minority govt

MeganBacon · 04/09/2019 16:58

I would be cautious feeling too sorry for Soames. I am old enough to remember him as the man for whom the word gaslighting may have been invented given his leaks about princess diana on behalf of Charles. Horrid man.

BigChocFrenzy · 04/09/2019 16:58

If there is a GE this year,
I expect to see SNP, Labour and other Opposition party posters featuring That Photo of JRM stretched along the HoC bench Grin

AutumnCrow · 04/09/2019 16:59

I wonder if Javid feels any sense of shame or peril? When you sup with the devil ...

prettybird · 04/09/2019 17:01

I notice that Ken Clarke is still sitting in his usual seat in the middle, beside that other well-known rebel Theresa May Wink

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