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Brexit

Westminstenders: 30 days to save us all!

970 replies

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 00:28

It's quite remarkable to watch the British press atm.

It's like it doesn't understand English. Well only if its English spoken by foreigners.

Merkel made the observation that the UK had spent two years looking at the Irish border but had failed to come up with a workable solution, and now Johnson has waltzed in and made statements about how the backstop must go, and only has 30 days in which this can be achieved.

The British press writes this up as Merkel giving the UK a deadline to come up with a new solution.

Which is nonsense. The UK have a deadline to save itself, from itself and that's 31st October. This is a self imposed deadline.

Meanwhile comes out with the Brexiteer smack down that he didn't think the UK wS leaving the EU to regain its sovereignty only to become a vassalage or junior partner to the US.

Both these ideas being the result of leaving the EU have long been key issues. From before the ref. Both have been the UK's to solve in order to get the terms the UK wants from a deal.

The referendum was about choosing to align with the EU or to ditch that and rights and align closely with the US. Then Trump happened and the sell on this got harder, but still essentially the same. And it continues.

And then there was the Irish border. The magic solution to Brexit that doesn't break the GFA. I personally think there isn't one as long as the DUP have their red lines about the Irish sea.

So here we are. More than 3 years after the ref.

Leavers still have no plan. Apart for charge headlong over the cliff. Remains still have their heads wedged up their own backsides and also, after spending months criticising every one else on social media anyway who makes a stand again this bull shit.

Yet the newspapers fail to report what Merkel said or why the UK has this issue in the first place. Its an ongoing exercise in national delusion and self denial.

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woman19 · 23/08/2019 14:35

I fed my tomato plants' soil old banana skins, I can't remember where I saw it recommended, but they seemed to get happy on them.

theoriginalmadambee · 23/08/2019 14:36

Oh thank you listening will try that straight away. My tomatoes have behaved really weird this year. Three kinds of apples have not given anything, but one appletree is giving more than normally. #feelingpersecuted# Grin.

NoWordForFluffy · 23/08/2019 14:47

Many people have slow-ripening tomatoes this year according to an allotment Facebook group I'm a member of. I've no shortage of bees to pollinate, we've just had a very wet / dull August so far to ripen!

There's bees the size of aircraft at the allotment. HUGE bastard things.

DGRossetti · 23/08/2019 15:00

Looks like the UK avoided this initiative to protect against Trumps WTO shakedown just in time ...

www.theregister.co.uk/2019/08/23/eu_plots_100bn_tech_fund_to_fight_us_giants/

...

Officials also want to shake up trade rules in the expectation that Trump will withdraw from the World Trade Organisation. The changes would allow the EU to quickly add tariffs to US products without waiting for WTO rulings. It also suggests tougher rules for Chinese companies tendering for contracts in Europe to take account of government subsidies those companies enjoy from Beijing.
...

I've repeatedly tried to highlight that nothing stands still, and the biggest danger to/from Brexit is that by the time it's finally done and dusted, the "EU" that we have managed to extricate ourselves from will look nothing like the "EU" that leavers felt they had to leave.

Note that the UK will have zero say in any of the above, and can just look forward to signing whatever comes our way.

Wenttoseainasieve · 23/08/2019 15:03

Those of us up north are in for a treat post no-deal Brexit, as the south's rubbish is foisted upon us because it can't be sent for treatment at EU processing plants anymore.

Another thing to look forward to!

woman19 · 23/08/2019 15:07

Ah well fluffy. Must be the sun and heat. It's been a steady 20-30 degrees here since May. I gave some baby plants to friends who've grown them on inside, and had loads of ripened toms: the plants are dying away now. Maybe british toms are happier by windows inside?

bellinisurge · 23/08/2019 15:14

@FractalChaos , the author has his own YouTube channel. He's been doing tbe channel since he was a young teenager. He's brilliant. Also Liz Zorad/Byther Farm on YouTube. She's brill too. And UK Herewegrow.

bellinisurge · 23/08/2019 15:15

Zorab not Zorad!

Defenbaker · 23/08/2019 15:18

@prettybird - ah, that makes sense, thanks for clarifying. I agree, the media is painting things in a positive light, and if we hadn't witnessed the previous 3 years of negotiations maybe we'd be falling for it. The EU leaders are probably humouring Bojo a bit, in much the same way as an indulgent parent does, when their child is determined to do something impossible, e.g "Oh, so you want to be Superman when you grow up, and fly across the sky like a bird? That's good darling." Then they sit back and wait for the child to realise the reality.

Then again, maybe those EU leaders will blink, as they also have much to lose if we crash out with no deal. I hope Bojo and co. can come up with something workable, but won't hold my breath. Hope for the best, plan for the worst, and maybe there will be a silver lining to the huge black cloud hanging over us. Maybe the problems caused by leaving with no deal will force the UK govt and industries will work together to invest in UK farming and energy/water infrastructure, so that long term we will be in better shape as time goes on.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 15:20

Fraser Nelson @frasernelson
Britain, like Iceland, will thrive outside the EU says its former Prime Minister
www.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-britain-like-iceland-will-thrive-outside-the-eu/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
Why Britain, like Iceland, will thrive outside the EU
The UK should become a temporary member of the EEA

If Iceland, while outside the EU, can achieve the highest level of growth of any western nation so soon after the collapse of its banking system and public finances, then I’m sure that a post-Brexit Britain — the world’s fifth-largest economy — can prosper, too. Nevertheless, there will certainly be some negative short-term consequences from leaving the EU. What can you do to avoid them?

Hot take from The Speccy from a PM where the amount you owe on your mortgage can go up even if you keep up with your repayments fully and has utterly fucked most normal icelanders

icelandweatherreport.com/iceland-six-years-after-the-meltdown/
September 29, 2014
Iceland, Six Years After The Meltdown

Do read this article it's a shocker (blogger is a very respected freelance journalist who has written for lots of newspapers around the world)

Also this
icelandweatherreport.com/emergency-in-the-icelandic-medical-sector/
September 30, 2013
Emergency In The Icelandic Medical Sector

This is probably not far off what is planned for the UK Post Brexit.

Indeed Farage has referenced Iceland's success in the last couple of weeks.

It's remarkable how the British press have covered the Icelandic crisis as some sort of victory for little people and ignored how many people lost their homes because of it or faced real hardship and continue to do so.

Also this guy has cost British taxpayers a lot of money...

This guy is this guy:
Sigmundur Davíð first rose to prominence in Iceland as a spokesperson for the InDefence movement, which fought foreign creditors' attempts to make Iceland pay £2.3 billion in compensation to the United Kingdom and the Netherlands following the collapse and subsequent nationalisation of Iceland's three banks. As Eirikur Bergmann wrote in The Guardian, "This was the most serious diplomatic crisis the country had ever fought and Gunnlaugsson was at the forefront of it."[6] He and his wife Anna Sigurlaug Pálsdóttir already owned the offshore company Wintris at the time, having bought it in 2007 from Mossack Fonseca through the Luxembourg branch of Landsbanki and registered it in the British Virgin Islands.

Landsbanki was the parent company of Icesave.

When Icesave went bust there was a big diplomatic row over who should foot the bill.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icesave_dispute

All those with assets in the bank in the Netherlands and UK were screwed. The Netherlands and UK tried to get Iceland to pay up the money, so he led the movement not to. (Can't think why myself as will become apparent). In the end UK and Dutch taxpayers ended up balling out British and Dutch investors who were screwed over in the collapse.

It later came out how he had a massive personal interest in this and how he was in part responsible for the collapse in the first place.

When the interviewer asked if he had any connections to a foreign company, he replied that his financial assets had always been reported transparently. When asked specifically about his connections to Wintris, a foreign company and a creditor of failed Icelandic banks, he said he had disclosed all requested information to the government and was unsure how the transactions actually worked.[21] Sigmundur Davíð then said the interviewer was making something suspicious out of nothing, and walked out of the interview.[22][24] He and his wife both made public statements about "journalist encroachment in their private lives" and insisted their disclosures were complete

News coverage of the release of the Panama Papers had revealed that he and his wife shared ownership of Wintris, bought to invest his wife's inheritance, and also that Sigmundur Davíð had failed to disclose his 50% share when he entered the parliament in 2009. Eight months later, he sold his share of the company to his wife for one US Dollar, the day before a new law took effect that would have required him to disclose his ownership as a conflict of interest.

When all this came to light he eventually resigned as prime minister.

Of course he and all the others responsible for the banks collapse in the first place were never prosecuted. No one ever has been.

In the Spectator article above he talks with pride about how he led Iceland to end its plan to join the EU once and for all.

Of course part of the problem was how badly the country was (and still is) from the Icelandic banking crisis (which you will remember how well he did out of).

And now the EU are introducing much stricter laws about off shoring and money laundering...

Since his resignation as Prime Minister and loss of his party chairmanship, Sigmundur Davíð has repeatedly asserted that he was the victim of a global conspiracy to bring him down.[37] He has implied that George Soros, "banking elites", the Swedish public broadcaster, the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists and the Icelandic public broadcaster conspired against him.

It's funny though, that Speccy article doesn't ever refer to him as 'the disgraced former Icelandic prime minister' nor does it reference how he cost UK tax payers money whilst he banked his profits from it safety offshore. Nor does it Talk about he is effectively one of those dodgy bankers everyone loves to hate.

This is what disaster capitalism looks like and this is how the Spectator is presenting this crook to an audience who thinks that the Icelandic banking crisis was a walk in the park and everyone in Iceland lived happily ever after their lives dramatically inhanced.

Once again we have the offshoring, money laundering, corrupt crooks telling us how wonderful everything will be.

Once they've got their cut of course.

No Deal is probably going to be a lot like this. Only worse.

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Defenbaker · 23/08/2019 15:25

@Wenttoseainasieve - I posted about that upthread. I think we should build more processing plants to burn the waste as an energy source, rather than waste reources exporting our recycling waste. This will take time, but the process needs to begin now, with locating sites and finding the right investors to make it happen. We need to become as self sufficient as possible in every way to weather the Brexit/climate change storm that is coming.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 15:31

Oh and being in the EEA means accepting the Four Freedoms...

... Which we are busy rejecting.

So good work from this guy on knowing the British position and from the Speccy on knowing wtf the EEA is.

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AuldAlliance · 23/08/2019 15:35

@markgdayan on Twitter is a policy analyst who posts on the NHS, including the effects of Brexit.
Worth reading.

This from Feb.
And this from Aug 15th:

“Preparations to fly urgent medical supplies into the UK for a year after a no deal Brexit show the scale of disruption the Government is preparing for. In the circumstances, this new air service is a good idea. But the delays and extra paperwork that Brexit without an agreement will cause will still be there when the plane lands.

“There will be complicated new processes for customs and gaining permission to use these flights. Companies and suppliers will have to reroute all their supply lines overnight. Any teething problems that result will have a sharp impact on care as vital supplies that can’t last more than a few days become useless.”

DGRossetti · 23/08/2019 15:36

The problem is Iceland is quite an egalitarian society. The Bad Boys of Brexit haven't gone to all this time and trouble just to see the UK descend into a paradigm of social equality ... that's the last thing they want.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 15:39

DGR Iceland has a big problem with racism.

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DGRossetti · 23/08/2019 15:42

I posted about that upthread. I think we should build more processing plants to burn the waste as an energy source, rather than waste reources exporting our recycling waste. This will take time, but the process needs to begin now, with locating sites and finding the right investors to make it happen. We need to become as self sufficient as possible in every way to weather the Brexit/climate change storm that is coming.

Why do you think it hasn't happened already ? When you've answered that, you will then be equipped to answer why it isn't going to happen.

And burning shit isn't a magic bullet to climate change, it's just moving the problem around. The only way to "tackle" climate change is to adapt to it. Any attempt at influencing it is mere snake oil designed to dupe populations into measures that will be used to justify poverty as an environmental imperative, rather than an abnormal state of affairs. And with Brexit proving the exemplar of how easy it is to get turkeys to vote for Christmas, that will be the next battlefield of the polemic.

DGRossetti · 23/08/2019 15:46

DGR Iceland has a big problem with racism.

I'll pop that in my "today I learned" folder. Although I still maintain that pointing to Iceland as a reason for the UKs assured future does overlook the fact that unlike Iceland, the UK is governed by UK politicians (which is usually the reason for a lot things that aren't like "somewhere else" in the UK).

DGRossetti · 23/08/2019 15:48

Although I will also temper that by noting that you could fit all of Icelands population into Birmingham 3 times over, and still have some room left over.

prettybird · 23/08/2019 16:12

Some of the Icelandic bankers and businessmen (and a politician Shock) were jailed - I think it was the only country to do so Confused (Although if you see there prison, it's not exactly like the UK Victorian edifices, nor the the more modern ones) - and others were fined.

Iceland is quite contradictory - it is much more egalitarian than, say (Wink), the UK, as everyone knows everyone. However, because everyone knows everyone, it is quite incestuous and incomers (particularly those of different ethnicity) have difficulty integrating.

I was doing a lot of work with Iceland at the time (and had to persuade my company to continue the multi-million project it had just started and that Iceland would indeed pay its invoice when it was completed - which they did), so had many discussions with them and read a lot around the topic. Some of the resentment against the UK was justified as there were failings in our own FSA in not following proper due process in ensuring that the required reserves were in place for the subsidiaries within the EU/proper oversight into the ways the subsidiaries were being set up. And also a massive amount of resentment against Gordon Brown for using anti-terrorist legislation to freeze Icelandic assets, which they believe directly caused the collapse of 2 of the banks, which were in the process of re-financing. But mostly, there was resentment against c30 "Vikings" who had insider traded and shorted Iceland as a whole into the difficulties it found itself, for their personal benefit. Sound familiar? Sad

Ironically, I remember, in advance of the Kreppa (but having been pointed in that direction by my Icelandic contacts), reading about 2 other countries who were over-extending themselves and borrowing against their own assets in a dangerous way: but they were "too big to fail" Confused. Those 2 countries were the UK and Switzerland. Hmm

I can't find the articles I read then though as I saved them on to my work computer and it was over 10 years ago.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 16:14

KLAXON!

And now. Its time for a story about my favourite MP, Jared O'Mara....

order-order.com/2019/08/23/jared-omara-arrested-fraud/
Jared O'Mara arrested for fraud.

It is being reported that omnishambles MP Jared O’Mara was arrested last week on suspicion of fraud, alongside his office manager Gareth Arnold. One final success to add to his long list before he quits after recess…

According to the Mirror, Arnold contacted the police in early July regarding the concerns he had about O’Mara’s expenses claims. The two were released on Saturday evening pending further investigation. More on this as we get it…

And the original Mirror Story
www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/jared-omara-mp-arrested-suspicion-18992991
Jared O'Mara MP arrested on suspicion of fraud

EXCLUSIVE: It is understood police raided the MP's constituency office a week ago and he has since been released pending further investigation

The Mirror can also reveal Mr O'Mara has submitted paperwork for his resignation as an MP, dated for when Parliament returns in September.

YAY!

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RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 16:17

So a nice by-election in mid october I'm guessing....

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flouncyfanny · 23/08/2019 16:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

prettybird · 23/08/2019 16:21

David Koch has died.

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 16:45

David Koch has died.

Not many people I will say this about, but I'm not sorry.

The inheritance will be an interesting subject....

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BigChocFrenzy · 23/08/2019 16:54

< salutes analysis scoop by red >

Also your very interesting report on the should-be disgraced-but-isn't former Icelandic PM

As the size of an industrialised economy increases, its complexity increases even more rapidly

Iceland, pop 300,000 - it is difficult to take similar economic / financial solutions for
UK, pop 64,000,0000 and $2 trillion annual GDP

Also, remember when Greenland, pop 50,000 left the then EEC, negotiations took 3 years

  • and they weren't flouncing and insulting those they wanted to give them a good deal
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